75 replies to this topic

[umAhmad]

Peace evision, you mean to tell me that girls who do not cover their faces do not committ mischief?? Since it is hard to identify them, how do you know those are Muslim girls, it could be Non Muslim girls trying to give Muslim girls a bad name, maybe it is teenage boys trying to bother people, maybe , maybe, maybe...... I am sure there might be girls up to mischief but believe me most of us do not........ covering the face and walking out in the public needs a lot of gutts specially in Western Countries and those who do it do it out of the love of Allah and the Prophet Sallallahu Alaihi Wa Sallam and because we want to follow our beloved mothers and sisters, the wives of RasoolAllah Sallallahu alaihi Wa Sallam and the wives of the Companions of the prophet.

All those who do not cover themselves, which is a majority are causing a lot more mischief than you and I can imagine. If you ever come across a lady with a Niqaab doing something wrong, you should be strong enough to go and tell her with wisdom offcourse that "Sister you are dressed up like our beloved mothers but what you are doing is going to give a negative feeling about muslim Sisters, so you should stop it. Allah will bless you for that inshaAllah.

People have tried many times in the past and will be trying until the last day to bann the Niqaab, but inshaAllah women who wear it For the pleasure of Allah will not stop wearing it. If they are not allowed to go out with it, I can assure you they will stop going outside their homes completely or move from that country which imposes such weird rules.
May Allah guide all of us to do the right thing, ameen.

[Redeem]

Salam,

I think it is unislamic to cover the faces.

Were the wives of prophet Muhammad and the other early female Muslims acting unIslamic when they wore a Niqab?

[evision]

Were the wives of prophet Muhammad and the other early female Muslims acting unIslamic when they wore a Niqab?

Salam,

The prophet was born into a culture - may be he wore the clothes that other wore during his time; and may be he wore a turban over his head. They were very useful for fending off the desert sand and protecting the head and face from very high temperatures and strong sunlight. Since the prophet wore a turban you can not insist that it must be considered as an Islamic act and all the muslims in every part of the world must follow this system!! I hope you understand the point. You have to diferrenciate between what is custom and what is Islamic.

Wassalam

[disabled0335]

Salaams peeps,

So would wearing a turban be unIslamic? The claim that the niqab is unIslamic is quite a bold one, and the onus is on you to show that if it was worn by the wives of Rasoolullah saw it was a cultural choice and not religious one.

Peace

[Redeem]

Perhaps you should clarify what you mean by unIslamic beacuse it can mean two things.
1) Something that does not originate from Islam but is not necessarily a bad thing. I.e. driving cars.
2) Something that is contrary to the teachings of Islam. I.e. drinking alcohol.

I'm assuming that you mean the former. However, it's still up to you to prove that the wives of prophet Muhammad wore Niqab because of culture and not religion. Especially considering how much the early Muslims, men and women, centered every decision they made around Islam.

[evision]

Salaams peeps,

So would wearing a turban be unIslamic? The claim that the niqab is unIslamic is quite a bold one, and the onus is on you to show that if it was worn by the wives of Rasoolullah saw it was a cultural choice and not religious one.

Peace

Salam,

Wearing a tuban is not unislamic. It is not Islamic also. It is something to do with culture. Well, the the onus is on you to prove that niqab is Islamic and not wearing a niqab is unlslamic.

Wassalam

[evision]

Perhaps you should clarify what you mean by unIslamic beacuse it can mean two things.
1) Something that does not originate from Islam but is not necessarily a bad thing. I.e. driving cars.
2) Something that is contrary to the teachings of Islam. I.e. drinking alcohol.

I'm assuming that you mean the former. However, it's still up to you to prove that the wives of prophet Muhammad wore Niqab because of culture and not religion. Especially considering how much the early Muslims, men and women, centered every decision they made around Islam.

Salam,

Your assumption is correct. Here we are mixing Islam with culture. You are assuming that whatever worn by the wives of the prophet must be considered Islamic (religious obligation) and must be followed by all. In that case you have to impose the dress code of the prophet on all muslims no matter where they live. It is your duty to prove that wives of the prophet wore niqab and it is an Islamic obligation for all the women in the world to follow. The onus on you and not me.

Wassalam

[disabled0335]

Salaams peeps,

Wearing a tuban is not unislamic. It is not Islamic also. It is something to do with culture. Well, the the onus is on you to prove that niqab is Islamic and not wearing a niqab is unlslamic.

If you say the turban is not unIslamic, then you must concede the same for the niqaab. Remember, it was you that claimed it was unIslamic so really the onus is on you to show it was cultural. I don't see why I need to show it is Islamic, as I never said it was. I simply disagree with your statement that it is unIslamic. The ulema have stated that it is fine to wear one. There is your proof. Whether it is compulsory is not really in question, as the majority of ulema have stated that it is not compulsory. Can you show that there was a culture in that time of women wearing niqaab? If you cannot, why do you assume it is cultural and not religious? Because as far as I can see, this is an assumption.

