49 replies to this topic

[kellygreen]

Shooting for 'spread peacefully' ? It wasn't.

[AHMAD_73]

Oh, O.K. Your question. As far as the 'occupying' goes, I agree about iraq. The U.S. should never have gone there.

fair enough...
i wasnot aiming to go so far in such arguments...., and i like, as a wise sister advised, to have more benifitient issues. may be after this one....

The iraqi situation was/is so wild that only a brutal madman like sadaam hussain could control all the tribes and sects and all the other crap they have running around there.

but no one hired the USA to be the ultimate unique judge of the world and people, to call this fine and that a crap, especially when they were as well as most of the westen countries among the main supporters of Sadam in most of his crimes, as well as many other dectator rulers. they act against every fair and democratic value in Latin America, and most of the 60s, 70s and 80s dectators were made in the states.
secondly, all whom killed by Sadam were just less 1% of those killed by the democratic countries and the black water(s).

Plus sadaam was a good counter-weight to iran.

BTW, Iran were/is long way in front of Iraq and all the area countries in the intention and practical steps to have nuclear weapons. i believe too it is not the kind of democracy the USA likes, it hosted many of the enamies of the states at the time. Iraq was more than exhausted after 13 years of tight strict seige........why the states decided to (launch their Media PROPAGANDA lies against Iraq) invade the Sunni Iraq and not Iran????
i believe it's some thing we will know later

afghanistan is another story. The talibs got what they deserved for not handing over bin laden and his buddies. Where the U.S. went wrong was they should have gone in there, killed who ever needed to be killed (and there were plenty) and left.

although i don't agree on that, i won't discuss it here.....

But wrongly, the U.S. tried to 'nation build' and drag these 8th century throwbacks into the modern age. Big mistake. That's not what armies do. Armies kill. Period. We stayed there much too long.

i don't agree on that concept too, i believe there are many american (mostly in the west) like to live the 15th and 18th century life, why not invade them with the armies and change them....they are more nearer.

i hope to end this and try to find any other nice subjects to discuss, if you like

[AHMAD_73]

Your not going to hit me with Islam was spreadfully are you?

although that was looong time ago, and we/our ancistors (the occupied countries) like to call it opining, that changed these countries and the whole world to a better state. when the Moslems, thanks Allah, opend our country, they just free the people from the slavery of the people to be ultimate free to chose what they like, and Alhamdo llelah most of them chose to be Moslem. in a less than a century they were the ultimate fair and advanced societies in the world in every aspect in life, science, social, economic, helth care ....ETC. those Moslem civilization fled to change the whole world to the best for FREE.
really, no one have any idea, to where the world were heading if the Moslems didn't appear at that time in history.....

at least we agree that there are many Moslem countries are still occupied, today on this moment, by aggrissive arrogant forces, and many others suffered many of the greatest masscares ever happened on earth (Bosnia and Kosova)........ETC

[Scotia]

although that was looong time ago, and we/our ancistors (the occupied countries) like to call it opining, that changed these countries and the whole world to a better state. when the Moslems, thanks Allah, opend our country, they just free the people from the slavery of the people to be ultimate free to chose what they like, and Alhamdo llelah most of them chose to be Moslem. in a less than a century they were the ultimate fair and advanced societies in the world in every aspect in life, science, social, economic, helth care ....ETC. those Moslem civilization fled to change the whole world to the best for FREE.
really, no one have any idea, to where the world were heading if the Moslems didn't appear at that time in history.....

at least we agree that there are many Moslem countries are still occupied, today on this moment, by aggrissive arrogant forces, and many others suffered many of the greatest masscares ever happened on earth (Bosnia and Kosova)........ETC

So basicly ur saying its ok for muslims to do it but no1 else?

Bosnia and kosovo?, not the best two examples as in both cases there were full of muslim immigrants from albania, that just took over part of another country dues to numbers, whats was that about outsides coming in and taking over ppls homes etc?

oh but im sure that dosent apply here because its mulsims doing it.

[AHMAD_73]

So basicly ur saying its ok for muslims to do it but no1 else?

so basically you are saying because the Moslems opened the land 1400 years ago, then the USA have the right to occupy any Moslem country they like.

