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About alim_in_training

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  1. Why Islam? Why Not?

    Salamu Alaikum What a surprise that a topic I opened years ago has been answered now. I'm also taken back at the fact that I was thinking of the same things years ago. Can humanity save itself? Can a person be in a sense, divine, without having teleological beliefs or do we have to seek something higher? Can humanity be accountable to itself? Salam
  2. How Is Islam Different Than Other Religions?

    She's right. But she is wrong. I think I have exhausted this site. Salamu Ala Man It Taba' il hooda
  3. How Is Islam Different Than Other Religions?

    Salamu Alaikum An ethical system is very different from a religious system. Either way I do not subscribe myself to anything. I see the world as it is. One colour, no shades, no nothing. The world is what it is. Ethically I believe I have to maintain a certain moral standing. I am will empower myself to make a difference, wasting my life is not the solution for me nor is it an option. I feel faith creeping back into me recently, and I believe this forum has everything to do with it. I fear that it is just my sincere want of being guided that is causing this, I will take a step back and evaluate these feelings before making a decision. I thank all of you for your help, I am just afraid there is something addictive about the high you all have. I have started praying more and such, but still it doesn't feel 100% right. Its either Islam for me, or nothing. Nothing means I am that I am, Atheism is not a solution, it is merely another religion. If I do not believe in Islam, I do not know if that will include my faith in a creator. Whatever is the best I hope it will be clear what it is. Salamu Alaikum
  4. How Is Islam Different Than Other Religions?

    Peace Lars, Thank you for trying to show me a different perspective, Buddhism, but like Redeem said, its either Islam or nothing. I have already considered other religions and read about them. Siddhartha doesn't hold any answers for me. Peace
  5. How Is Islam Different Than Other Religions?

    Salamu Alaikum Answering a question doesn't necessarily give you the right answer, they have not said anything I haven't already considered. Their answers are of the nature that you have to believe to understand. They say that I cannot use logic or reasoning to attain faith. Their answers come from the Qur'an this hadith tells us why you are wrong. They have not shown me any reason to return to my faith and I will not continue to battle this feeling of annoyance all the Muslims on this forum have developed. Your answers are not satisfactory in the least way, you have diverted my questions and deflected them in any way. Deflected, Islam states that it is the correct religion. Ina Deen Anda Lahee Il Islam. The correct Religion is Allah's eyes is Islam. All other religions are in hell-fire. You know Islam is correct because Allah says so, not much proof in my eyes for someone who doesn't believe Allah wrote this. Faith is redundant, believing in the unseen, yet I'm supposed to have it for no other apparent reason except that I believe, brilliant. Fitrah the natural state of which everyone is created, the natural order of things. The argument that all other religions follow a similar pattern because that is the way humans think, or the way Allah has made things. Again the book Caveman Logic, empirical evidence of people believing things that are not true for making up answers. Fitrah explains that this is existent, not why it happens. Allah says there is a Fitrah so there is, good one. It is natural to have all religions, this is the way of humanity. Of course not, I don't believe in Angels as much as believe in Aliens or ghosts or the Easter bunny. Whether Allah wants them to work, good one, now tell me how do laws work? If people follow them or not? So Allah is purposely making people not follow the laws? Allah la ugharee Gowmeen il man ugharee man fee anfooseehoom. Allah will not change a people until they change themselves. How are we supposed to do this if Allah controls all, a circle of entanglement that gives some people relief and me doubt. Allah knows all that will happen, controls destiny, people have choices, they make their choices and there are laws to restrict their choices. They can choose to follow the laws, but Allah chooses if the laws will work. What is this a game? Its my business because it is all our business. We learn through example right? That is why we have a Prophet (PBUH) and if I can follow these guidelines and these people I can go to heaven. Yet Allah states that these people have no assurance, you will get into heaven by Allah's good graces. A Muslim lives in paranoia. I'm sorry I can't find the hadith now, when a man asks the Prophet (PBUH) why do you do such and such if you know you are guaranteed Heaven, he says I am but a servant of Allah, who knows what will happen to me. When's the last time you have seen a miracle huh? When's the last time Allah struck someone for not praying? When Allah says he will not intervene with matters of the Earth, yet he makes exceptions? A man didn't pray two weeks later he falls of a cliff, see that is Allah's punishment. Amen, beauty is in the eyes of the beholder, I don't see what you see when I reflect, and thus I am misguided? What else must a man do to seek atonement, force himself to believe something so that he can have peace of mind? Open my eyes to see what you see? The only way I can see is through your binoculars, I think they are faulty, what do I do, see if I can see the same thing through different ones. If only believing in this whole story allows you to believe in this world how can you believe. I do not need to see Allah, I need to see proof of Allah, I need to see something that tells me that Allah exists beyond a doubt. I can't just fill in the blanks. Ultimately, again I will say this, You have to believe to believe, there is nothing to pull you beside actually believing. You have to feel, you have to be overcome by the oneness of God. How can any of you say that you've chosen the right path if you do not know what the wrong path is? I do not mean a life debauchery, but life is simpler than being holy or rotting in hell. Do you know what its like to be a man living in a war torn country seeing people ripped to bits and people blowing each other up and then when they are raised they turn to alcohol and violence so you automatically say they are disbelievers and will rot in hell. These people never had a choice, we are dictated by the way we are raised, our external influences. I am making a big sacrifice by questioning our current day establishment, the Prophet (PBUH) did the same, and only now would we say that he is right, because now we "know" he's right. You are on the same playing field as every other ideological confrontation throughout history and like most of the sheep you resign yourselves to a simple faith, I know this because this what I have been taught. I mean no disrespect, most of you are more learned than the average Muslim, but still provide no answers. On the other hand, I see that Islam is correct, these ideas are flawed, western from the Shaydaan. Doubts caused to mislead you, people think they are right and thus they make incorrect decision, they do not know everything. The biggest reason I stick to Islam is because of the story of Shaydaan. The entire Islamic philosophy is summed up in his story with Adam. Should I bow down to something that is made up of clay when I am fire? His free will led him to his doubts and his ultimate fall from grace. His falsified logic, being such a simplistic being compared to the almighty. Maybe Allah has a plan, maybe Allah challenges us, I am looking at both these ideas. I am looking for which of these two makes the most sense before I sign off my free will and submit. So far, blind faith is losing and logic is winning, and those that are sick of this debate can leave and STOP reading my posts. If I cared about whining people that don't like me stirring a storm I would have never questioned anything in my life. Salamu Alaikum Brothers and Sister, May Allah guide us all to the righteous path.
  6. How Is Islam Different Than Other Religions?