Peace

[Redeem]

To clear anyone's doubts that the Niqab is an unIslamic cultural thing, I will quote a narration from A'isha, who said: “May Allaah have mercy on the first Muhaajir women. When Allaah revealed the words ‘and to draw their veils all over Juyoobihinna', they tore their aprons and covered their faces with them.” [Bukhari]

I won't dispute with anyone who says it's optional or obligatory. But it is clearly an Islamic act that originated as a result of Allah's words, not cultural habits.

[evision]

When Allaah revealed the words ‘and to draw their veils all over Juyoobihinna', they tore their aprons and covered their faces with them.

Salam,

Can you show me any scholar of Islam interpreting the verse to cover the faces? Please also explain to me what does it mean when Allah says "except what is normally displayed"?

Wassalam

[Redeem]

Salam,

Can you show me any scholar of Islam interpreting the verse to cover the faces? Please also explain to me what does it mean when Allah says "except what is normally displayed"?

Wassalam

I see that you have completely disregarded the Hadith that you quoted.

This isn't about whether or not the Niqab is a religious obligation or an extra act of worship. Don't change the subject. This is about you claiming that the Niqab is unIslamic and cultural when clearly, the women of Islam began wearing Niqab as a result of the verses of Allah.

[Aussie]

Regarding the cultural vs Islamic aspects of the hijab and niqab, Shaykh Naeem Abdul Wali gave a pretty good lecture covering this a while back. The lecture is "why hijab" found here: (you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetnaeemabdulwali(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetnaeemabdulwali(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/[/url]

[fatimah7]

first of all i must say i m realy impresed by all of u ppl.iu seem to ve a good knowledge about Islam..MASHALLAH.
though not u evision. u seem to b complete novice about Islam..
i think if u want to understnd de true Islam.u had beter first understnd de spirit of Islam.n why re de muslim men or women orderd to do ceratin things... i mean .for a question one cud ask..y cover de body.y cover the arms or legs.wats de point.. i regret to say i m no scholar n i hve very little ILM. yet i tel u wat i think.
i think.dat women in an islmic society hve a distinct n certain position .n they re spposed to be very diferent from de rest of de women.Islam teaches simplicity.Islam teaches us to shun lust.avarice n love of worldy comforts. burqa or hijab.n covering ur full self..isnt only a dress code .or a cultural aspect as evision said..its about wat you feel when u wear burqa. the feelings it provokes in u .as far as i ve felt i cn say .it provokes a feeling of simplicity.n modesty in me. i mean i no longer cre wat other women are wearing .or is my dress according to de latest fashion or not.den i feel dat i m shouldering a responsibilty. when i m wearing hijab.my dress says itself dat i m a muslim .n den i feel i ve to live up to de standard of good pious muislim woman.
second/...as for covering face is unislamic....wel this question is as unislmic as can b imagined .next time ppl wil b wondering is fasting unislamic too.evision n others who r of dat opinion need to read a bit more.i will quote few instance i ve red concering this issue
before HAZRET UMER.R.A. died ..HAZRET AYESHA.RA. used to visit de graves of her exalted husband and father.but after HAZRET UMER RA.was buried dere.she started to cover her face as well when she wud visit de graves ,when asked she said.now there ios a ghair mahrum buried here.so i cant go infront of him wid my face uncovered.
then once there was a blind SAHABEE sitting with RASULLAAH S,A,W.HAZRET AYESH R,A enterd de room n she wasnt covering her face.RASULALLAH S,A,W. told her to leave de room as dere was a ghair mahrum dere.she said but hes a blind man he cant sea me.RASULALLAH S,A,W said 'surely but you arent blind .u can sea him.
it is said about HAZRET FATIMAH ,that no man ever saw her..n she herself said.. THE VIRTUE OF A WOMAN LIES IN TWO THINGS.FIRSTLY.SHE DESNT SEA ANY GHAIR MAHRUM.N SECONDLY NO FGHAIR MAHRUM.SEAS HER.
n den lasty i tel u wat HAZRET ALI R,A said... the beauty of a woman is in her face while de beauty of a man is in his words.
well in most cases women cover thie bodies....i mean deirs no question of u going out naked...even non muslims women cover their bodies...when Islam emphasises on covering up it means...to cover up all parts.including face n hands.
n men get atracted when dey sea de face of a woman...n say if u dont cover ur face,n you re pretty...n u are going out in de public. do you belve, can you say that no man will ever get attracted towards u.n have lustful feelings? n den thers no only the questiuon of de modesty of women.men re advieed to avoid looking at women.so if a realy beauty is walking right infront of u ..do u think u wud be able to lower ur eyes??

