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How Can You Believe Peace When History And Qur'an Refute It?

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Oh boy..you Muslims seem to have an answer for everything. Lies, lies, and more lies. :D

 

This is consistent with some people who dont likee to hear criticism. They say hateful things back, dont address the issue you address or accuse you of lying about your identity. Its much easier than making an argument!

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This is consistent with some people who dont likee to hear criticism. They say hateful things back, dont address the issue you address or accuse you of lying about your identity. Its much easier than making an argument!

Yeah right...who said hateful things here .... make constructive comments or ...u have bought no argument......just rant and more rant..... andy yet more rant....and we have better things to do than waste our time refuting copy pastes and things which have been answered 101 times in this forum itself..

Edited by truthful

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Assalamu Alaikum

 

 

Thank You bro truthful. Crusader, what lies? Please prove us wrong? We don't have the answers to everything.... We never said or acted like it. But we defintely have answered all the accusations, questions, ETC. that alot of these non (www.)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_glossary/glossary_m002.html#Muslim"]muslims[/url] have came up with...Yet it's not good enough cuz what... It doesn't fit their agenda?? or possibly their motive for being biased towards (www.)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_glossary/glossary_i001.html#Islam"]Islam[/url] from the get-go????

 

I am still waiting for the lies lies lies you mentioned... Take your time. There are alot of anti (www.)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_glossary/glossary_i001.html#Islam"]Islam[/url] sites out there worth checking out and copying and pasting. ;D

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Assalamu Alaikum

Thank You bro truthful. Crusader, what lies? Please prove us wrong? We don't have the answers to everything.... We never said or acted like it. But we defintely have answered all the accusations, questions, ETC. that alot of these non muslims have came up with...Yet it's not good enough cuz what... It doesn't fit their agenda?? or possibly their motive for being biased towards Islam from the get-go????

 

I am still waiting for the lies lies lies you mentioned... Take your time. There are alot of anti Islam sites out there worth checking out and copying and pasting. ;D

 

Does the sunnah ((www.)"http://glossary/glossary_h000.html#hadith"]hadith[/url] or sira) mention aisha being married to muhammed at the age of between 6 -9 years? If so, is this normal for muslim men to marry little children, even if God tells you in a dream.? Does muhammed suggest that you chop the heads and fingers off of your enemies? it is mentioned in the (www.)"http://glossary/glossary_k001.html#Koran"]koran[/url] and backed up by Bukhari! :D

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Does the sunnah (hadith or sira) mention aisha being married to muhammed at the age of between 6 -9 years? If so, is this normal for muslim men to marry little children, even if God tells you in a dream.? Does muhammed suggest that you chop the heads and fingers off of your enemies? it is mentioned in the koran and backed up by Bukhari! :D

My grandmother got married when she was 12 ....it was considered normal some 50 years ago...and mind you , i dont come from a predominantly muslim country...there is nothing wrong with marrying young ,when girls have attained puberty..thats the way it was done throught out history.

 

Many converts themselves have written articles about this

read one here

(www.)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_www.ahya(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/amm/modules.php?name=Sections&op=viewarticle&artid=15"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_www.ahya(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/amm/modules.php?name=S...rticle&artid=15[/url]

by AbdurRahman R. Squires

 

as for the second "Bring forth proof if you are truthful "

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Does the sunnah (hadith or sira) mention aisha being married to muhammed at the age of between 6 -9 years? If so, is this normal for muslim men to marry little children, even if God tells you in a dream.? Does muhammed suggest that you chop the heads and fingers off of your enemies? it is mentioned in the koran and backed up by Bukhari! :D

 

 

 

Whats the name of this topic ?

 

How Can You Believe Peace When History And Qur'an Refute It?

 

what does your question have to do with it ?

 

but since you are on it well answer it

 

as For the Prophet Õáì Çááå Úáíå æÂáå æÓáã marrying a girl of 9 years old this was a common practice of the arabs and Jews and that can be proved from the Talmud as well and Until today and not only in arabia but in many parts of asia and not only amongst muslims .

 

The hilarity of the whole saga of Christian missionaries accusing the Prophet(P) of committing "child molestation" is that this contradicts the basic fact that a girl becomes a woman when she begins her menstruation cycle. The significance of menstruation that anyone with the slightest familiarity with physiology will tell you is that it is a sign that the girl is being prepared to become a mother.

 

The difference between us and the west who have endless social problems one of them being 9-10 year old girls becoming pregnant at schools and Things can easily be backed up from reports on the Internet , is that we Let our girls Get married at that age where as Only (www.)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_glossary/glossary_a001.html#Allah"]Allah[/url] Knows what those poor little girls will turn into on your side , think about it .

