49 replies to this topic

[AHMAD_73]

If they want to enslave their women and keep young girls from going to school, fine.

you may need to hear more from the Moslem side, not only your media on our sake.

'Dominant markets' ? For what ?

the contracts will tell, American companies, currency, experts, equipments, tools, trainnings, maintenance ……., and finally and the worst part is long time spare parts.

'Mujjie' is short for mujaheddin. Easier to type.

I like to know your opinion to those Mujjie' who fled to help their brothers in Bosnia and Kosovo 19992-1998, when the whole world were just watching the massacres?? Do you believe they were good humans or bad ones??

Bin Ladens confessions for the '93 WTC blast, the African embassy bombings , 9/11 itself, not to mention the many video taped beheadings al qada showed the world.

I'm not sure, but I think non of these is an enough proof, even the greatest, most honest president ever of the states, G.W. Bush didn't mention any of them to justify envading Afganstan. as i can remember he told its secret evidances, at the time!!! later it was the car and arabic flight manual then the survived Arabic Passpost from the evaborised airliner and the collapsed building!!!

I know, I know. Those were 'fake' bin ladens, right ?

generally, Killing the civilians is against Islam principles, killing any person (even military) out of the war area (Dar alharb) is also against Islam principles, And specifying "Dar Alharb" area and time have to be clear enough for both sides.

The taliban didn't deny bin ladens complicity, they said they wouldn't hand him over because he was a 'guest'.

That's not right, the Taliban asked for the proofs, while the States didn't accept this, because some arrogance issues and there were no proofs.

Slavery STILL goes on in the Middle East. NOW !! 2012 !! ISLAM IS THE ONLY RELIGION WITH RULES ON HOW TO CARRY OUT SLAVERY THE 'RIGHT' WAY !!!

Now in 2012, while there is no evidence of one slave any where in the world, there are thousands of the innocent young men in the American prisons (Abu-Ghoraib) and Goantanamo, subjecting to 11 years of the most aggressive mental and physical abusing by the USA. And after distorting the men minds and health they release them and say,….."no enough evidences". I believe if they were enslaved on the Islamic principles that would be more humanitarian and just for both sides.

[Scotia]

google slavery, Islam and today u get 18200000 hits, go figure.

Edited by Scotia, 23 March 2012 - 02:29 PM.

[freedslave]

google slavery, islam and today u get 18200000 hits, go figure.

That's funny, when you google slavery america today you get 31,600,000 results.

[Scotia]

The US is at least honest about the part it played during the slave trade.

From muslims its denial, denial, you were worse, denial etc

[Saracen21stC]

@Scotia,

Try to give evidence of your claims.

[Scotia]

http://www.bbc.co.uk...slavery_1.shtml

http://en.wikipedia....iews_on_slavery

http://answering-isl...las/slavery.htm

http://archive.front...spx?ARTID=28953

http://islam-watch.o...veryInIslam.htm

http://www.humaneven...le.php?id=20586

http://debate.org.uk...rtracts/t12.htm

How many more do you wish?

[Saracen21stC]

I asked for evidence of denial from mass majority of Muslims. And the so called slavery in Islam is very different from the Western (US) slavery.
http://www.islamic-l...tion-doubts-699
http://l.b5z.net/i/u...each_Racism.pdf

Another vital thing is to remember that Muslim is not same as Islam. Sources of Islam is primarily Qur'an and authentic Hadiths. Anything contradicting them will NOT be accepted. Contents of some of the links you have posted do not meet the criteria.

Edited by Saracen21stC, 23 March 2012 - 08:05 PM.

[Scotia]

I asked for evidence of denial from mass majority of Muslims. And the so called slavery in Islam is very different from the Western (US) slavery.
http://www.islamic-l...tion-doubts-699
http://l.b5z.net/i/u...each_Racism.pdf

Another vital thing is to remember that Muslim is not same as Islam. Sources of Islam is primarily Qur'an and authentic Hadiths. Anything contradicting them will NOT be accepted. Contents of some of the links you have posted do not meet the criteria.

Ive yet to meet or hear of a muslim that will admit to the slave trade carried out by muslims, even up to this day.

what does not meet your criteria?