Bosnia and kosovo?, not the best two examples as in both cases there were full of muslim immigrants from albania, that just took over part of another country dues to numbers, whats was that about outsides coming in and taking over ppls homes etc? oh but im sure that dosent apply here because its mulsims doing it.

so basically you are saying because the Moslems transfered to that area (as you think, i'm not sure about that) some 100s years ago, that gives the Serbs the right to masscare 400,000 of them, kidnap and rape 100,000s of children and women. i got you, that may explain the Eurobian reation for 6 years.

But do you think that could justify the Red indians to masscare a quite persentage of the Eurobian imigrants (Americans now).....oooh i forgut, the imigrants did it first, they masscared almost all of the original owners of the land..... it's OK now.

[Scotia]

so basically you are saying because the Moslems opened the land 1400 years ago, then the USA have the right to occupy any Moslem country they like.


so basically you are saying because the Moslems transfered to that area (as you think, i'm not sure about that) some 100s years ago, that gives the Serbs the right to masscare 400,000 of them, kidnap and rape 100,000s of children and women. i got you, that may explain the Eurobian reation for 6 years.

But do you think that could justify the Red indians to masscare a quite persentage of the Eurobian imigrants (Americans now).....oooh i forgut, the imigrants did it first, they masscared almost all of the original owners of the land..... it's OK now.

the claim was that muslims bettered these countrys and freed the ppl from slavery, not sure if you were trying to ironic there as u made most of the ppl slaves of Allah, and slavery still went on for hundreds of years.
So why cant the west move in and improve these countrys? or to protect minoritys?

There all albainian muslims, not hard to check out , not including the forgien armed muslims that moved in to help take over a soverign country.
check out youtube for examples of there beheading of non muslims.
A slight over estimation of the numbers u gave and i believe there has been evidence of some atrocitys being staged to elicit sympathy and support from the west in taking over this forgien land.
there were incidents involving serbs which odviously I do not support but the muslims did plenty of nasty stuff aswell.

As for the native americans u cant blame em for fighting, just like u cant blame the serbs?

what is this eurobian btw?

[AHMAD_73]

the claim was that muslims bettered these countrys and freed the ppl from slavery, not sure if you were trying to ironic there as u made most of the ppl slaves of allah, and slavery still went on for hundreds of years.
So why cant the west move in and improve these countrys? or to protect minoritys?

There all albainian muslims, not hard to check out , not including the forgien armed muslims that moved in to help take over a soverign country.
check out youtube for examples of there beheading of non muslims.
A slight over estimation of the numbers u gave and i believe there has been evidence of some atrocitys being staged to elicit sympathy and support from the west in taking over this forgien land.
there were incidents involving serbs which odviously I do not support but the muslims did plenty of nasty stuff aswell.

As for the native americans u cant blame em for fighting, just like u cant blame the serbs?

scotia, like to stop here.
while generally, without naming
i like you to consider the one who commited the action (attack) and who was in the position of reaction (defend and resist), both the action and reaction quantitative and qualitative aspects. you have to consider Media effect too, for example it may magnify an individual case and keep repeating it day and night, while talk about 1000s of a similar cases just as a one bulk, in a hidden corner of the screen. i like you too, to put yourself in the other side position for a while, if you can.

what is this eurobian btw?

eurobian are the inhabitans of euroba....wiki, Bateekh encyclobidia. although this is not right time ...but any how that small contnent in noth of the big Africa ......

may Allah show us the truth and allow us to follow it,

[Scotia]

scotia, like to stop here.
while generally, without naming
i like you to consider the one who commited the action (attack) and who was in the position of reaction (defend and resist), both the action and reaction quantitative and qualitative aspects. you have to consider Media effect too, for example it may magnify an individual case and keep repeating it day and night, while talk about 1000s of a similar cases just as a one bulk, in a hidden corner of the screen. i like you too, to put yourself in the other side position for a while, if you can.


eurobian are the inhabitans of euroba....wiki, Bateekh encyclobidia. although this is not right time ...but any how that small contnent in noth of the big Africa ......

may Allah show us the truth and allow us to follow it,

Sorry havent a clue what u mean in the first part

do u mean europe?