    Salamu Alaikum Good point. I feel the Qur'an is too vague, it doesn't really say anything to be like contested. Not totally vague in the sense that everything in it is just words, but things relating to science, historical context, Allah says there is no need for details which satisfied me before, but now I see the lack of substantial evidences the flaw. Also when it comes to evolution, I wonder how can it be a plausible theory and the Qur'an states Adam and Eve were created. In the end its like the Qur'an isn't really stating anything to be contested in the first place, do you see what I am getting at. I see it as a glorious text, perhaps unchanged, I mean realistically how many texts do change after they are made, it makes sense for the Bible to have been changed, because they are eye witness account, and the whole apocrypha thing, but I won't get into that. The Abrahamic religions are just the most influential, they have the greatest following, I don't see how that would make them right. I mean what's really miraculous about the Qur'an? Its just perspective Salamu Alaikum
  7. May Allah Destroy All The Enemies Of israel!

    He's here to start problems. Leave him be. Salam
  8. I Am Muslim And I Love Jews

    Wait what? Anymore? Does that mean in Abrahamic faiths we believe that people of Jewish descent were once thought of as better than everyone else? Salam
  9. How Is Islam Different Than Other Religions?

    Salamu Alaikum Ultimately Brothers and Sisters you are telling me it is just my decision to believe or not? No way of telling either way, its just a choice, personal choice, based on what you think is right? I think there is no point for a theological discussion. You can either amalgamate everything you know under the banner that you are a believer and attribute everything to that or not? You will only see the truth if your eyes have been opened, its just a faith thing, you have to know that you are right? Does that ultimately mean my eyes are closed? Peace
  10. How Is Islam Different Than Other Religions?