 

Dont go off topic again its a warning .

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Oh boy..you Muslims seem to have an answer for everything. Lies, lies, and more lies. :D

 

Shazam! that sounds a lot like what you're doing now :D

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From the Hanafi school (as given in the Hidayah) 16

 

“ It is not lawful to make war upon any people who have never before been called to the faith, without previously requiring them to embrace it, because the Prophet so instructed his commanders, directing them to call the infidels to the faith, and also because the people will hence perceive that they are attacked for the sake of religion, and not for the sake of taking their property, or making slaves of their children, and on this consideration it is possible that they may be induced to agree to the call, in order to save themselves from the troubles of war… If the infidels, upon receiving the call, neither consent to it nor agree to pay capitation tax, it is then incumbent on the Muslims to call upon God for assistance, and to make war upon them, because God is the assistant of those who serve Him, and the destroyer of His enemies, the infidels, and it is necessary to implore His aid upon every occasion; the Prophet, moreover, commands us so to do.â€

 

al-Mawardi (d. 1058 ), Shafi’i jurist 17

 

“…The mushrikun [infidels] of Dar al-Harb (the arena of battle) are of two types: First, those whom the call of Islam has reached, but they have refused it and have taken up arms. The amir of the army has the option of fighting them…in accordance with what he judges to be in the best interest of the Muslims and most harmful to the mushrikun… Second, those whom the invitation to Islam has not reached, although such persons are few nowadays since Allah has made manifest the call of his Messenger…it is forbidden to…begin an attack before explaining the invitation to Islam to them, informing them of the miracles of the Prophet and making plain the proofs so as to encourage acceptance on their part; if they still refuse to accept after this, war is waged against them and they are treated as those whom the call has reached…â€

 

 

 

does that make ok to wage war against people who refuse to obey Islam after they have been shown the way?

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Inshallah i will answer u soon..i have to make sure what i say is correct

until then

bye

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This should answer ur question

One of the fundamental truths established by the sacred texts is that no one can be compelled to accept Islam. It is the duty of Muslims to establish the proof of Islam to the people so that truth can be made clear from falsehood. After that, whoever wishes to accept Islam may do so and whoever wishes to continue upon unbelief may do so. No one should be threatened or harmed in any way if he does not wish to accept Islam.

 

Among the many decisive pieces of evidence in this regard are the following:

 

Allah says: “Let there be no compulsion in religion. Truth has been made clear from error. Whoever rejects false worship and believes in Allah has grasped the most trustworthy handhold that never breaks. And Allah hears and knows all things.†[sûrah al-Baqarah: 256]

 

Allah says: “If it had been your Lord’s will, all of the people on Earth would have believed. Would you then compel the people so to have them believe?†[sûrah Yûnus: 99]

 

Allah says: “So if they dispute with you, say ‘I have submitted my whole self to Allah, and so have those who follow me.’ And say to the People of the Scripture and to the unlearned: ‘Do you also submit yourselves?’ If they do, then they are on right guidance. But if they turn away, your duty is only to convey the Message. And in Allah’s sight are all of His servants.†[sûrah Âl `Imrân: 20]

 

Allah says: “The Messenger’s duty is but to proclaim the Message.†[sûrah al-Mâ’idah: 99]

 

It is important to note that these last two verses were revealed in Madinah. This is significant, since it shows that the ruling they gave was not just contingent on the Muslims being in Mecca in a state of weakness.

 

Some people might be wondering that if Islam indeed advocates such an approach, then what is all this we hear about jihad? How can we explain the warfare that the Prophet (peace be upon him) and his Companions waged against the pagans?

The answer to this is that jihad in Islamic Law can be waged for a number of reasons, but compelling people to accept Islam is simply not one of them.

 

The reason why jihad was first permitted in Islam was so the Muslims could defend themselves against persecution and expulsion from their homes.

