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andalusi

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Posts posted by andalusi


  1.  

    Welcome To Islaam http://islaam.faithweb.com/
     
    Arabic 'islām (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/Islaam); the ā is a double a (AA)
     
    You can deny if you want, it will change nothing

     

     

    no, it is written with one letter A, but sometime it is pronaonced longer so it feels like two AA, but it is written with 1 letter, remember this, one letter written only.

     

    and even if it was, written with two AA,

     

    HAALLY, it would still be connected to Halley, beacuse you need to use existing words, so connecting two words ALYH ALLYH next to each other and place it on correct positon you actually program scientific fact.

     

    Do you expect God to use exactly word Halley, and then nobody would understand what it means in all generations, but now we have double programed text, by using existing words

     

    let me give you an example

     

     

    Let me give you an example how quran numemrical programming works.

     

    Let say i write a sentence:

     

    Chapter 18, Sentence 65

    Edna was a beautiful girl, who lived in Ednabelle city 

     

    let say i know future, so even though i gave some information about this girl Edna in Ednabelle, i also choose to place this at position

    Chapter 18, Sentence 65,i choose to place letters DNA only at this place in the whole book out of 6236 sentences.

     

    to correspond the year in future when science of DNA will be officially started in year 1865

     

    this is how quranic nummerical programming works, giving double information

     

    what is the chance that this occur by coincidence

     

    it is 1/6236 = 0.00016 %


  2.  

    H,A,L,L,Y 

     

    The alif ALONE (without connection to the letter before of after) is a double a (AA). If you take after the H, then it can be A or another vowel, because there's no diacritics.

     

    HALLY, HAALLY, or HELLY

     

    By the way, general 76 orbital year it's doubtful because it can be also 75 years isn't ?

     

    75.3 a

      

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halley%27s_Comet 

     

     

    it's doubtful
     

     

    i say Alif stand for one letter not two letters, get this once for all.

     

    next time you insist i want clear proof from you for that and if you dont bring it your post will be deleted

     

     

    NASA website

    http://science.nasa.gov/science-news/science-at-nasa/2015/01may_halleyids/

     

    May 5, 2015:  As May of 2015 unfolds, Halley's Comet is more than 5 billion kilometers from Earth, receding into the inky blackness of the outer solar system, where its looping orbit takes it every 76 years.  Dim and distant, history's most famous comet won't be back until sometime in 2061.


  3. No; Alif is a double A

     

    is not Islam; is islAAm

     

     

    Oh, so you believe "I'm playing with words". DNA or DNO  :rolleyes:

     

    not true, Alif is one letter, not two letters AA

     

    and if yo ustill continue to insist in that show us proof that one letter Alif is like two AA, if you insist in your claims without proof i will delete your posts , just so you know that.

     

     

    Oh, so you believe "I'm playing with words". DNA or DNO 

     

    if there is something called DNO and something wich can support it from the text or the chapter and verse position, then show me

     

    you dont remeber what i told you today, when i claim something i have backup to support it what i claim, for me it would not mean anything letters DNA if they where not on correct position


  4.  

    letters DNA ?

     

    Not really... دنا = D-N-AA  (or D-N-O, or D-N-I, or D-N-E, or D-N-I if you believe alif can be vowel...)

     
    Twisting word to fit your alleged foretold narrative is weird.

     

    there is no DNAA, only DNA

     

    there is only one Alif there, if you dont believe me ask any arab speaker and see what he will tell you how many alifs are there.

     

    and you call me a joke, while you invet extra letter wich does not exist, only tro debunk me  :no: ooh man...


  5.  

    No. Look:
     
    "The genetic experiments Mendel did with pea plants took him eight years (1856-1863)" [http://www.dnaftb.org/1/bio.html]
     
    "he published his results in 1865" [http://www.dnaftb.org/1/bio.html]. You can connect if you want year 1865 with the begin of Genetic, but I consider Genetic starting in 1866 because is the year of
     

    Gregor Mendel (1822-1884) publishes "Experiments in Plant Hybridisation," establishing basic laws of inheritance [http://www.genomenewsnetwork.org/resources/timeline/1866_Mendel.php]
     
    Indeed, it would be very indisputable a miracle if the dna word can be found in Qu'ran 18/69 because: 
     
    "A historical account of the discovery of DNA in 1869" (http://www.bizgraphic.ch/miescheriana/html/the_man_who_dicovered_dna.html)
     
     
     

     

     

    i said officially science of genetics began year 1865

     

    http://www.npr.org/news/specials/dnaanniversary/

     

    A Brief History of DNA's Discovery

     

    1865 Gregor Mendel, in experiments with peas, theorizes about how traits are passed on from one generation to the next. 

     

    1869 Swiss Scientist Friedrich Miescher isolates a material in cells that will eventually become known as "deoxyribonucleic acid" or DNA. He calls it "nuclein."

