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RAHIMI

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RAHIMI last won the day on September 11 2012

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About RAHIMI

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  1. Refute A Question

    There is always a choice, one could choose to believe in impossibilities, eg that jumping on solid rock 100m down the cliff won't kill you and 'faithfully' jumped. But that is no longer faith, isn't it?
  2. Refute A Question

    Fish & gmc, the gist of what I was trying to convey is that, 'faith' shouldn't involved believing in 'impossibilities' but instead should be based on established knowledge and logic.
  3. Refute A Question

    Fish, OK lets go back to my earlier analogy about jumping off the cliff. Now, if we know and established that down below are solid rock instead of water, would it still be 'faith' that make us jump off? Now, think of the most complex thing created by men, for example a space shuttle. Never in a million years that you would accept that a space shuttle can create itself or appear from nothingness or be built without intellect and wills behind it. Spaceship Earth is million times more in complexities than a puny space shuttle, here we are on spaceship earth moving hundred of thousand miles per hour, the lower atmosphere support breathable are, upper atmospheres provide layers of protection etc. Some 'faith' require one to believe that God become man, weak,suffers from hunger, become ignorant etc. The point here being, some 'faith' require one to believe or accept impossibilities. How could one accept that all these complex systems arise from nothing and without a Creator when the entire human experience says otherwise? How could anyone accept the impossibility that God is All Knowing yet become an ignorant man at the same time? This is the same as jumping off the cliff while believing and having faith that solid rocks won't kill you. You seem to equate 'blind faith' in which one needs to ignore or deny the knowledge,facts and experience with that of real 'faith', which is the one that is based on knowledge and understanding. Hope this makes sense...
  4. Refute A Question

    Fish, as mentioned before, if half the world tells you one thing and the other half yet another, the wise thing to do is to sincerely investigate all evidences to ascertain the truth. To dismiss, ignore or reject is really up to you, a choice that is yours and yours alone to make based on your evidence that you used to support that decision. If you rejections or dismissal is solely based on emotional reasons, i.e you dislike or disagree with the ' consequences ' of accepting or not accepting the 'truth' , then I would to say that the reasoning is rather irrational, given there are many things that we dislike, we dislike death but the fact of the matter is, soon each of us is going to die.. My point is, do not apply false, irrational, or emotional reasoning to justify your choice but instead investigate the evidence with a clear and rational mind without prejudice and preconceived 'truth'.
  5. Refute A Question

    Well Fish, Faith: Imagine jumping off a cliff, first we need evidence and proof that there is water below, the height is safe, no hazard below the surface etc, once we established all these facts, then it is faith that we hold on to once we decided to jump. What you seemed to imply or suggest is that faith has nothing to do with knowledge, evidences, proof etc and therefore dismiss religion based on this flawed perspective. GOD or Allah is not Someone that we could ever comprehend but there are evidences all around us and even within our own self of His Majestic Power and Wills. As Muslims, we believe that Quran is His words and through Quran and the words of the Prophet pbuh that we know Him..
  6. Refute A Question

    Fish, again, you are using false reasoning here, which is, since each of the claim is contradictory to each other; none of them can be true.. The point being, before one jumps into 'faith', truth needs to be established first..DO you see my point?
  7. Refute A Question

    Fish2000, It is one thing to assume that; since everyone claims to have the truth and offers proof for their claim and then conclude that all those claims and proofs are legitimate. They can't be for a simple reason that each of those 'truth' contradicts the other 'truths'. Truth tends to be 'singular' in nature, if you get what I mean. So I find you reasoning a little off here, I'm sorry..
  8. Refute A Question

    Fist2000, religion is faith based and it cannot be proven? Well perhaps for some other religion and beliefs such as Atheism, but in Islam we have proof. For a starter, how about spending a few minutes listening to the clip below? You can follow up the rest by going to the link for the rest..
  9. A Troubling Verse