 

Allah says: “To those against whom war is made, permission is given (to fight), because they are wronged – and verily Allah is Most Powerful for their aid – (They are) those who have been expelled from their homes in defiance of right – (for no cause) except that they say, ‘Our Lord is Allah’. Did Allah not check one set of people by means of another, there would surely have been pulled down monasteries, churches, synagogues, and Masjids, in which the name of Allah is commemorated in abundant measure. Allah will certainly aid those who aid his cause, for truly Allah is full of strength and might.†[sûrah al-Hajj: 39-40]

 

Many of the earliest scholars mention that these were the first verses of the Qur’ân that was revealed regarding jihad. Thereafter the following verses were revealed:

 

“Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loves not transgressors. And slay them wherever you catch them and drive them out from whence they drove you out, for oppression is worse than killing. But fight them not at the sacred Masjid unless they fight you there. But if they fight you, slay them. Such is the reward of those who suppress faith. But if they cease, Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful. And fight them on until there is no more tumult or oppression and there prevail justice and faith in Allah. But if they cease, let there be no hostility except to those who practice oppression.†[sûrah al-Baqarah: 190-193]

 

From this point on, the scope of jihad was broadened from being purely for defense against direct attack to being inclusive of resistance against those who suppress the faith and deny people the freedom to choose their religion for themselves. This came later, because it is legislated for the Muslims only when they are capable of doing so. In times of weakness, Muslims may only fight against direct attack.

 

As for the spread of Islam, this is supposed to take place peacefully by disseminating the Message with the written and spoken word. There is no place for the use of weapons to compel people to accept Islam. Weapons can only be drawn against those who persecute and oppress others and prevent them from following their own consciences in matters of belief. The Muslims cannot just stand by while people are being denied the right to believe in Islam and their voices are being crushed. This is the meaning of Allah’s words: “And fight them on until there is no more tumult or oppression and there prevail justice and faith in Allah.†[sûrah al-Baqarah: 193]

 

The Prophet (peace be upon him) said in his letter to the Roman governor Heracles: “I invite you to accept Islam. If you accept Islam, you will find safety. If you accept Islam, Allah will give you a double reward. However, if you turn away, upon you will be the sin of your subjects.†[sahîh al-Bukhârî and Sahîh Muslim]

 

Once people have heard the Message without obstruction or hindrance and the proof has been established upon them, then the duty of the Muslims is done. Those who wish to believe are free to do so and those who prefer to disbelieve are likewise free to do so.

 

Even when the Muslims are compelled to fight and then, as a consequence, subdue the land, their duty thereafter is to establish Allah’s law in the land and uphold justice for all people, Muslim and non-Muslim. It is not their right to coerce their subjects to accept Islam against their will. Non-Muslims under Muslim rule must be allowed to remain on their own faith and must be allowed to practice the rights of their faith, though they will be expected to respect the laws of the land.

 

Had the purpose of jihad been to force the unbelievers to accept Islam, the Prophet (peace be upon him) would never have commanded the Muslims to refrain from hostilities if the enemy relented. He would not have prohibited the killing of women and children. However, this is exactly what he did.

 

During a battle, the Prophet (peace be upon him) saw people gathered together. He dispatched a man to find out why they were gathered. The man returned and said: “They are gathered around a slain woman.†So Allah’s Messenger (peace be upon him) said: “She should not have been attacked!†Khâlid b. al-Walîd was leading the forces, so he dispatched a man to him saying: “‘Tell Khâlid not to kill women or laborersâ€. [sunan Abî Dâwûd]

 

Therefore, even in the heat of battle against a hostile enemy, the only people who may be attacked are those who are actually participating in the fighting.

 

Had the purpose of jihad been to force the unbelievers to accept Islam, the rightly guided Caliphs would not have prohibited the killing of priests and monks who refrained from fighting. However, this is exactly what they did. When the first Caliph, Abû Bakr, sent an army to Syria to fight the aggressive Roman legions, he went out to give them words of encouragement. He said: “You are going to find a group of people who have devoted themselves to the worship of Allah (i.e. monks), so leave them to what they are doing.â€

 

We have demonstrated that it is a principle in Islam that there is no compulsion in religion and we have discussed the objectives of jihad. Now, we shall turn our attentions to some texts that are often misunderstood.

 

One of these is the verse: “But when the forbidden months are past, then fight the pagans wherever you find them, and seize them and beleaguer them and lie in wait for them in every stratagem (of war). But if they repent and establish regular prayers and practice regular charity, then open the way for them, for Allah is oft-forgiving, most merciful.†[sûrah al-Tawbah: 5]

 

Some people – especially some contemporary non-Muslim critics of Islam – have tried to claim that this verse abrogates the verse “Let there be no compulsion in religion.†They argue that the generality of this statement implies that every unbeliever who refuses to accept Islam must be fought. They support their allegation by pointing out that this verse is one of the last verses to be revealed about fighting.

 

However, this verse in no way abrogates the principle in Islamic Law that there is no compulsion in religion. It may be general in wording, but its meaning is quite specific on account of other verses of the Qur’ân that are connected with it as well as on account of a number of pertinent hadîth. We will be discussing these texts shortly.