[AHMAD_73]

Sorry havent a clue what u mean in the first part

do u mean europe?

yes, europe....not eurobe

[Smooth_Operator]

any quotes from the quran

[kellygreen]

..but no one hired the USA to be the ultimate unique judge of the world and people

But when someone needs help, who does the world look to ? Who does the world say' Why aren't they doing something ? Russia ? China ? No, it's the U.S. Even North Korea looks to the U.S. for food but they still want to goof around..

secondly, all whom killed by Sadam were just less 1% of those killed by the democratic countries and the black water(s).

I don't know about that. sadaam was in power for 40 years. He left tons of mass graves.


BTW, Iran were/is long way in front of Iraq and all the area countries in the intention and practical steps to have nuclear weapons. i believe too it is not the kind of democracy the USA likes..

Iran will have a nuke soon. That's why israel wants to 'punch Iran out'. If someone threatened me the way iran has threatened israel, I'd have gone after them already. I wouldn't wait. And since israel is an ally of the U.S. we hang with them. There is no use arguing about the U.S./israel relationship as others try to do. We are allies. Period.

[AHMAD_73]

you, who chose such complicated issues, which neither i nor you have a real decission in, but analysis according to the available MEDIA reports

But when someone needs help, who does the world look to ? Who does the world say' Why aren't they doing something ? Russia ? China ? No, it's the U.S. Even North Korea looks to the U.S. for food but they still want to goof around..

Thanks to the states for the food. but let me tell you, if the states gave some tons of food for a country, it request in stead a full loyalty. The states used to through millions of tons of crops to the ocean, and support the farmers with money to stop planting crops. While millions of the poor dies of famines, why do you think??

USA is not qualified to be the police, judge and prison guard of the world (mostly, only the Moslem world) for many reasons. It showed a great deal of arrogance, Iraqi case, a great deal of bias, , Palestine-Israeli case, a great deal of double standard, Latin America countries, using extra- uncontrolled aggressive power, Afghani case,……..ETC
The relative short history of the USA proves that too, Dealing with the native Americans. dealing with the African slaves. the un-honorable arresting camps for the American citizens from Japanese roots in the II WW time, without any crimes. the usage of the mass destructive weapons, the nuclear bombs against the civilians at almost the end of the II ww one time after another in 3 days separation. invading Vietnam, Korea……. ETC

I believe the USA have to consider, seriously, the others' opinions and show some respect to them to receive the same.

I don't know about that. sadaam was in power for 40 years. He left tons of mass graves.

although I didn't like him nor his aggrisive way in ruling his people, but let me tell you, the most big crimes of Sadam was bombing two Kwrdish villages Halabgah and Alsolimaniah with chemical weapons that caused the death of 100s while the second was against a she'a area due to a non-successful trial of assassination and had almost the same causalities.

the American invasion to Iraq caused between 100,000-1000,000 killings and almost the same injuries…..and refugees….and damages…..

Iran will have a nuke soon. That's why israel wants to 'punch Iran out'. If someone threatened me the way iran has threatened israel, I'd have gone after them already. I wouldn't wait. And since israel is an ally of the U.S. we hang with them. There is no use arguing about the U.S./israel relationship as others try to do. We are allies. Period.

first, i doubt that the states or Israel will attack Iran, they had a better chances before, and the time is not in their sake but Iran...
second, do you believe, there any situations may change the relations between the states and Israel, in other words What crimes may cause the USA to re-evaluate it's relation with Israel. Occupying the others' lands, Killing the innocents, droving the people out of their homes, confiscation of lands and desecration of masjeds, kidnapping and arresting of 10,000s, seizing 1,500,000 person in the biggest jail in the world,…..etc???

[AHMAD_73]

any quotes from the quran

alsalam alykom, brother
as i posted in a previous post, Allah perished the aggressor nations and will do the same, when he will, when they exceeds a limit, he, almighty, prescribed.

For example, in surah Hud, Allah states the punishment of the people of the prophet LOT (pbuh), because of there homosexuality. at the end of the story, Allah tells this is not far from the similar cases, I personally believe "Pompeii" was one of these cases.
011.082 S: So when Our decree came to pass, We turned them upside down and rained down upon them stones, of what had been decreed, one after another.
011.083 S: Marked (for punishment) with your Lord and it is not far off from the unjust .