    Sad Clown, good to see you back here..hope everything is well with you and family ..been a while my friend.. SC, let’s say a bunch of criminals broke into your home, raped and killed your wife and your children, mutilated their bodies to hide their crimes etc. Now let me ask you, not the atheist in you but the deep sense of justice engraved deep within you, would you ever forgive these killers and rapists? If there is such a thing as hell, would these killers deserve nothing less than their skin burn off in it and for every single one of them to rot in hell? If there is such a thing as paradise, where even the lowliest dweller would get something like ten earths combined (hey what is ten earths for the One who Created hundreds of billions of galaxies?), would you ever consider it justice if any of those rapists and killer ended up in Paradise? How long do you think it would take for you to get over what happened? A lifetime? A million years? Would you ever accept 20-40 years in jail as justice for those killers? Our species committed some of the most horrendous and evillest deeds against our own, my example is just to describe and point out to you how our own deep sense of justice demands eternal punishment or how our own self appeals for the harshest punishments over certain crimes. Offer you thoughts on this and what are your answers to some of my questions and IA I’ll make my second point.
  10. The West Vs. Islam

    Padre, at the end of the day, it really does not matter what everyone thinks as it very much depends on what version of 'truth' that one subscribes to. Some Christians of the west for example, think that the Muslims are to be destroyed and eliminated to facilitate the return of their God for an everlasting peace after that, the same with the Jews. Atheists such as yourself think that the sooner they get rid of the religions the sooner the world would evolve into a perfect peaceful paradise..Muslims subscribe to the view that this world is temporary, justice would return for one last time very soon before the end of history as we know it. All these events that happened and are happening would lend credence to each person based very much on what version of truth that he or she subscribes to and the glasses through which that person sees the world from. This begs a question, what is the real truth?..Have you though about that?
  11. Question About Science/quran

    :sl: If we take that the verse in question refers to the sky above the earth, ie what we see or refer to as normal everyday sky, then the Arabs during the time of the Prophet :s: used to believe that the sky was supported by pillars and this verse states that there are no pillars. I remember reading this somewhere..To take a sky as to mean 'roof' is linguistically correct since it is well established by science that our sky acts as some kind of protections against the elements/radiations.
  12. Question About Science/quran

    Science has prove that the sky is not anything physical? Can you show me this proof? Just curios..I mean one part of the sky is made up of atmosphere which is made up of air of various gases with various molecular physical structure etc..? Can you elaborate?
  13. Problems I See With Islam

    :sl: So that we don't get side tracked by the main issues of this thread, let me address or clarify my previous point: Workingman, I take it dense=thick=stupid? Anyway English is my second language so bear with me and allow me to try again. Let say you live in a village where the paint colour of your house is of great importance and everyone has to get the right colour based on time and period, and let say that each changes in the commandments in Christianity represent the changes of the colour of your house. Jesus pbuh says no swine/pork, your council/Paul say pork is OK, colour changes, Jesus pbuh was circumcised, Paul says no circumcision necessary, another colour change, Jesus pbuh prostrating you said kneelling has the same effect..another change. The point being, if the ‘colour’ changes is a norm in Christianity and readily accepted and justified by you, it makes no sense whatsoever to find it problematic that somebody else (a much respected and trusted person) comes along and say the right colour is now green not red simply because it differs from yours since the concept of changes is pretty much the norm and well accepted within Christianity, get me?. To carry this point further, the fact that since everyone in your village believe the world is flat, saying you find it problematic that other people believe the world is round does not make what you believe in to be true and what others believe is false. Does this make sense? What I'm trying to say is, your argument and reasoning is flawed and invalid and therefore it shouldn't stand in your way in establishing the truth. The fact that you find it problematic that there is no 'rest' day is Islam does not mean anything..Retract this and we can move on to your next point. Workingman, a recent academic study puts Alcohol well ahead of the other ‘hardcore’ drugs such as heroin, morphine etc in term of the ‘cost’ to any single society..google it. It is also well established fact that alcohol is a prominent factor in cases such as domestic violence, traffic accidents, various health related problems etc. Just about every single health organizations in the world today, USA included, specifies zero alcohol intake during pregnancy. One does not have to be too dense to figure out that the harm of alcohol far outweighs the benefit and the banning of alcohol consumption all together make sense. Just to be clear that Muslims would not consume alcohol for simple enough reason, that it was prohibited by Allah and not because of the harms and benefits. Nevertheless the fact that it is agreeable to common sense,rationality, intellect and science is fairly interesting, don't you think? Here's one link: http://www./cbnnews/healthscience/2010/November/Study-Alcohol-Most-Dangerous-Drug/
  14. Problems I See With Islam