    I am glad you got that off your chest. You may have had enough. I'm just getting started, and I'll wear out everyone on this forum until I can get an answer. I am asking questions, no one is required to answer them. If you don't want to waste your time that is your decision. I always end up looking like the bad guy because I poke the fire, and frankly I don't care anymore. I think I could show a little more respect, my sarcasm is meant to make you think. If it seems belittling to you I will tone it down. If I made a decision I would not be on an Islamic forum talking to people who I thought are wasting my time. There is obviously a reason why Islam is growing more than any other religion and why the followers are so close to it. AGAIN-----> No atheists have said anything, the one who did didn't bring anything to the table for me really. It made sense and I am perhaps arguing the same point but it didn't make a development. You know come to think of it, I'm probably trying to put down all of your ideas to make mine sound better, I am only here to make you guys sound dumb so that I sound right? I am here to cause controversy, someone who is lost in life seeking enjoyment in arguing with people about their faiths. Once all of you can get past that we can continue with the thread topic. How Is Islam Different Than Other Religions. What makes Islam so much more appealing. How can one return to Islam when they feel logic is pushing against it. I want to be someone who is free thinking, without restrictions, why is it that submitting to Allah makes me a better person. Do people without religion have no ethics? Is Islam just another piece of the human puzzle, another step in our psyche, making up these things as we go, a contemporary mythology for us to use to get past things, or has religion in fact reached its peak, its final truth and religion is real. Can we be realistic about religion. Do we really believe that someone made up the universe by saying be and created human beings from dust and had two people mate x many years ago. Are there really such things as angels and Jinns, Prophets who had ants talk to them, half man half creatures which the Prophet (PBUH) rode on in a single night to travel to the hell and heaven to see men being tormented and other Prophets, rivers flowing. Doesn't this sound like a fairy tale, would I believe this story if someone else told me? Because it is written in a book that claims divinity, the book has never been contested? What about evolution? Does it fit in this picture of the one God? Its possible there is a God without Islam? Where does morality come from, is Islamic morality correct. Is it truly fair for both sexes? Do I have western mentality or Muslim mentality, or neither, or both. Is my life dictated by what I have done in my life or is there a way through it, can I be a better person by being more open minded, or must I have a restricted mentality. Why am I here, is there a reason, do I need a reason? Will Islam provide me with the right reason. Real questions Brothers and sisters. Real genuine confusion. I ask because I need to know, I have to decide where I will spend my life believing and dedicating my life to Allah, or be a free thinking person who will dedicate his life to being the most effective I can be. If religion is false can I let people live in this facade? Same way if I was Muslim would I let people die in Kufr? I am split and am sincerely seeking answers, each side of my mind I will release when asked a certain question. A Muslim talks to me oriented Islamically, what is the point like acting like a sincere believer if I am asking in the first place. People get agitated when you ask about their faith. No one need answer me, I am asking, there is no compulsion. Allah has obviously not retained my peace of heart not given me my faith back and I'm looking in every way possible. Salamu Alaikum P.S. Not exclusively are you Holy Brother Sampharo and the Muslims the only people of good morality. You will work for the next 10-50 years of your life the same way, plus you will pray and then hope that Allah is merciful enough to let you in. I only hope your attitude gets you in first and foremost defender of the Righteous.
  11. How Is Islam Different Than Other Religions?

    Salamu Alaikum Fuel for the Fire If you don't know enough, do not gamble, as long as I breathe I have the power to look and discover, there is no point resigning my faith any time soon. Why was I created? To serve and worship Allah, okay possibly, is it possible that I was just made? No way, I am a human being, we are great, we are different, we are new, therefore, the Great made us. What makes a great fire (Caveman saying this) The Fire God Inferno, now we know its not the Fire God Inferno, we can explain it. Why was I created, the Architect of the Universe made us, shaped us from clay and blew spirit into us. I think I'll wait a bit. No, religion is one brush for me, I don't think Jehovah has my answers any more than Allah would. Now this is critical Brother, when my doubts first came I had a overwhelming feelings of confusion, discontent, a war of mind. At the end of the day my goal is to have the truth with me, wherever it may be. The doubts would mutilate your peace, they would torment you, that doesn't mean that it isn't right, sometimes brother we have to go through these things to progress and become better people. I live my life based on probably mostly Arab/Islamic morality. I have begun to develop my own sense of morality, I am ultimately responsible to myself. I can see where this is a problem, it is easier for a population of people to be accountable to something greater than just themselves. Inner peace is what you think it is, waking up everyday and thinking that I have woken up from death because Allah allowed me is fine, just make sure you are right. Salamu Alaikum
  12. How Is Islam Different Than Other Religions?

    I have yet to look at your link, I'm sorry but like Redeem, I have grown cynical and jaded about these links and scholars like Zakir Naik. They all spin the same web, its like you have to have an access card to get in, I don't think like you guys and thus I don't see how any of this proves anything. Its all vague and open to interpretation, if I can one day choose that this verse is talking about one thing and then the other day something else, but then say oh but its the same thing. It doesn't make sense to me. I believe Redeem has gone beyond what I have said, which is my problem, how can no one target exactly what I'm saying, at the same time I do see your arguments and some of them have struck a chord with me. Salamu Alaikum
  13. How Is Islam Different Than Other Religions?