In another general statements, in the same surah,
011.101 S: And We did not do them injustice, but they were unjust to themselves, so their gods whom they called upon besides Allah did not avail them aught when the decree of your Lord came to pass; and they added but to their ruin.
011.102 S: And such is the punishment of your Lord when He punishes the towns while they are unjust; surely His punishment is painful, severe.
011.103 S: Most surely there is a sign in this for him who fears the chastisement of the hereafter; this is a day on which the people shall be gathered together and this is a day that shall be witnessed.

In surah, Al-fager,
089.006 Y: Seest thou not how thy Lord dealt with the 'Ad (people),-
089.007 Y: Of the (city of) Iram, with lofty pillars,
089.008 Y: The like of which were not produced in (all) the land?
089.009 Y: And with the Thamud (people), who cut out (huge) rocks in the valley?-
089.010 Y: And with Pharaoh, lord of stakes?
089.011 Y: (All) these transgressed beyond bounds in the lands,
089.012 Y: And heaped therein mischief (on mischief).
089.013 Y: Therefore did thy Lord pour on them a scourge of diverse chastisements:
089.014 Y: For thy Lord is (as a Guardian) on a watch-tower.

is that what you are seeking for, hope that helped

[kellygreen]

you, who chose such complicated issues, which neither i nor you have a real decission in, but analysis according to the available MEDIA reports

[/u][/i][/b]

Thanks to the states for the food. but let me tell you, if the states gave some tons of food for a country, it request in stead a full loyalty. The states used to through millions of tons of crops to the ocean, and support the farmers with money to stop planting crops. While millions of the poor dies of famines, why do you think??

What's wrong with asking someone you just saved from death to not stab you in the back ? If you took a starving person in and fed them, and they turned around and said you sucked, wouldn't you be pissed ? A little appreciation is nice. It's called 'subsidizing.' We grew too much. If all that product hit the market it would have driven the price through the floor.


USA is not qualified to be the police, judge and prison guard of the world (mostly, only the Moslem world) for many reasons. It showed a great deal of arrogance, Iraqi case, a great deal of bias, , Palestine-israeli case, a great deal of double standard, Latin America countries, using extra- uncontrolled aggressive power, Afghani case,……..ETC

Like I said earlier, when something goes wrong somewhere, who does the world look to to save them ? China ? Russia ? No ! They stick their hand out to the U.S. I would LOVE it if the U.S. would just say 'NO' !! when asked for help. And then we'd see the world tell us how wrong we were to turn our back. DAMNED IF WE DO, DAMNED IF WE DON'T !! israel is an ally. The made-up 'nation' of Palestine isn't. Pretty simple. All Afghanistan had to do to avoid all 'this' was to hand over Bin Laden and his pals. But they didn't.

The relative short history of the USA proves that too, Dealing with the native Americans. dealing with the African slaves. the un-honorable arresting camps for the American citizens from Japanese roots in the II WW time, without any crimes. the usage of the mass destructive weapons, the nuclear bombs against the civilians at almost the end of the II ww one time after another in 3 days separation. invading Vietnam, Korea……. ETC

The Indians got a raw deal, but that was the way things went back then. It was a brutal time in history EVERYWHERE in the world. As far as African slaves went, the biggest slave traders, by far, were black Africans and moslems. They were more than happy to sell their rivals into slavery. moslems have a long history of slavery, even up until this day so it's pretty funny you'd choose to bring that subject up. And don't even try the.." We treat our slaves nice' crap. A slave is a slave is a slave. The Japanese interments were weird, but given their intense nationalism, it probably did prevent some acts of sabotage. During WWII, bombing of cities was the norm. ALL sides did it, but moslems never say anything bad about the Nazis bombing civilians in England and Russia, or the Japaneses virtual rapes of China, Korea and the whole of S.E. Asia. A reason for that is moslems were sympathetic to the Nazis and axis powers. The mufti of Jerusalem is a good start if you'd like to learn a bit about the Nazi/ moslem dynamic. The nuking of Japan was a GREAT thing. It saved millions of Japanese lives because an allied invasion would have been devastating. But more importantly, it saved tens of thousands of U.S. lives. WHY DON'T MOSLEMS EVER PISS AND MOAN ABOUT THE AXIS POWERS FOR STARTING WWII ? GERMANYS BREAKING OF THEIR NON-AGGRESSION PACT WITH RUSSIA. THE ANNEXING OF AUSTRIA. THE SUDETENLAND. THE INVASION OF POLAND. THE INVASION OF FRANCE. PEARL HARBOR. THEY ONLY CRY ABOUT THE U.S. The U.S. didn't 'invade' Vietnam and Korea. You need to get your history straight. The U.S. came to the aid of allies after they were invaded by China and Soviet backed communist armies. That's what allies do. But moslems NEVER bust on the Chinese or Russians for invading in the first place. They ALWAYS go after the Great Satan for reacting to the communist aggression. You guys are on the wrong side of history. AGAIN.