    :sl: Salam, Brother: Messenger of Allah, (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) said: "When Allah loves a slave, He calls Jibril (Gabriel) and says: `I love so-and-so; so love him.' And then Jibril loves him. Then he (Jibril) announces in the heavens saying: Allah loves so-and-so; so love him; then the inhabitants of the heavens (the angels) also love him; and then people on earth love him. And when Allah hates a slave, He calls Jibril and says: `I hate so-and-so, so hate him.' Then Jibril also hates him. He (Jibril) then announces amongst the inhabitants of heavens: `Verily, Allah hates so-and-so, so you also hate him.' Thus they also start to hate him. Then he becomes the object of hatred on the earth also". [Al-Bukhari and Muslim]. From this hadith, it is obvious that Allah loves His pious slaves and He hates those who transgressed, who choose falsehood over truth and those who committed clear shirks such as what the Christians are doing, saying Jesus pbuh is God, son of God etc. Brother, you are new here so perhaps you are a little quick to judge, whereas Br. Younes has been here for a number of years. You don’t like the ‘tone’ of his response to Workingman and Augustine, my take as a long time observer is, many of the ‘issues’ & questions brought up by both Workingman and Augustine are basically pretty much a rerun or a recycles of the same old previous ones which had been rebutted, clarified, and explained with clear evidence etc by so many posters herebefore, and most of the times the answers were made so clear that any sincere person would ‘see’ or admit to the truth. Yet we see the same things been brought up again and again by both of them and we can’t blame people for doubting their sincerity, perhaps they are ‘fishing’ for some gullible Muslims or perhaps they work in the church and it is of their own self interest that they propagate Christianity, I don’t know. This perhaps would explain the rather lackluster or ‘unkind’ response. I had also observed and known Br. Younes over the years and it is my personal opinion that he is a pious Muslim and he speaks with knowledge. Brother, you are a new revert and you know how much we love you. A couple of things to share, 1 please do not speak with hostility to your own brother, since if that brother turns out to be a pious person and beloved to Allah, then you risk the anger of Allah: Messenger of Allah (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) said, "Allah, the Exalted, has said: `I will declare war against him who treats with hostility a pious worshipper of Mine…” Al-Bhukhari. 2. Knowledge and guidance bestowed upon us are solely due to the mercy of Allah and the sure and quick way to lose that would be arrogance, as that is one trait of Iblis and that is what turned him from being the righteous slave to an accursed shaytan. Do not put yourself above others no matter how certain you are. Please do not take this the wrong way :cool: as I am saying this as a brother to you..Have you penned down you journey to Islam? I would love to read about that..
  15. Problems I See With Islam

    Partial forgiveness? You quoted one verse, conveniently ignored the rest and made judgement on Allah? Read again : (166) Lo! those who disbelieve and hinder (others) from the way of Allah, they verily have wandered far astray. (167) Lo! those who disbelieve and deal in wrong, Allah will never forgive them, neither will He guide them unto a road, (168) Except the road of hell, wherein they will abide for ever. And that is ever easy for Allah. (169) O mankind! The messenger hath come unto you with the Truth from your Lord. Therefor believe; (it is) better for you. But if ye disbelieve, still, lo! unto Allah belongeth whatsoever is in the heavens and the earth. Allah is ever Knower, Wise. All mankind, no exception, would be forgiven and guided if they accept the truth, what partiality are you talking about?
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