     

    1909 German geneticist Wilhelm Johannsen coins the term "gene" to describe units of heredity.

     

    1911 America scientist Thomas Hunt Morgan shows that these units of heredity are located on chromosomes. He receives the Nobel Prize in 1933.

     

    1929 American biochemist Phoebus Levene determines the chemical makeup of DNA, identifying its four bases - - adenine, cytosine, guanine and thymine.

     

    1943 English biochemist William Astbury makes the first X-ray diffraction images of DNA's structure.

     

    1952 Work with viruses and bacteria by American scientists Alfred Hershey and Martha Chase supports the theory that genes are made of DNA.

     

    1953 At Cavendish Laboratory at Cambridge, Francis Crick and James Watson describe the double helix structure of DNA and suggest how genetic material is copied. Their idea of a double helix formation is based on X-ray diffraction images made by Kings College's Rosalind Franklin, who was part of a lab led by Maurice Wilkins. Watson, Crick and Wilkins receive the Nobel Prize in 1962.

     

     

    https://books.google.se/books?id=2rfMBQAAQBAJ&pg=PA1&lpg=PA1&dq=DNA+history+1865&source=bl&ots=lH7oWKn-cn&sig=aZZRoEI6eqWwdVDUGVIxYdWa0-M&hl=sv&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjh59_9n77LAhVqP5oKHfoMDLk4ChDoAQhPMAc#v=onepage&q=DNA%20history%201865&f=false

     

    izbxjt.jpg

    • Like 1

  6.  

    Not really: http://corpus.quran.com/wordbyword.jsp?chapter=18&verse=65#(18:65:1)

     

    "waʿallamnāhu min ladunnāʿil'man = and We had taught him from Us a knowledge

     

    There's no clarification about.

     

    "And they found a servant from among Our servants to whom we had given mercy from us and had taught him from Us a [certain] knowledge." (http://quran.com/18/65)

     

    Again, your forced translation "OF OUR OWN" in order to fit your "prophecy about DNA" is made-up.

     

    By the way I can twist the Qu'ran in order to make him foretold the invention of the train. Look:

     

    "And a sign for them is that We carried their forefathers in a laden ship." (http://quran.com/36/41)

    "And We created for them from the likes of it that which they ride." (http://quran.com/36/42)

     

    letters DNA are there, ask any arabic speaker and see what he will tell you


  7. False; look here http://arabic.tripod.com/Arab20.htm

     

    [i do not know how post files and screenshots so I invite you to read the web]

     

    There a square with all the values:

     

    Alif is LONG A, and in Arabic Online Romanization the writing is AA.

     

    So yes, isn't H,A,L,L,Y BUT H,A,A,L,L,Y

     

     

     

     

     

     I can say H,A,A,L,L,Y have 6 words !!, which I can connect to the number of chapter.

     

    Like the exemple of NTRN and number 7/143; if the number of the verse (143) was'nt fulfilled, you could manage to fit the random connection whith 7, 71, 714, 7143, 14, ... you choose it, the only rule is that it must have a connection.

     

     

    dont play games with me, i say there is no extra A written between H and A

     

    look for yourself

     

    6:76 فلما جن عليه الليل راى كوكبا قال هذا ربي فلما افل قال لااحب الافلي

     

    AeLyH ALLYL

     

    Quran in arabic

    http://www.answering-christianity.com/cgi-bin/quran/quran_search.cgi?search_text=&search_type=The+Entire+Noble+Quran&arabic=1&B1=Search

     

    if you cant speak arabic nor read you are not in position to teach me how it is written


  8. Hi Andalusi

     

    The point isn’t that there are differences, that goes without saying, the point is that neither technique works unless the subject believes even if the believer and the non-believer are presenting with the same behaviours before the exorcism.  Belief is the key here not the rituals or the symptoms.  That’s telling I’d have to suggest.

