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American Christians Protest Crusades Movie

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Christian conservatives to do battle against crusader film -25/04/05

 

Christian conservatives in America are marshalling their forces against Sir Ridley Scott’s forthcoming crusader epic, The Kingdom of Heaven, claiming the film is insulting and unfair.

 

A spate of hostile reviews that are due to appear in the increasingly influential religious press this week will urge American Christians to avoid the £100m film, reports the Sunday Times.

 

But the groups set to oppose the film, may find themselves facing further charges of hypocrisy.

 

Christian support for Mel Gibson's 'The Passion of the Christ', which contained graphic violence, was supported by many religious figures who had previously condemned other films for their violent content.

 

The Kingdom of Heaven features violence perpetrated by Christians during the crusades, which many churches may rather ignore and forget.

 

Full article in the link below:

"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_www.ekklesia.co.uk/content/news_syndication/article_050425kingdom.shtml"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_www.ekklesia.co.uk/content/news_syn...25kingdom.shtml[/url]

 

:D

 

Do we have sympathy for these people? I personally don't. The fact that these people appear to be supporters of the passionately anti-Muslim Christian fanatics Jerry Falwell and Pat Buchanan means I care nothing for their concerns.

Besides, they all turned up to watch the sickening 'Passion of Christ' and they loved it, so why should they have any problem with this movie?

 

If it is historically accurate then I have no problem with the movie. I suspect that it IS accurate, hence why so many Christians are angered by it - they don't want the world to know of the crimes the Crusaders committed in the name of their religion.

Edited by Deus ex machina

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Muslims have also qualms with this movie. There are alot of offensive things in there, but for your typical "dying to be a western" Muslim it will be difficult to realise.

 

Dont be fooled wiht the high prodcution values, its better to read a good book by a muslim scholar on The Great Salaudin Ayyubi as opposed to this hollywood film

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Muslims have also qualms with this movie. There are alot of offensive things in there, but for your typical "dying to be a western" Muslim it will be difficult to realise.

 

Dont be fooled wiht the high prodcution values, its better to read a good book by a muslim scholar on The Great Salaudin Ayyubi as opposed to this hollywood film

salam wa alikum ,

i agree with you here, its better to read from a muslim rather then money making hollywood, do you know any books then i can buy?

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It is a great example of hypocrisy. Those that refuse to recognize the bad things done in the past are doomed to repeat them. If these people don't believe that Christians did evil things during the crusades then they are nothing but ignorant.

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That may be an interesting movie to see. Here in the West, the Crusades were read about in school and then pretty much forgotten. We even have started using the word more commonly for other things, like a crusade against lung cancer.

 

Christian Conservatives have a right to voice their opinion as does everyone else. It would be very difficult to find any movie with the accuracy of a history book. Movies bend the truth in order to sell tickets. Those who are offended by the bending tend to voice their complaints.

 

Movie makers have a right to make pretty much any kind of movie they feel people would like well enough to buy a ticket. Let's hope Sir Scott fares better than Van Gogh.

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salam wa alikum ,

i agree with you here, its better to read from a muslim rather then money making hollywood, do you know any books then i can buy?

 

Salam i dont know of a good of the top of my head. the books i have are good, but not recommended in terms of readability ( pakistani style english ! lol ) If i do find out ill let you know bro. :D

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That may be an interesting movie to see.  Here in the West, the Crusades were read about in school and then pretty much forgotten.  We even have started using the word more commonly for other things, like a crusade against lung cancer.

 

Christian Conservatives have a right to voice their opinion as does everyone else.  It would be very difficult to find any movie with the accuracy of a history book.  Movies bend the truth in order to sell tickets.  Those who are offended by the bending tend to voice their complaints.

 

Movie makers have a right to make pretty much any kind of movie they feel people would like well enough to buy a ticket.  Let's hope Sir Scott fares better than Van Gogh.