    Salamu Alaikum I thank you for your Dua'a and your time in trying to help me with my current problem, and I cannot lie to you and say your answers have not brought me dissatisfaction, they have, I don't feel like you are touching on my points, you have a good way of deflecting what I say to make a new point, and It always seems to be the point that I just don't want to believe, or I am lost. Again I stress Redeem, if you don't know for the life of you how someone could reject your faith than you need to open your eyes and empathize. The fact that its Islam or death for you is good, but the alternative of asking questions to you is also death is a little disconcerting. Well I guess only to me, your protective bubble of faith gives you a heightened sense of relief when you say things like I won't questions Islam. What I meant by my previous post of what would you do if someone disproved the Qur'an was to really question how open minded you were. I will not go into a battle against the tenets of Islam or the Hadiths unless you truly want me to, I know enough first hand that I will never win, because the interpretation, multitude of different rulings, etc can all be used and therefore you can always change your attitude to match my argument. I've seen it before, I can win against 10 people in a debate of Evolution v.s. the Qur'an but every time i bring it up its like pulling teeth. I seek to ask questions and get answers for my questions, if that is not possible I will not resign my faith to Islam nor accept nothingness. Morality Redeem, is the same to you as your religion, unshakable. People would be surprised of how weak a foundation morality sits on. I personally do not believe that murder is acceptable, but based on what grounds and to what punishment is a different story. Maybe here the death penalty would be ok, a death for a death, but someone burning in hell for eternity because it is as the same as he has killed all on earth is a LITTLE BIT too much for me. Empathy is key, we seem to lack it for those that do not fit our mental association. Salamu Alaikum
  14. How Is Islam Different Than Other Religions?

    Salamu Alaikum Too many assumptions Sister. I thank you for your responses but I must take a step back and consider what you have said. I feel that answering your post will be pointless because of the fact that you have totally missed the point of most of what I said, if my clarity is questioned by others I will further clarify them, until that time I will wait and see what other have to say to my allegations. If in fact no one chooses to do so I will continue my search elsewhere. If I am too presumptuous sister ask and I will take the time to dissect your post and explain the discrepancies. My problem with forums is it is different then verbal discussion and sometimes I think the wrong word's are chosen and interpreted. Salamu Alaikum
  15. How Is Islam Different Than Other Religions?