     

    Russell

     

    let me explain how i felt physically when i tried exorcism long time ago, just to see if that is fake or something real

     

    when recitation began, i felt these stuff, my eyelids move very fast, i felt something pulled me back like magnet, i felt presure in some parts of the body, my arms levitated, i felt something moved under my skin.

     

    so how do you explain that a simple recitation of text could have such impact on my body phisically, this was most shocking and supernatural experience in my life. this is nothing mental stuff, this is physical impact, not mental impact on mean. for the first time i could feel with my body supernatural power, then i thought, whaaaaaaaaaaat is this book????? how powerful is this book actually??

     

    so if you can explain how recitation of quran could make me feel thse stuff physically , go for it :)


  9. I not claim there's no numerical patterns. 

     

    19-coded miracle is one of them

     

    But I'm very skeptic to these TELEVISION, DNA, HALLEY, and so on.

     

     

     

    But I'm very skeptic to these TELEVISION, DNA, HALLEY, and so on.

     

    why, you see all thse words have backup, something wich support that it is indeed that and nothing else

     

    for exanmple

     

    letters DNA can only be found 3 times only in verse 18:65 ---> year 1865 began science of genetics (DNA) by gregor mendel officially when he had his presentation of his findings on a university.

     

    in same chapter DNA letters are found totally 7 times, and we find also RNA letters also 7 times in same chapter, and we know that in quran similar stuff are mentioned same number of times, like woman-man. angel-devil, this world-next world , wine-drunk and so on...

     

    RNA is

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RNA

    Ribonucleic acid (RNA) is a polymeric molecule implicated in various biological roles in codingdecodingregulation, and expression of genes. RNA and DNA are nucleic acids, and, along with proteins and carbohydrates, constitute the three major macromolecules essential for all known forms of life. Like DNA, RNA is assembled as a chain of nucleotides, but unlike DNA it is more often found in nature as a single-strand folded onto itself, rather than a paired double-strand. Cellular organisms use messenger RNA (mRNA) to convey genetic information (using the letters G, U, A, and C to denote the nitrogenous bases guanineuraciladenine, and cytosine) that directs synthesis of specific proteins. Many viruses encode their genetic information using an RNA genome.

     

     

    and not only that

     

    even text itself talks about giving knowledge to a human being

    18:65 and found one of Our servants- a man to whom We had granted Our mercy and whom We had given knowledge of Our own.

     

    discovering science of genetics is indeed great knowledge given from God to a man, God dont nede to talk and come personally to talk to human being, all he need to do is, say Be and idea clicks in your mind, and you get "Ahaaaaaaa" feeling  :D


  10. What I means is:

     

    1/ Alif can be also long A; so between H,A,L,L,Y and H,A,A,L,L,Y is a kinda difference

     

    2/ You claim that <<but Alif can be used for vocals>> so why not H,E,L,L,Y or H,U,L,LY ? You makes the rules...

     

    3/ As explained before, combining letters and numbers you can make many miracles, which 143 is an example: if was not 143 but 165 you will maybe able to relate the numero to another foretold fact

     

    4 / Is like I come here and reading word kawkab and reading 676 I tell you this foretold Melitta 676 (https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/(676)_Melitta) which is a kawkab and so related to the numbers.

     

     

     

    1/ Alif can be also long A; so between H,A,L,L,Y and H,A,A,L,L,Y is a kinda difference

     

    there is no extra A between H and A, only one alif, so only one A is there

     

     

     

     

    2/ You claim that <<but Alif can be used for vocals>> so why not H,E,L,L,Y or H,U,L,LY ? You makes the rules...

     

    the answer is, chapter and verse position explains more what it is

     

    beacuse meaningful connection bwteen chapter number 6 and verse number 76 points towards halley comet

     

    we have 4 things wich points towards halley comet

     

    1. word Hally ---> Halley

    2. Word Kawkab---->celestial object wich need light to be seen, planet, asteroids, comets, metheors and so on

    3. Verse 76---> halley comet orbit around the sun 76 years

    4. Chapter 6--->  6 different orbital years of halley comet (74, 75, 76, 77, 78, 79) trough history

     

    so 4 different things points towards halley comet

     

     

     

    3/ As explained before, combining letters and numbers you can make many miracles, which 143 is an example: if was not 143 but 165 you will maybe able to relate the numero to another foretold fact

     

    if there is no connection you cant find anything

     

     

     

    4 / Is like I come here and reading word kawkab and reading 676 I tell you this foretold Melitta 676 (https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/(676)_Melitta) which is a kawkab and so related to the numbers.