[kellygreen]

I didn't mean individual enslaving, but countries enslaving. Assuring that country will be in permanent need for the new master, and can't refuse any of the master's orders even if that against every local and international law and any justice or fairness principle. That can be done by many means, which may be discussed in another occasion. While once the enslaved country reaches such state it can't have a free choice any more but their master's.
And here is an example of what will be the results:
Not a master's citizen could be judged in the enslaved countries in any crime including murdering. While the opposite is right even if there is no crimes at all.

Iraq is governing themselves just fine without the U.S. Afghanistan COULDN'T govern themselves BEFORE the U.S. arrived. I doubt that they ever will. That place was a dump before, and it'll be a dump after.

That word is considered an insult and could be a crime in my country/culture. I don't know if that considered the same in your country or no.

No, we're a modern country. How silly !!

both sides need to have enough time to understand the other. I hope that is your purpose of being here.

I'm learning plenty about Islam. I have to keep my opinions on that to myself for now.

just tons of looong time contracts for 100 of billions of USD in every field. Military, civil (every facility the USA destructed in the war time for a known purpose or future purposes), OIL, OIL, OIL and OIL. Finally, the percentage of contracts of rebuilding Iraq will reveal the reality.

The 'OIL' cry, again. Do a little research and see just how much oil the U.S. gets from iraq. I'll save you the work. It's LESS THAN 2% !! Iraq was NEVER a big exporter to the U.S. They are ranked about 8th. If 'stealing oil' was the U.S. aim, we should have left Sadaam in power. He was more than happy to sell the U.S. oil and take his skim. Remember the 'oil for food' program. Who got the bulk of the oil contracts ? China and France, not the U.S. If the U.S. is 'stealing' from iraq, they're not very good thieves.


Pocket stealing is an armature quality, the professionals have a professional loooooooooong time goals.
This an internal issue for them. i asked you before why the USA armies didn't begin with your west, the 18^th century people, why not you care about them!!!

Sorry, I don't have a clue as to what you're trying to say.

[AHMAD_73]

No, we're a modern country. How silly !!

yes, Modern in some fields, doesn't mean you are Utobia!!! unless you have enough dosage of arrogance. what is the problem in understanding the others.
simply for some one to face his shoe' bottom to your face don't seems have any relation to modernization. for soemeone to allow the other men to kiss his wife (and vise versa) don't seem have any relation to modernization. spreading homosexuality/ adultery/ incest ........ etc. don't seems have any relation to modernization...........

The 'OIL' cry, again. Do a little research and see just how much oil the U.S. gets from iraq. I'll save you the work. It's LESS THAN 2% !! Iraq was NEVER a big exporter to the U.S. They are ranked about 8th. If 'stealing oil' was the U.S. aim, we should have left Sadaam in power. He was more than happy to sell the U.S. oil and take his skim. Remember the 'oil for food' program. Who got the bulk of the oil contracts ? China and France, not the U.S. If the U.S. is 'stealing' from iraq, they're not very good thieves.

Alhamdo llelah, we don't cry, we know why we are here and where we are going to.
i like to explain the OIL cake, brieflly, for each barriel of oil: 40% for those who discovers the land, 40% for those who produce and finally 20% for the country, and so serching the cake in Iraq, we will find that most of the cake in the first two parts which the states and the allies took all of it.

tracing the contracts, is too difficult, it seems to be a confidential secrets, but generally it's between 400:600 bilion USD since the invation to the comming 10-20 years. here's some of what i find,
On November 27 2011,38 months after Royal Dutch Shell announced its pursuit of a massive gas deal in southern Iraq, the oil giant had its contract signed for a $17bn flared gas deal.
7.6 billion USD Hilperton fire fighting the oil wells
2.4 billion to train the Iraqi police (only trainning and only police)
.!!!!!!.. bilions for trainning and arming the Iraqi army (one helicopter 10:20 millions USD, one fighter 40:100 million USD,.....what about a whole army, training, loooong time spar parts)
8 billion USD disappeared at the time of the American ruler of Iraq, Paul Premer...they still just investigating the issue tell now.

i hope you got what i mean now,,Pocket stealing is an armature quality, the professionals have a professional loooooooooong time goals..

Sorry, I don't have a clue as to what you're trying to say.

you said you been to Afghanistan to civilize the 8th century people, (although you said, you couldn't qualify one physician....you were civilizing the army only, what kind of civilization is it !!!!) i said: This an internal issue for them.
as i know there are some people in the American west still like to live the 18th century life, why the USA armies didn't begin with your west, the 18^th century people, why not you care about them!!!