    Salamu Alaikum Sister I am not one for personal attacks, but please do watch your own emotions in this matter. You are very self-righteous and I am only seeking guidance, if my questioning bothers you I would kindly ask you to refrain from reading my posts. Again you make assumptions based on the manner of my questioning. If I lacked the desire Sister, I would not waste a minute of my valuable time considering what I am going to do with the rest of my life, I have repeatedly stated I will portray a certain perspective when refuting these ideas. If you have resigned yourself to a certain ideology for the rest of your life I just hope that you are right in your beliefs, people like me are only seeking more, whether or not that is right or wrong. I cannot be force fed ideas for the rest of my life, I have always been open minded and will continue so, I argue your statements in hopes of shedding light on my type of dilemma. I thank those that have made Dua'a for me, and hope that they will be answered if relevant, but if not, the fact that another human being seeks for my well being gives me hope for a better humanity. If I am not forgiven by Allah, I hope while drinking from Kauthar and reclining in your immense gardens laden with everlasting fruit, you will not feel the same self righteousness at my misery, because Sister, this is how serious this matter is. Sister I am questioning OUR beliefs, if you choose to bring about your ideas in order for your credibility as a resource to be worth anything I have to evaluate the consistency of your arguments. If you have never gone through a crisis of faith I hope sincerely that you will so that your faith will return multiplied in strength, or annihilated if this is what is better for you. "One I have no interest in", consistency sister, consistency, you say one thing and then do the other. I want this, I want that, I'm interested in this, I'm not interested in that. Who are we but what we want? You want salvation so you seek Allah, you want Allah so you seek Allah, you want to be right, you want heaven, you want you want you want! Yet when I want answers I am a heretic? When I want truth that could possibly be different than what you were raised to believe or led to believe I am a follower of Shaydan? If I wanted to win this online argument I would have left, your own arguments destroy themselves. I knew I was right back then, I felt correct, and truthfully everything you have all stated in this thread were my arguments for why Islam was right. Now they are all irrelevant because when you look beyond being religious you see things differently and that's what astounds me. The one thing atheists try to tell people of faith is that you all believe all your religions are right because you are apart of them! I am not on the brink of Atheism, I am on the brink of enlightenment, beauty is in the eye of the beholder right? Father how come this idol made up of dates is considered my God, it doesn't make sense to me father that I could worship this. Do not feed your doubts son, if you feel something is wrong with that keep it to yourself, you are only fueling your own destruction. Do you think those that doubt would like to live in the darkness? Someone has to do it, someone has to decide to swim upstream to lay eggs and die so we can progress. I do not think of myself as hero, I am not "better" because I question, but I am better off. If you see the dynamics of the world today you see how people have made their own chains. Actually, you can prove these things, the feeling which you are talking about is tangible. These are electric impulses between neurons that cause this sensation. Feeling can also be identified, it flares up different parts of the brain. Faith is felt, does it mean its real? I don't know, a man with schizophrenia will see and feel things, does it mean they are there, the brain can trick itself. The brain works on processes, human belief though, they work on human thought, and you can easily trick that. It's not about what you think, but how you think about it. Your linear mentality of the universe is purely Islamic, when history shows that it is completely circular, a cycle of life. We will not agree on this point but I am making a point out of this. I have chosen to look for the truth based on what I can prove, you have attained it through what you have been taught, what you feel, what you like, what is easy, what sounds the best. Exactly my point, you start to discuss morality. Again no proof that it is correct. In fact some will use evolution to state we should be competing against each other, survival of the fittest. Some will state the prisoner's dilemma as a reason as to why we have morality. You will say because it is ingrained in human society it is right. Good one, I think I should stop arguing entirely, the fact that so many of us believe it to be true is the ultimate proof of its validity. Human society is far from important, well maybe to us. Even Allah sees all of us as small as a mosquito's wing, we are but electrons of an atom. Human society is a joke, we have a few basic moral principles but the rest are up to majority. For example, I would need 4 of you sister to put me away in court based on your "Society" should I commit a crime, but only one brother. Sister's are too emotional, they can't be judges and make good decisions, maybe they should ban women from this forum for their arguments are irrelevant or make them into accounts where 4 sisters have to sign up to make one. I know that this argument is a little off topic and might be irrelevant to the context which it is used here, but I want it to be noted that the values you hold now are not necessarily and completely Islamic. When I entered this forum I was 15 years of age, I was invited to dozens of other sites to help argue against other atheists because of my conviction and ability to see both sides but defend Islam powerfully. Islam doesn't necessarily need defending, I mean defending allegations against it. I am now 18 years old and I did not initially question my beliefs, my faith fleeted from me, because more and more, this religion made no sense to me. I still went to the Masjid and prayed and fasted etc, eventually it wasn't enough, the more I learned about this world, the less I believed. Sincere questioning is an oxymoron for religion. You cannot be sincere of your religion and question it, and you should be very afraid of that. You can be a sincere truth seeker questioning the world to find the truth. If your feelings, logic, heart, soul, mind powers, zen, karma, chakra, w/e brings you back to Islam that what's the fuss, you're faith is reassured. You're right, and I apologize, I have in fact contradicted my own ethics. Generalizations and superficial assumptions are what lead you to being trapped in a mentality in the first place. Maybe to clarify, what I meant was people are prone to ideas that bring about assurance and stability for their questions, plus a mixture of upbringing brings about the specific faith you will subscribe to. If you feel this is not probable read the book Caveman Logic, by a University of Guelph Professor who is the department head of psychology. If it's the fact that he's a westerner that causes you to think that he's his ideas are flawed, I'll tell you he's a Muslim. I'll be lying but if that causes more open mindedness then you should consider what constitutes the truth for you. I apologize for calling you brother. Yes I do have the sole intention of refuting them, I stated that initially, except if I stumble upon something that I find I have nothing to say against. If I have evidence to refute something I will,. My initial statement when someone asked me if there was anything wrong factually with Qur'an that I could prove would you disbelieve, I said yes, what would you have said? Salamu Alaikum P.S. In reference to your most recent post, I am not looking for advice, such as prayers, special herbs or medicines, rituals to regain my faith. Thinking like a Muslim will make you Islamic, but isn't exactly the best advice. Praying to Allah and making Dua'a to regain my faith IN Allah? That logic sounds a little bit flawed to me