     

    as i told you 4 different stuff points towards halley comet

     

    and not melitta, beacuse melita word cant be find in the text while halley=hally can be found, that is why you assutmption is wrong 


  11. Yeah... according to your logic !

     

    The Qur'an have consonant letters and numbered ayats.

     

    Twisting the two (by mix up letters, relating to the numbers of the ayats) we can produce many "miracles", and this is why this topic, the "foretold phenomenon" is a joke.

    Trust me it does not work like that. If there is no numerical pattern then you cant find it no matter how hard i try, i have search for some specific numerical programing but i have not find what i have searched for, i cant make it up to delude you and myself. But that which i present here that is for sure numerical miracles


  12. Of course NTRN are fund only in the Qu’ran, in the 18/39 because is a made-up word !

     

     

    Joining the “N” of  “iN” with the “TRN” from verbal “TRaNi” [from root ر أ ي which means “see, show”].

     

     

    But your joke fails because we can make others NTRN which others ayats.

     

     

    See http://quran.com/7/143

     

     

    لَن تَرَانِي → Lan tarani → laN TaRaNi → NTRN

     

     

    Of course wit the numbers 7 and 143 I expect you will make another dumb claim…

     

     

     

    Of course NTRN are fund only in the Qu’ran, in the 18/39 because is a made-up word !

    how is it made up

     

    letters NTRN in this construction are found only at this place, and it is most pure for using for neutron

     

    but your finding NTR(ALIF)N -->NTRAN

     

    is also valid word for neutron beacuse consonants are in correct order

     

    According to my logic NTRAN is ok word for neutron, but someone can say, letter A is between R and N, and we know that neutron has O between R and N, but Alif can be used for vocals, A, I, E, U , since letter O does not exist in arabic, we can say we can use even alif for 

     

    If we want to see if there is connection between verse or chapter with neutron, we can see one similarity, like that verse is 143, and Atomic Bombs wich fell over Hiroshima nad Nagasaki had Uranium 235 wich had 143 Neutrons, Uran 235, with 143 neutrons is used in atomic bombs.

     

     

    1-uranium.jpg

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uranium-235

    Neutrons 143

     

    if this is something judge for yourself


  13. Twisting words in order to support your pro-miracles agenda isn't really fair. But is how apologism works.

     

    اللَّيْلُ عَلَيْهِ These are the two words which you give the claim.

     

     

    From the first word (ʿalayhi) you have cutted all the letters at least the last, the ه , which you twist to the others letters of word (al-laylu) ا ل ل ي cutting the last ل in order to make your magical happening.

     

     

    Of course, being a made-up "miracle" why do you expect it occurs in any other particular place?  :huh:

     

    And who says that it must be done like you want? So subjective.

     

    No one prevent you to believe this is a “numerical programmed fact” or “encoded one”; but there are people, like me, who not believe in this made-up “miracles”. 

     

     

    اللَّيْلُ عَلَيْهِ These are the two words which you give the claim.

     

     

    From the first word (ʿalayhi) you have cutted all the letters at least the last, the ه , which you twist to the others letters of word (al-laylu) ا ل ل ي cutting the last ل in order to make your magical happening.

     

    it is written like this

     

    ALYH  ALLYL

     

    so

     

    A,L,Y,H,A,L,L,Y,L


  14. Hi Andalusi

     

    Well it was a long boring half hour but I’ve listened to the first half hour of that video and nothing happened.  Might have been more interesting if even one word of it was in English.  Of course I may not have a Jinn I suppose.  I posted the link on an atheist board I frequent and a number there said that they’d done a similar experiment and nothing happened and three of them watched that video and again nothing happened.  Maybe atheists are immune from Jinn.  There’s always an out which makes this claim untestable but see if you can think of a test that doesn’t give you such a simple out as “you don’t have a Jinn”.  Are you aware of the long history of Christian exorcisms etc based on the same idea, that some words will affect the ‘devil’ inside the possessed person and force it out.  Such rituals only ever work on believers which seems telling to me.

     

    Russell

     

    yes, there is a difference between Islamic and christian exoricism, christian exorcism is done by sining while Islamic exorcism is done without sining if you only do it by quran recitation.

    while christian joinpartners to God wich is most greatest sin they can do, and they do it trough the christian exorcism


  15. Donald you don't know who is Andalusi.

     

    Is a Bosnian apologist which own his channel in Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/user/skakvac

     

    Is also user called "Dawud" in Answering Christianity's Forum and he adressed a challenge to a skeptical user to make a odd-even miracle.