 

Gill...actually your're wrong Cinema owners decide which films they will

show...hence free speach needs a media and when the media is controlled

by the biased censors....

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Cinema owners show the films that they think will sell tickets. I they think noone will want to see it then they won't play it, and vice versa. The only bias cinema owners have is money.

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Gill...actually your're wrong Cinema owners decide which films they will

  show...hence free speach needs a media and when the media is controlled

  by the biased censors....

I could be wrong, it happened once before :D

 

Actually I think Livius has it right.

 

I seem to be missing your point. The censors who allow the type of things we see on the big screen today are more concerned about the Crusades?

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I doubt there is any motivation other than box office sales that determine what movies are presented . As far as the Big Screen - there is virtually no censorship . Tv is another issue .

Those who make movies for the most part do so to make money--that's the point of making them . There are however movies made such as documentaries that have other purposes besides making money .

Cinema owners lease the movies that will fill up their movie houses -period .

 

I know of no censorship of Hollywood movies made for the big screen in the U S .

As far as the Kingdom of Heaven ? It is indicitive of the times , as far as interest in such a subject is concerned .

 

Has anyone seen the movie titled "Osama " -dont know who made it , happened to flip through the channels one night on HBO .

I was surprised because it was in Arabic language with English subtitles .

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As someone on this board said to me: why bring up old wounds?

 

Islam had invaded numerous countries, then a few hundred years later, Christianity decided to fight back.

 

Simple. Don't let the political stuff get in the way. Its all history, right?

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It is a great example of hypocrisy.  Those that refuse to recognize the bad things done in the past are doomed to repeat them.  If these people don't believe that Christians did evil things during the crusades then they are nothing but ignorant.

:D

 

Totally agree there Livius!

 

One way to expose hypocrisy is by asking a question like; why someone believes that they do not have to comply with the very same standards, like ones that they even claim are for everyones best interests?

 

You might be attacked there by accusations that you are crazy, yet while they will be behaving like it.

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why should it be offensive? It happened, that is a fact. We need to learn from history, we should not shed away from it or pretnd it never happened.

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Peace be with you all,

 

I just returned from seeing this film. I don't see why people feel it is unfair. It is not attempting to depict history. It is a fictitious story placed in the backdrop of the Crusades. It portrays both sides having elements of fanatical, self-righteous individuals and sincere, humble forthright individuals. Ultimately it is a play for tolerance which is the primer virtue of the secular world. People who desire to see the world in Black and White terms will not like this film. Honestly, they will not like most people.

 

Peace 4 Real.

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Peace and happiness to everyone,

 

Hi, Curiousbud,

 

Sure, we have to learn from history and from the crusades, as long as we do not ACT like if the crusades were still going on. Bin Laden and many more say that.

 

As I see it, they are not learning from the Middles Ages, but are still living there with their mind, even if their bodies are here.

 

Cheers.

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Or in other words, we need a crusade against the crusades. :D

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Ultimately it is a play for tolerance which is the primer virtue of the secular world.

Your statement really got me thinking. A large percentage of threads seem to have tolerance as an underlying issue.

 

It was really a nice surprise to see you posting here again.

 

gill

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I really dont think it is based on true facts. I once watched a programme on the BBC talking about the crusades, and particularly about Richard the Lion Heart, well, needless to say, when they reached to the time of the battle between the Muslims and the crusaders when the Richard was captured as prisoner, the historians that were interviewed suddenly developed amnesia and claimed that “for unclear reasons†Richard decided to head back to England! Just like that, no battle, no loss, no capture, no meeting with Salahudeen…etc. Just before Richard reaches his goal, just outside of Jerusalem, he sits around for a few months and then decides to go home! Good thing they didn’t say he was the victor!

 

That was a scientific programme that very few watch, do you really think they will be more truthful in a Movie? I don’t think so.

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Assalamu'alaikum Wa Rahmatullah,

 

Kingdom of Heaven is an enjoyable film. I have seen it and I find nothing wrong with it as an artist portrayal of a time long ago and largely lost in the winds of the desert. What artistic flourishes are found are merely that, artistic flourishes.