[rinaz]

Assalamu alaikum wa rahmathulahi wa barakathuhu. Although i acknowledge that niqab is not obligatory. I felt more SECURE &SAFE, while wearing it. Insha Allah, I might hope so everyone accept that face is the main display of her beauty, which formerly pays the way for all type of fitnah. Living in secularist country like India, girls like me can't expect those unbelieving men to lower their gaze. So, for avoiding any kind of fitnah's, I felt it was necessary to wear niqab. ALLAHU AALAM.

[twoswordali]

Assalamu alaikum wa rahmathulahi wa barakathuhu. Although i acknowledge that niqab is not obligatory. I felt more SECURE &SAFE, while wearing it. Insha Allah, I might hope so everyone accept that face is the main display of her beauty, which formerly pays the way for all type of fitnah. Living in secularist country like India, girls like me can't expect those unbelieving men to lower their gaze. So, for avoiding any kind of fitnah's, I felt it was necessary to wear niqab. ALLAHU AALAM.

You are right sister it is not obligatory, however our sisters should have the right to wear it without being ridiculed by people even our own muslims sometimes. The face in my opinion is not the main display of beauty but it is an attraction. You see the women back then majority of them wore clothes that were fashionable for that time. The scarf was a piece of fashion among the women now the clothes of the women were as such.. the women used to wear scarfs with the cloth hanging down their back so the scarf would cover their head but the cloth would hang down th back. Also in the front the style or the shirt that covered the body had a V-neck meaning that the shirt in the front had a V- Neck and came down sometimes to the belly button or sometimes just around the bottom of the breast area.

This exposed the woman orniments namely her breast you could use your imagination as to how a gust of wind could eaisly show the womans orniments. Not only did regular women wear this style but so did prostitutes, and when Islam was being introduced into the community muslim women were being mistaken as prostitutes because their dress was still the same as everybody elses. The face wasnt really considered the orniment because we all know that the Prophets wife Aisha (R.A.) was very beautiful, and many people saw her. Ok now when the command came for the women to draw their veils over their bossoms they took that which was hanging down their backs and brought it in the front covering up the V-Neck. The Prostitutes and other women continued to wear scarfs and had their old style while the Muslim women was given a new style of dress that protected them and covered up their orniments. And right up till today Muslim women are some of the most fashionable women when it comes to dress and styling up their kimar with out revealing their breast or other body parts.

The women of today cant help but to show cleavege they think that thats what style is and that thats what will attract the opposite sex. And they are right but all they attract is wild dogs looking for a good time because all they are doing is hanging their fruit in front of drooling hungry sex craved men. Wereas the muslim sister has her God and His messenger first and her intelligence and any man looking at her would not be starring at her breast becaused they are not exposed. And she is greeted with respect instead of disrespect. But I do get how some cultures are different and different men in different cultures are. And sometimes you have to go to the extreem and even cover your face just to get some peace. And there is nothing UnIslamic about that at all i support you on that

[Muslimah7]

ASALAMUALIKUM BROTHERS AND SISTERS, I would like to share the following article, hope it is useful... Inshallah...

Correct view on the ruling on covering the face With regard to the niqaab, what are the ahaadeeth and aayaat that refer specifically to it?.

Praise be to Allaah.

The correct view is that a woman is obliged to cover her entire body, even the face and hands. Imam Ahmad said that even the nails of a woman are ‘awrah, and this is also the view of Maalik (may Allaah have mercy on them both). Shaykh al-Islam Ibn Taymiyah (may Allaah have mercy on him) said:

“… It seems that the view of Ahmad is that every part of her is ‘awrah, even her nails, and this is also the view of Maalik.”

(Majmoo’ al-Fataawa, 22/110).

In contrast to those who say that this is not obligatory, if we examine the views of those who say that it is not obligatory for women to cover the face, we will see that it is as Shaykh Bakr Abu Zayd (may Allaah preserve him) said:

“One of the following three scenarios must apply:

1 – There is clear, sound evidence, but it has been abrogated by the verses that enjoin hijaab…

2 – There is sound evidence but it is not clear, and it does not constitute strong evidence when taken in conjunction with the definitive evidence from the Qur’aan and Sunnah that the face and hands must be covered…

3 – There is clear evidence, but it is not sound…”

(Hiraasat al-Fadeelah, p. 68-69)

With regard to the evidence that it is obligatory to cover the face and hands:

1 – Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“O Prophet! Tell your wives and your daughters and the women of the believers to draw their cloaks (veils) all over their bodies (i.e. screen themselves completely except the eyes or one eye to see the way). That will be better, that they should be known (as free respectable women) so as not to be annoyed. And Allaah is Ever Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful”

[al-Ahzaab 33:59]

Ibn Taymiyah (may Allaah have mercy on him) said:

“Allaah commands women to let the jilbaab come down (over their faces) so that they will be known (as respectable women) and not be annoyed or disturbed. This evidence supports the first opinion. ‘Ubaydah al-Salmaani and others stated that the women used to wear the jilbaab coming down from the top of their heads in such a manner that nothing could be seen except their eyes, so that they could see where they were going. It was proven in al-Saheeh that the woman in ihraam is forbidden to wear the niqaab and gloves. This is what proves that the niqaab and gloves were known among women who were not in ihraam. This implies that they covered their faces and hands.”