     

    Read here the challenge: http://www.answering-christianity.com/blog/index.php?topic=1999.0;all

     

    Of course "Dawud" have lost.

     

    how has Dawud lost, tell us  :D


  16. First the word Halley don't come, is making by joining the hāʾ to ﺍ ل ل ي from word al-laylu. Is a good deceitful skill, but you must find more impressive mixing-word subjects.

     

    Rather than comet, and rather than Halley comet, Ibrahim is watching a kawkab who is setting: the only kawkab who is watching is planet Venus, which have a comet-like atmosphera, which give you the impression of watching a comet.

     

    But is very good chose the example with the number 76. But I accept this being a scientific miracle (or a foretold one) only in a no-doubtous example, which will have if the sentence will have find in sura 7 and aya 6.

     

    This is why I think you are a joke. You can doing mental gymnastics if you want.

     

     

     

     

    "letters for name Halley can be found in that verse 76 in chapter 6 next to the word kawkab"

     

    No, they can't be found, but you can arrange it to create them. 

     

    consonant letters for halley and some vocals can be found in two words next to each other written like this

    AeLyH ALLY

     

    only in one verse in the whole quran, in verse 76 in chapter 6

     

     

    6ifihk.jpg

    normally halley comet has 76 years, but beacuse of gravitatinoal field of the sun and planets it has varied trough history from 74 to 79 years, 6 years= (74, 75, 76, 77, 78, 79)

    and chapter is 6, so, we have actually meaningful verse 76 wich is normal oribital period of the halley comet and meaningful chapter 6th chapter = 6 different orbital years, Letters Hally (halley) Kawkab(celestial object wich needs light from star to be seen) are found only in that verse

     next to each other only in verse 76

     

    So it is wrong to use different words to program future events?

     

    this is not only case we have also another example

     

    in verse 18:39, two words are found with these letters next to each other

     

    IN TRN = "if you see" 

     

    NTRN are consonant letter for neutron, what does it tells us that it talk about neutron, it is chapter and verse position, 18:39

    and science tells us that neutron is 1,839 times heavier than an electron

     

    letter NTRN are found only in this verse 18:39 in the whole quran out of 6236 verses.

     

     

     

    But I accept this being a scientific miracle (or a foretold one) only in a no-doubtous example, which will have if the sentence will have find in sura 7 and aya 6.

     

    This is why I think you are a joke. You can doing mental gymnastics if you want.

     

    who says that it must be done like this 7th chapter 6th verse

     

    why not put it like this

     

    6 chapter = 6 different orbital years of halley comet (74, 75, 76, 77, 78, 79) trough history

    76 verse = 76 years , normal orbital year of halley comet when it is stabilised

    • Like 1

  17. there is no natural explanation of such info in one book, it points towards God.

     

    You mean, that you do not have a natural explanation... It points toward your god only once you've stopped looking.

     

    let say, that it is not from God, then i ask you who can program the

    text and verses to correspond of future events wich will happen in the

    future?

     

    This is a common (often religious) response to many problems.

    We are yet to explain how life arose out of inanimate matter (God must have done it).

    Subject A is so complicated that no human I know, could comprehend it (therefore, God must have done it).

     

    he was not dumb, he was illitarate, that is huge difference.

     

    There is no evidence that he could read or write, but we have

    historical and quranic evidence that he could not read nor write. Adn

    even if he could read and write he could never write such amazing quran

    beacuse humans cant know what will happen in the future to program it in

    the book.

     

    If he could read and write, his enemies would say, you are writing

    this by yourself, or you are copying this from the books you read, but

    they never said that, even though they tried to find an explanation for

    the quranic verses.They knew that he was illitarate and if he was not

    illitarate he could never write quran beacuse of impossibility of

    programing future events in the text and verses

     

    It doesn't sound as though you know for sure what sort of person you're dealing with...

    And if such details are blurry for the die-hard believers amongst you, then what hope do I have?

     

    It is a very large step for me to say that Muhammed simply 'made it all up' out of blood lust,

    sexual desire or hallucinations brought about by sensory deprivation, fasting and/or strife.

    But it seems infinitely more probable to me, that some combination of these factors created Muhammed's Islam.