 

I try to be non-partisan when it comes to history. It is the past; I live now, let us look to the future. Ameen.

 

Barak'Allah!

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i hae seen the movie twice now, once with my friend and once with my brother. i came home and my had come over to escape her fathers house for the weekend, and she was bashing the movie for its pro-muslim take, i spent the next hour first calming her down, and using the internet plus my limited knowledge of the crusades to show her the truth. that christianity or more to the point the europeans were the aggressors. i do not know if this type of movie is viewable under Islamic rules but i do reccomend that you see it, because in my humble opinion it paints a very fair picture.

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Assalamu'alaikum little-mahdi,

 

It is good to see a post of yours. Now I must see the movie.

 

"Lost in the winds of the desert", beautifully put. If only the conflicts of our fathers would become lost in the past and not haunt us in the present, the holy now.

 

I hope you are well.

 

gill

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Assalamu'alaikum little-mahdi,

 

It is good to see a post of yours.  Now I must see the movie.

 

Wa'salaamu'alaikum gill,

 

It is good to see a post of yours as well my good friend!

 

"Lost in the winds of the desert", beautifully put.  If only the conflicts of our fathers would become lost in the past and not haunt us in the present, the holy now.

 

Thank you my good friend, you are always too kind to me. I am humbled before your generosity. Thank you kindly.

 

Truly "now" is holy. It is the only period of time one can show compassion, forgiveness, mercy and love. Truly "now" is the time for these things if ever was. It has always been so and will ever be. Ameen.

 

I hope you are well.

 

Ah, were it so. Unfortunately, I am not all that well but Allah has blessed us all the time we are given let us be thankful and use that time wisely. Ameen.

 

Wa'Alaikum'salaam

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I finally had the opportunity to see "Kingdom of Heaven".

 

The very begining of the movie flashes the date, sometime in the twelfth century. I could not help but think about this being the time when the knowledge of Aristitotle and his Greek buddies was just starting to reach the West. It would be three hundred years until the reformation.

 

This must have been a difficult time. Two great cultures pushing each other century after century. Jihad, Holy War, or what ever you would like to call it, was the order of the day. It was a dark time in Christianity, allowing your faith to become something that instructs violence. Sometimes it is hard to believe.

 

I found the Christians portrayed as a mix of heroic and pretty disgusting. The Muslims were not the focus of the movie, but left one with a good impression, mainly through the character of Saladin

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I wish they would make a film about the fall of the Constantinopoli,

 

"But the Greeks strongly repelled them and pushed them off vigorously. It was a brave defense: they prevailed in the fight and showed true virtue: for nothing that happened - not the hunger that oppressed them, not their lack of sleep, nor the continuous unstinting battle or the wounds, murders and deaths suffered by their dear ones before their very eyes - succeeded in turning them even slightly from their initial vigor and resolve.

I would love to hear the last words of Constantine XI, it was so chivalric:

"Although he (Constantine XI) clearly saw with his own eyes the danger that threatened the city, and had the opportunity to save himself - as well as many people encouraging him to do so - he refused, preferring to die with his country and his subjects.

 

"Indeed, he chose to die first, so that he might avoid the sight of the city being taken and of its inhabitants being either savagely slaughtered or shamefully led away into slavery. When he saw that the enemy were forcing him back, and surging through the broken down wall into the city, it is said that he uttered in a great voice, these last words 'The city is taken; and should I still live?' With that he thrust himself into the midst of the enemy and was cut down."

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I have to say, now that I know that Christian Fundamentalists don't like this movie, I'm more tempted to see it! I didn't go see The Last Temptation of Christ in spite of their vociferous attacks against it and I'd like to make up lost ground (annoying fundementalists by making something they are against more popular). Mischievous, I know, but they have an##### in the White House.

Edited by amani

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