I believe the USA have to consider, seriously, the others' opinions and show some respect to them to receive the same.

And I believe the U.S. is due some appreciation. The world wants with one hand and has a knife for our back in the other. I'd like to see what would happen if the U.S. did NOTHING for the world for five years. No aid. No rescuing. NOTHING. Do you think the world would be a happier place ? I doubt seriously. Do you think the 'new superpowers' China and Russia would pick up the slack and feed the starving ? I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for that.

although I didn't like him nor his aggrisive way in ruling his people, but let me tell you, the most big crimes of Sadam was bombing two Kwrdish villages Halabgah and Alsolimaniah with chemical weapons that caused the death of 100s while the second was against a she'a area due to a non-successful trial of assassination and had almost the same causalities.

the American invasion to Iraq caused between 100,000-1000,000 killings and almost the same injuries…..and refugees….and damages…..

I agree that the U.S. should have never went to Iraq. Those kooks NEEDED a guy like Sadaan to keep them under control. But did you see how happy the Iraqis were when Sadaam fell ? But that all changed when their moslem 'brothers' started blowing car bombs up everywhere.Sadaam killed millions during his forty years of rule. Your Iraqi casualties figure has a very wide range. I think it's closer to the 100,000 mark. And how many of those were soldiers ? Alot. The U.S. wiped out most of the army so that would account for a lot of the figure. Add to that the mujjies, and how many civilians did they kill ? They are STILL bombing markets and Masjids. You are down on the U.S. for killing, but I never see any moslem say a peep about the mujjies still killing each other.


first, i doubt that the states or israel will attack Iran, they had a better chances before, and the time is not in their sake but Iran...
second, do you believe, there any situations may change the relations between the states and israel, in other words What crimes may cause the USA to re-evaluate it's relation with israel. Occupying the others' lands, Killing the innocents, droving the people out of their homes, confiscation of lands and desecration of masjeds, kidnapping and arresting of 10,000s, seizing 1,500,000 person in the biggest jail in the world,…..etc???

I hope we don't. israel can do whatever they feel they need to do. I know if someone said they were going to punch me in the face, I wouldn't wait for them to do it. But if we wanted, iran would be toast. We have some pretty cool conventional mountain-penetrating devices. Google 'Rods of God'. Cool kinetic energy device. It'll say that they aren't operative yet. But usually if the public hears about something, then it IS up and running and we're working on the next cool thing. What I would do, though is tell iran AND the world, openly, that we know iran is going to eventually get a bomb. I'd tell them that if a bomb blows up ANYWHERE in the world, and it's traced back to iran, that iran would cease to exist. I'd give them fair warning. ONCE. israel will remain a U.S. ally because they're the only democracy over there and the are more 'like us' than the moslem countries. Bottom line is... Islam and the way we here in the U.S. lives isn't compatible. They don't fit together well. Like peanut butter and mayonnaise. Good in their own situations, but not together. At least I HOPE you wouldn't make a peanut butter and mayo sandwich.That doesn't mean that one or the other is bad, it just means that they don't go good together.

Edited by kellygreen, 19 March 2012 - 09:08 PM.

[AHMAD_73]

What's wrong with asking someone you just saved from death to not stab you in the back ? If you took a starving person in and fed them, and they turned around and said you sucked, wouldn't you be pissed ? A little appreciation is nice. It's called 'subsidizing.'

if the issue is about appreciation, then that's will be great. the problem is not about that but about Domination, enslaving and full controlling of the countries capabilities, aims and goals in every field. it's about ensuring that country will stay for the long run un-able to stand alone, it's about keeping these countries as a dominant markets,…..etc.
I hope you were born in one of these countries, and hear your opinion about justice.