 

The people being referred to by this verse are the pagan Arabs who had been waging war against the Prophet (peace be upon him) and who had broken their covenant and treaties with him. This verse is not speaking about the other pagan Arabs who did not break their treaties and take up arms against the Muslims. It is also most definitely not speaking about the Jews or Christians, or, for that matter, the pagans who were living outside of Arabia.

 

If we look at the verses in Sûrah al-Tawbah immediately before and after the one under discussion, the context of the verse becomes clear.

 

A few verses before the one we are discussing, Allah says: “There is a declaration of immunity from Allah and His Messenger to those of the pagans with whom you have contracted mutual alliances. Go then, for four months, to and fro throughout the land. But know that you cannot frustrate Allah that Allah will cover with shame those who reject Him.†[sûrah al-Tawbah: 1-2]

 

In these verses we see that the pagans were granted a four month amnesty with an indication that when the four months were over, fighting would resume. However, a following verse exempts some of them from the resumption of hostilities. It reads: “Except for those pagans with whom you have entered into a covenant and who then do not break their covenant at all nor aided anyone against you. So fulfill your engagements with them until the end of their term, for Allah loves the righteous.†[sûrah al-Tawbah: 4]

 

So when Allah says: “But when the forbidden months are past, then fight the pagans wherever you find them, and seize them and beleaguer them and lie in wait for them in every stratagem (of war)†we must know that it is not general, since the verse above has qualified it to refer to the pagan Arabs who were actually at war with the Prophet (peace be upon him) and those who broke their covenants of peace.

 

This is further emphasized a few verses later where Allah says: “Will you not fight people who broke their covenants and plotted to expel the Messenger and attacked you first?†[sûrah al-Tawbah: 13]

 

Ibn al-`Arabî, in his commentary on the Qur’ân, writes: “It is clear from this that the meaning of this verse is to kill the pagans who are waging war against you.†[Ahkâm al-Qur’ân: (2/456)]

 

Allah also say right after the verse under discussion: “How can there be a covenant before Allah and His Messenger with the pagans except those with whom you have made a treaty near the Sacred Masjid? As long as they stand true to you, stand true to them, for Allah does love the righteous.†[sûrah al-Tawbah: 7]

 

Another misunderstood text is the hadîth where the Prophet (peace be upon him) said: “I have been commanded to fight the people until they bear witness that there is no God but Allah and that I am Allah’s Messenger. If they do so, then there blood and their wealth are inviolable except in the dispensation of justice, and their affair is with Allah.†[sahîh al-Bukhârî and Sahîh Muslim]

 

There can be no qualms about this hadîth’s authenticity, since it is recorded in both Sahîh al-Bukhârî and Sahîh Muslim. However, this hadîth is also not to be taken generally, out of context, and in complete disregard to all the other textual evidence.

 

The term “people†here is not referring to all humanity. Ibn Taymiyah says: “It refers to fighting those who are waging war, whom Allah has permitted us to fight. It does not refer to those who have a covenant with us with whom Allah commands us to fulfill our covenant.†[Majmû` al-Fatâwâ (19/20)]

 

Islam commands the Muslims to be just with people of other faiths, whether they be Jews, Christians, or pagans. Islam calls us to treat them kindly and try to win their hearts as long as they do not take up arms against us. Allah says: “Allah forbids you not with regard to those who neither fight against you for your faith nor drive you out of your homes from dealing kindly and justly with them, for Allah loves those who are just.†[sûrah al-Mumtahanah: 9-10]

 

Allah commands Muslims to respect their non-Muslim parents and to accompany them in this world in a good manner.

 

The Qur’ân commands us to argue with them in the best manner. Allah says: “Argue with the People of the Scripture in the best manner except those among them who act oppressively. Say: We believe in the revelation that has come down to us and in that which came down to you. Our God and your God is one, and it is to Him we submit ourselves as Muslims.†[sûrah al-`Ankabût: 46]

 

We are ordered to uphold our covenants with the non-Muslims and not betray them or transgress against them. The Prophet (peace be upon him) gave a stern warning to us against killing a non-Muslim with whom we are at peace. He said: “Whoever kills one with whom we have a covenant will not smell the scent of Paradise.†[sahîh Muslim]

 

The faith of a Muslim is not acceptable unless he believes in all of the Prophets who were sent before (peace be upon them all). Allah says: “O you who believe! Believe in Allah, His Messenger, the scripture that He revealed to His messenger and the scripture that he revealed before. Whoever disbelieves in Allah, His angels, His books, His Messengers, and the Last Day has gone far astray.†[sûrah al-Nisâ’]

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