(Majmoo’ al-Fataawa, 15/371-372)

2 – Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“And tell the believing women to lower their gaze (from looking at forbidden things), and protect their private parts (from illegal sexual acts) and not to show off their adornment except only that which is apparent (like both eyes for necessity to see the way, or outer palms of hands or one eye or dress like veil, gloves, headcover, apron), and to draw their veils all over Juyoobihinna (i.e. their bodies, faces, necks and bosoms)…”

[al-Noor 24:31]

Shaykh al-Islam Ibn Taymiyah said:

“With regard to the phrase ‘and not to show off their adornment except only that which is apparent’, ‘Abd-Allaah ibn Mas’ood said: the adornment which is apparent is the garment, because the word zeenah (adornment) was originally a name for the clothes and jewellery, as we see in the verses in which Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

‘Take your adornment (by wearing your clean clothes)’

[al-A’raaf 7:31]

‘Say (O Muhammad): Who has forbidden the adornment with clothes given by Allaah, which He has produced for His slaves’

[al-A’raaf 7:32]

‘And let them not stamp their feet so as to reveal what they hide of their adornment’

[al-Noor 24:31]

Stamping the feet makes known the khulkhaal (anklets) and other kinds of jewellery and clothing. Allaah forbade women to show any kind of adornment except that which is apparent, but He allowed showing the hidden adornment to mahrams. It is known that the kind of adornment that usually appears, without any choice on the part of the women, is the clothing, as for the body, it is possible to either show it or to cover it. All of this indicates that what appears of the adornment is the clothing.

Ahmad said: the adornment which is apparent is the clothing. And he said: every part of a woman is ‘awrah, even her nails. It was narrated in the hadeeth, ‘The woman is ‘awrah,’ This includes all of the woman. It is not makrooh to cover the hands during prayer, so they are part of the ‘awrah, just like the feet. Analogy implies that the face would be ‘awrah were it not for the fact that necessity dictates that it should be uncovered during prayer, unlike the hands.”

Sharh al-‘Umdah, 4/267-268.

3 – It was narrated that ‘Aa’ishah said: “The riders used to pass by us when we were with the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) in ihraam. When they came near, each of us would lower her jilbaab from her head over her face, and when they passed by we would uncover (our faces).”

Narrated by Abu Dawood, 1833; Ahmad, 24067

Shaykh al-Albaani said in Jilbaab al-Mar’ah al-Muslimah (107): its isnaad is hasan because of the existence of corroborating reports.

It is well known that a woman should not put anything over her face when she is in ihraam, but ‘Aa’ishah and the Sahaabiyaat (women of the Sahaabah) who were with her used to lower part of their garments over their faces because the obligation to cover the face when non-mahrams pass by is stronger than the obligation to uncover the face when in ihraam.

4 – It was narrated that ‘Aa’ishah (may Allaah be pleased with her) said: “May Allaah have mercy on the women of the Muhaajireen. When Allaah revealed the words (interpretation of the meaning)

‘and to draw their veils all over Juyoobihinna (i.e. their bodies, faces, necks and bosoms)…”

[al-Noor 24:31], they tore their aprons and covered their faces with them.”

(Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 4480)

5 – It was narrated from ‘Aa’ishah… that Safwaan ibn al-Mu’attal al-Sulami al-Dhakwaani was lagging behind the army. He came to where I had stopped and saw the black shape of a person sleeping. He recognized me when he saw me, because he had seen me before hijaab was enjoined. I woke up when I heard him saying ‘Inna Lillaahi wa inna ilayhi raaji’oon (verily to Allaah we belong and unto Him is our return),’ when he saw me, and I covered my face with my jilbaab.”

(Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 3910; Muslim, 2770)

6 – It was narrated from ‘Abd-Allaah that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “The woman is ‘awrah and when she goes out the Shaytaan gets his hopes up.”

(Narrated by al-Tirmidhi, 1173).

Al-Albaani said in Saheeh al-Tirmidhi (936): It is saheeh.

Please see Question no. 21134 for more information about the niqaab.

And Allaah knows best.


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