We grew too much. If all that product hit the market it would have driven the price through the floor.

Can you imagine your self in place of the one suffering drought and watching his beloved ones die of starvation, while others are thronging the food to the ocean!!

All Afghanistan had to do to avoid all 'this' was to hand over Bin Laden and his pals. But they didn't.

What proofs the US administration provided to the Afghani government at the time?

The Indians got a raw deal, but that was the way things went back then. It was a brutal time in history EVERYWHERE in the world.

yes, you were ultimitly right and the red Indians deserve it!!

As far as African slaves went, the biggest slave traders, by far, were black Africans and moslems. They were more than happy to sell their rivals into slavery.

All of these 21^th century media allegations are just fakes and the occupying forces are the only responsible for crimes practically and theoretically. As far as I know the slavery just began with the first invasion of the Portugal's armies to western coast of Africa at the end of the 15^th century and became more harder with the British occupations.
On the other hand the slavery process is a long chain of steps begins with kidnapping the free and call him a slave, transport them with the ultimate non-humanitarian transportation, dealing with them less than animals,….., adapting them to the Christian-American style, changing the names, identities, religions, cultures by webs and trimming the terminals. Which no one can claim it was done by the Moslems. Do you have an idea when the final discrimination law in the USA was stopped, it's in 1982!!!!

moslems have a long history of slavery, even up until this day so it's pretty funny you'd choose to bring that subject up. And don't even try the." We treat our slaves nice' crap. A slave is a slave is a slave.

The brothers and sisters, covered this issue many times in some other threads, if you like to have an idea about it, you can. I'll Just mention this hadeeth " your slaves are your brothers, Allah made them under your authority (to test you), whoever have his brother under his authority he have to feed him from his food and cloth him from his cloth and don't overload him, and in case of overload him you must help him"
What can you understand from this

The Japanese interments were weird, but given their intense nationalism, it probably did prevent some acts of sabotage. During WWII, bombing of cities was the norm. ALL sides did it, but moslems never say anything bad about the Nazis bombing civilians in England and Russia, or the Japaneses virtual rapes of China, Korea and the whole of S.E. Asia. A reason for that is moslems were sympathetic to the Nazis and axis powers. The mufti of Jerusalem is a good start if you'd like to learn a bit about the Nazi/ moslem dynamic. The nuking of Japan was a GREAT thing. It saved millions of Japanese lives because an allied invasion would have been devastating. But more importantly, it saved tens of thousands of U.S. lives. WHY DON'T MOSLEMS EVER PISS AND MOAN ABOUT THE AXIS POWERS FOR STARTING WWII ? GERMANYS BREAKING OF THEIR NON-AGGRESSION PACT WITH RUSSIA. THE ANNEXING OF AUSTRIA. THE SUDETENLAND. THE INVASION OF POLAND. THE INVASION OF FRANCE. PEARL HARBOR. THEY ONLY CRY ABOUT THE U.S.

I told you before, we care about every living soul, if I criticize some actions of the US ,because that's our discussion subject, doesn't mean the Japanese or the German were right.
If the Mufti of Quads along with some hundreds show themselves to support Germany, on the other side 100,000s of the Egyptian supported Britain in the most critical time of the war Al-Alameen battle, the turn point in the war. While the mufti may have his excuse to oppose Britain that give the Palestine' land for free to the Jewish flocks since 1917 to their departure in 1947.

[AHMAD_73]

The U.S. didn't 'invade' Vietnam and Korea. You need to get your history straight.

I may need but, sure, you need too

I agree that the U.S. should have never went to Iraq. Those kooks NEEDED a guy like Sadaan to keep them under control. But did you see how happy the Iraqis were when Sadaam fell ?

Yes I saw some on the US media channels and I saw the opposite too, and the later consequences supports the second

But that all changed when their moslem 'brothers' started blowing car bombs up everywhere.Sadaam killed millions during his forty years of rule. Your Iraqi casualties figure has a very wide range. I think it's closer to the 100,000 mark. And how many of those were soldiers ? Alot. The U.S. wiped out most of the army so that would account for a lot of the figure. Add to that the mujjies, and how many civilians did they kill ? They are STILL bombing markets and mosques. You are down on the U.S. for killing, but I never see any moslem say a peep about the mujjies still killing each other.