     

    Just because you can't understand it... Doesn't mean that God did it.

     

     

    Subject A is so complicated that no human I know, could comprehend it (therefore, God must have done it).

     

    there is no other explanation than God

     

    if you have any other explanation the show me

     

     

     

    It is a very large step for me to say that Muhammed simply 'made it all up' out of blood lust,

    sexual desire or hallucinations brought about by sensory deprivation, fasting and/or strife.

    But it seems infinitely more probable to me, that some combination of these factors created Muhammed's Islam.

     
     

    since when halussionation and sexual desires na fasting created such skill to come up with scientific facts wich will be discovered in future, program text numerically, prophecied future events and many many other stuff. since when could mental problems create such magnificent book??

     

    there is apsolutely no proof for your claim, that is just assumption without 0 proof.


  18. [at]Donald

     

    You must understand that this guy, Andalusi, is a joke.

     

    The guy claim taht in the 6.76 Qur'an foretold the Halley comet by creating <<Helley>> from mixed Arabic words; then the dude believe he can confuse people saying word kawkab means planet or comet.

     

    Well, this desperate apologetic create his own rules which I not recognize because:

     

    1/ Being a TRULY miracle of the foretold of Halley comet must being in sura 7 aya 6. Then, if this is being concluded, there is no doubts. But the apologetic claim that is God who choose the location and other bla bla bla.

     

    2/  Word kawkab means also planet. And, in fact, I think Ibrahim watched Venus, because is a planet (kawkab) with a comet-like atmosphere : http://www.space.com/19537-venus-comet-atmosphere.html

     

    3/ Finally, the claim that kawkab must means celestial body is not completely shared by Arabs because:

     

    "We must also realize that at the time the Qur’ân was reveled, the Arabic word used in the verse – kawkab – was used to refer to stars as well as to what we consider planets. Restricting the word kawkab to mean planets as opposed to stars was a much later development. In the dictionary al-Qamûs al-Muhît (131), al-Fayrûzabâdî defines a kawkab as a “star” (najm), and indeed the word kawkab was traditionally used interchangeably with najm." 

     

    source: http://en.islamtoday.net/artshow-416-3001.htm

     

    But I will come here to look at the responses offered by the dude. I really enjoy come here and laugh at her.

     

     

     

    The guy claim taht in the 6.76 Qur'an foretold the Halley comet by creating <<Helley>> from mixed Arabic words; then the dude believe he can confuse people saying word kawkab means planet or comet.

     

    but Quran explain in one verse what kind of object is a kawkab, that is an object wich needs light from outside to be seen, tose objects are planets, moon, asteroids, metheors, comets

    if there is no light from the sun we could not see it.

     

     

    letters for name Halley can be found in that verse 76 in chapter 6 next to the word kawkab wich is celestial objects wich needs light from outside to be seen

     

    and we know that halley comet has its orbit around the sun in 76 years

     

    so why am i joke?


  19. Quran came trough prophet Muhammed wich was illitarate, could not read

    nor write, and then we see all these stuff in the Qur'an, for us these

    stuffs are evidence that Qur'an from God and not from humans.

     

    Yes, I understand. Your position is this:

    I cannot understand how the Quran contains such qualities, therefore, my God is real and the Quran is a miracle.

     

    when i see that people can create such structures in their minds without

    using any tools and can make future propechies in their book, then i

    shall stop believe that Qur'an is a miraclous book,.

     

    Okay. But before you do that. You will need to prove beyond a doubt, that Muhammed was as dumb as you say he was (and had no help in the matter).

    That is the only way you can prove to me (& anyone else) that these are miracles: Find a way to logically prove the things you profess, without adopting a position out of ignorance.

     

     

     

    Yes, I understand. Your position is this:

    I cannot understand how the Quran contains such qualities, therefore, my God is real and the Quran is a miracle.

     

    there is no natural explanation of such info in one book, it points towards God.

     

    let say, that it is not from God, then i ask you who can program the text and verses to correspond of future events wich will happen in the future? 

     

     

    Okay. But before you do that. You will need to prove beyond a doubt, that Muhammed was as dumb as you say he was (and had no help in the matter).

    That is the only way you can prove to me (& anyone else) that these are miracles: Find a way to logically prove the things you profess, without adopting a position out of ignorance.

     

    he was not dumb, he was illitarate, that is huge difference.