If there is a problems with the numbers that's the fault of the occupying forces who suppose to be fully responsible for these issues. In a country who have three, almost the same weight, Ethnic/religion groups to take the whole power suddenly from one to the other, that should cause troubles. To kill the civilians is wrong, to resist the occuping force is right from religious and international law points of views.

Who are the mujjies??

I hope we don't. Israel can do whatever they feel they need to do. I know if someone said they were going to punch me in the face, I wouldn't wait for them to do it. But if we wanted, iran would be toast. We have some pretty cool conventional mountain-penetrating devices. Google 'Rods of God'. Cool kinetic energy device. It'll say that they aren't operative yet. But usually if the public hears about something, then it IS up and running and we're working on the next cool thing. What I would do, though is tell iran AND the world, openly, that we know iran is going to eventually get a bomb. I'd tell them that if a bomb blows up ANYWHERE in the world, and it's traced back to iran, that iran would cease to exist. I'd give them fair warning. ONCE. Israel will remain a U.S. ally because they're the only democracy over there and the are more 'like us' than the moslem countries.

Democracy is not the secret word nor the most holly concept in life. Justice and mercy are more important. What the democracy tells about kicking the people out of their homes and lands and transferring them into refugees every where. Hope you were a Palestine girl for a while and judge the issue from different view.

Finally, how can you see the Palestine- Israeeli conflict should be solved??

Bottom line is... islam and the way we here in the U.S. lives isn't compatible. They don't fit together well. Like peanut butter and mayonnaise. Good in their own situations, but not together. At least I HOPE you wouldn't make a peanut butter and mayo sandwich.That doesn't mean that one or the other is bad, it just means that they don't go good together.

I disagree, milions of the americans had chose Islam and found the happiness and contentment they lost for long time. the west is in the most need for Islam in this specific moment, more than any other moment in history…..
Give your self a chance to know about Islam from the majority moderate Moslems, not any other (biased media) on the behalf of us

[Scotia]

if the issue is about appreciation, then that's will be great. the problem is not about that but about Domination, enslaving and full controlling of the countries capabilities, aims and goals in every field. it's about ensuring that country will stay for the long run un-able to stand alone, it's about keeping these countries as a dominant markets,…..etc.
I hope you were born in one of these countries, and hear your opinion about justice.


Can you imagine your self in place of the one suffering drought and watching his beloved ones die of starvation, while others are thronging the food to the ocean!!



What proofs the US administration provided to the Afghani government at the time?


yes, you were ultimitly right and the red Indians deserve it!!


All of these 21^th century media allegations are just fakes and the occupying forces are the only responsible for crimes practically and theoretically. As far as I know the slavery just began with the first invasion of the Portugal's armies to western coast of Africa at the end of the 15^th century and became more harder with the British occupations.
On the other hand the slavery process is a long chain of steps begins with kidnapping the free and call him a slave, transport them with the ultimate non-humanitarian transportation, dealing with them less than animals,….., adapting them to the Christian-American style, changing the names, identities, religions, cultures by webs and trimming the terminals. Which no one can claim it was done by the Moslems. Do you have an idea when the final discrimination law in the USA was stopped, it's in 1982!!!!



The brothers and sisters, covered this issue many times in some other threads, if you like to have an idea about it, you can. I'll Just mention this hadeeth " your slaves are your brothers, Allah made them under your authority (to test you), whoever have his brother under his authority he have to feed him from his food and cloth him from his cloth and don't overload him, and in case of overload him you must help him"
What can you understand from this



I told you before, we care about every living soul, if I criticize some actions of the US ,because that's our discussion subject, doesn't mean the Japanese or the German were right.
If the Mufti of Quads along with some hundreds show themselves to support Germany, on the other side 100,000s of the Egyptian supported Britain in the most critical time of the war Al-Alameen battle, the turn point in the war. While the mufti may have his excuse to oppose Britain that give the Palestine' land for free to the Jewish flocks since 1917 to their departure in 1947.

Your naivety is astounding when it comes to slavery and muslims involvement in it, u got access to the internet, do some research.

[kellygreen]

if the issue is about appreciation, then that's will be great. the problem is not about that but about Domination, enslaving and full controlling of the countries capabilities, aims and goals in every field. it's about ensuring that country will stay for the long run un-able to stand alone, it's about keeping these countries as a dominant markets,…..etc.
I hope you were born in one of these countries, and hear your opinion about justice.