     

    There is no evidence that he could read or write, but we have historical and quranic evidence that he could not read nor write. Adn even if he could read and write he could never write such amazing quran beacuse humans cant know what will happen in the future to program it in the book.

     

    If he could read and write, his enemies would say, you are writing this by yourself, or you are copying this from the books you read, but they never said that, even though they tried to find an explanation for the quranic verses.They knew that he was illitarate and if he was not illitarate he could never write quran beacuse of impossibility of programing future events in the text and verses


  20. Sorry, Andalusi. I've already seen these examples.

     

    But how is this proof of a god or a miracle?

    How have you moved from a detail that you cannot properly explain, to arguing that 'God must have done it'?

     

     

     

    But how is this proof of a god or a miracle?

     

     

    evidence that Qur'an is from God is based upon 6 points

     

    1. Scientific stuff in the Qur'an wich was discovered in our times

    2. Numerical programing of the Qur'an

    3. Future predictions in the Qur'an

    4.Lingustic miracles of the Qur'an, linguistic structure and simmetry

    5.Historical scientific proofs that Qur'an must come from God

    6. Healing properties of the Qur'an, used in Islamic exorcism

     

    No errors nor contradictions in the Qur'an is also a good point 

     

    I used one out of many example from point 2, Numerical programming of the Qur'an

     

    Quran came trough prophet Muhammed wich was illitarate, could not read nor write, and then we see all these stuff in the Qur'an, for us these stuffs are evidence that Qur'an from God and not from humans.

     

    Who could organise Quran like this only in his mind without any editing process, here is an example so you can understand why it is a miracle

     

    Let say you need to do this:

     

    You have to create such nummerical system only in your head, wihtout using, paper pen, computers or calculus, just only in your head

     

    and your scribers write everything you say and if you say it once, you cant take it back, so there is no editing process.

    Can you create such nummerical programing system in your book only in your mind? is it possible for any human to do something like this in his mind only? That is why this is a miracle, beacuse prophet Muhammed could not read or write, he did not have computers or calculus, when he recited quran verses his scribers wrote it down on different materials and there was no editing process except if scribers write and error and prophet corrects it when a scriber recite back to prphet to check that everything is written correctly. Do you understand now why this is a miracoulus book?

     

     

     

    How have you moved from a detail that you cannot properly explain, to arguing that 'God must have done it'?
     
    everything support that it comes from God, so my belief is based on that
     
    when i see that people can create such structures in their minds without using any tools and can make future propechies in their book, then i shall stop believe that Qur'an is a miraclous book,. 

  21. Hi Andalusi

     

    We’ve been eating pork since before recorded history and people don’t die all the time of cancer or any other cause linked to pork.  I’ve known people who lived into their hundreds and ate pork regularly throughout their lives.  We understand that meat is an issue, if you eat too much of it you increase your chances of suffering from a number of conditions, but in this pork is actually better for you than beef for example, which contains higher levels of damaging fats.  Does god forbid beef?

     

    Does running over a rabbit count as ‘beaten to death’ under Islamic law?  I’ve eaten a number of rabbits killed this way, they were delicious, and I’ve come to no harm from it and why should I. 

     

    Do shell fish count as ‘scaleless fish’?  I’ve eaten plenty of them.  Leather Jackets have no scales but they too are tasty and delicious and again I’ve come to no harm from them. 

     

    Is this all something like “wind farm syndrome” where people who live in areas opposed to windfarms stand a much higher chance of suffering that those who have no issue with the farms.  In fact the primary driver of ‘wind farm syndrome’ is opposition to wind farms not the farms themselves.  In other words is the fear you carry from the Quran really the driver of any issues you may have with these foods?  I don’t suffer at all for eating them but then I don’t carry that fear either.  It’s like the placebo effect in a way, not a real effect but rather an idea driven by the mind which causes issues.  In other words the quran is the driver behind any issues you may experience with these foods.  This idea is certainly consistent with the facts we see on this question.

     

    Russell

     

     

    Why I Do Not Recommend Pork - Nearly 70 Percent Contaminated with Dangerous Pathogens

    By Dr. Mercola

    http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2012/12/12/eating-pork.aspx


  22. Hi Andalusi

     

    That’s exactly it, you don’t believe in evolution because you have never studied it sufficiently to understand it, plenty of people have studied it to that level and they do understand it and so accept it but you don’t.  Do you believe you are incapable of understanding it; that even if you put in the effort to study it that you could never grasp it?  It’s a fascinating field of study, well worth the effort and there is plenty of material online so it’s easy to get into.  If you wish to do so I’d be happy to point you to some good resources to get you started.