'Enslaving' ? Are you nuts ? Iraq is on their own, and Afghanistan will be soon. And contrary to the muslim 'battle cry' the U.S. didn't 'steal' ANY oil from Iraq. I wish we did. And how are the Afghans 'enslaved' ? If any of those two countries are unable to 'stand alone' it's because of their own corruption and ineptitude. If Afghanistan wishes to stay in the 8th century, that's their problem. If they want to enslave their women and keep young girls from going to school, fine. 'Dominant markets' ? For what ?

'Mujjie' is short for mujaheddin. Easier to type.


Can you imagine your self in place of the one suffering drought and watching his beloved ones die of starvation, while others are thronging the food to the ocean!!

So here we go again. We hate the Great Satan but we have our hand out. Again. Why not look to China or Russia ? We're tired of feeding the world then getting kicked in the nuts.


What proofs the US administration provided to the Afghani government at the time?

Bin Ladens confessions for the '93 WTC blast, the African embassy bombings and 9/11 itself, not to mention the many video taped beheadings al qada showed the world. I know, I know. Those were 'fake' bin ladens, right ? The taliban didn't deny bin ladens complicity, they said they wouldn't hand him over because he was a 'guest'.


yes, you were ultimitly right and the red Indians deserve it!!

Huh ?

All of these 21^th century media allegations are just fakes and the occupying forces are the only responsible for crimes practically and theoretically. As far as I know the slavery just began with the first invasion of the Portugal's armies to western coast of Africa at the end of the 15^th century and became more harder with the British occupations.
On the other hand the slavery process is a long chain of steps begins with kidnapping the free and call him a slave, transport them with the ultimate non-humanitarian transportation, dealing with them less than animals,….., adapting them to the Christian-American style, changing the names, identities, religions, cultures by webs and trimming the terminals. Which no one can claim it was done by the Moslems. Do you have an idea when the final discrimination law in the USA was stopped, it's in 1982!!!!

Slavery STILL goes on in the Middle East. NOW !! 2012 !! Islam IS THE ONLY RELIGION WITH RULES ON HOW TO CARRY OUT SLAVERY THE 'RIGHT' WAY !!!

Edited by kellygreen, 20 March 2012 - 11:32 PM.

[sunnymaboy]

More than the talibs were killed in Afghanistan.Innocent people were also killed.

[AHMAD_73]

'Enslaving'?

I didn't mean individual enslaving, but countries enslaving. Assuring that country will be in permanent need for the new master, and can't refuse any of the master's orders even if that against every local and international law and any justice or fairness principle. That can be done by many means, which may be discussed in another occasion. While once the enslaved country reaches such state it can't have a free choice any more but their master's.
And here is an example of what will be the results:
Not a master's citizen could be judged in the enslaved countries in any crime including murdering. While the opposite is right even if there is no crimes at all.

Are you nuts ?

That word is considered an insult and could be a crime in my country/culture. I don't know if that considered the same in your country or no. any how I like to tell you, we are different and not every single habit/way/method/custom/tradition you have in your civilization is considered the same in others, but some times it could be a great insult. One obvious example of that is, putting the foot over the other leg while the bottom of one's shoes facing the other person. this specific one is considered a big insult and lack of respect in my country.
What I meant by all of this is to tell that, both sides need to have enough time to understand the other. I hope that is your purpose of being here.

Iraq is on their own

just tons of looong time contracts for 100 of billions of USD in every field. Military, civil (every facility the USA destructed in the war time for a known purpose or future purposes), OIL, OIL, OIL and OIL. Finally, the percentage of contracts of rebuilding Iraq will reveal the reality.

And contrary to the muslim 'battle cry' the U.S. didn't 'steal' ANY oil from Iraq. I wish we did.

Pocket stealing is an armature quality, the professionals have a professional loooooooooong time goals.

And how are the Afghans 'enslaved' ? If any of those two countries are unable to 'stand alone' it's because of their own corruption and ineptitude. If Afghanistan wishes to stay in the 8th century, that's their problem.

This an internal issue for them. i asked you before why the USA armies didn't begin with your west, the 18^th century people, why not you care about them!!!