     

    I don’t accept Islam because of what I DO understand about it.  It’s not a lack of understanding that produces my disbelief.  I accept evolution for the same reason, I accept it because I understand it and I’ve examined a great deal of evidence for it.  I would never discount an idea I did not understand.

     

    Russell

     

    i have studied evolution more than enough, and it does not convince me expect natural selection, wich is logical (survival of the fittest) but other stuff are not logical without and Evolver(God)

     

    That evolution shall be logical for me, you need to attach and inteligent evolver to it, without God/Evolver it is like factory and products without inteligent engeneers

     

    this is logical

     

    for me

     

    God-->evolution/nature-->product

    Engeneer-->factory--->product

     

    while your belief is like this

     

    Evolution-->product

    Factory-->product

     

    No God no engeneers, can this be logical, to rely upon random events and that those random events create complex smart structures


  23. Hi Andalusi

     

    It is indeed a difficult question but think about this, there are a huge number of possible things which we can’t disprove.  I can’t disprove the idea that there is a teapot orbiting Pluto right now.  Should I therefore believe it?  I can’t think of any way to disprove it but that does not make it real.

     

    I don’t know enough about your claims for Jinn to formulate a test but if a test can’t be conducted then the idea of Jinn becomes worthless and should, like that teapot orbiting Pluto, be discarded as such.  There must be something that a Jinn could accomplish that could not occur by natural means or something that should be true if Jinn exist that should not be true if they did not.

     

    Russell

     

    what about this, that we do an experiment on you, so you can feel them when you are in front of your PC?

     

    stay in front of your, computer, klick on this Qur'an recitation, shut your eyes, focus on the recitation, and relax. Listen this for 30 min

     

    If there are Jinns in your body, you will feel physically their presence, beacuse Qur'an burn them, they start to run inside the body via blood stream, and can cause different reactions, like pressure in different parts of the body, shakings, nossea, and other similar stuff.

     

    If Jinns are inside your body, you will then feel something and for me that is best experimental evidence for the existence of Jinns. What bigger proof to you need than feeling their presence with your body physically.

     

    Try this and write here if your felt something.


  24. Hi Andalusi

     

    So in short you write of the findings of science, well tested, reproducible and mathematically modelled findings from science, because you can’t understand them.  Actually I think what you have trouble understanding would primarily be those things that disagree with you religious preconceptions wouldn’t you agree?  Can you actually think of anything from science that you have trouble accepting that does not contradict your religious beliefs?

     

    As I pointed out before that particular fallacy is called the fallacy of argument from personal incredulity.  There are many things in science that I don’t understand but I’d never write them off because just because I don’t personally understand them.  I’ve found, over and over again, that if I put in the effort to educate myself to the point where I do understand the evidence and theories that the science adds up.  In fact I’ve never found a case where the well accepted scientific theories didn’t add up once I educated myself to the point where I can understand it.  Maybe you should try that.  Find something in science that you don’t currently accept, something that contradicts your deeply held beliefs and get yourself educated.  You may well be surprized by the results.

     

    Russell

     

    i base my belief on what i know and understand, i cant go outside my understand 

     

    if i did not understand Islam i would not beleive in it, or if i understood how evolution could create motors, machines, robots in cells maybe i would believe in evolution. 


  25.  

    15) This one isn’t relevant either.  Neither of these points says anything about how good or bad pork is for human consumption.  I’ve been eating pork all my life as have virtually everyone I know, none of us have ever had any of the problems you complain about so loudly here.  Is that because atheists, agnostics and Christians are immune from such diseases?  Are we physiologically tougher than Muslims and Jews?  Or is it rather that the phobia you have around eating pork is unfounded.  You be the judge!

     

    i ask you this, how can you be so sure that growth hormone and other toxins from the pork dont cause a cancer in he future, after sometime when body cant handle it anymore, maybe your immuine system is good, how can you be so sure that it will not develop some kind of sickness in the future?

     

    So far in my studies , everything God forbids is harmful to us, everything wich is allowed is ok or good for us. that is part of God's wisdom.

    If he forbids pork then it can cause problems for us, maybe stuff happens in the body wich we dont know and develops during many years and then pops up on surface when it is to late.

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