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Yasnov

Atheist's Psychology

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Atheists can be soft, strong, anti-theistic, religious, spiritual or entirely materialist. Your findings will be inconclusive.

I may put them in several categories. So no worries about that. Trust me ...

 

You might be able to analyse a single golfer based on their enjoyment of golf. You cannot from that, however - make generalisations indicative of all golfers. The only thing all golfers have in common is that they play golf. Nothing about 'golf' necessarily imposes itself on other parts of golfers lives.

I anticipate that my analysis result will vary ... but we can see a pattern from the analysis/sample. This is quite scientific

 

Cars serve a purpose. The roads are designed for them. Assuming the blind man is aware of cars, he should be aware of the risks. He is stupid to ignore those risks, but he is not 'guilty' or 'innocent' of anything. He represents himself.

You are supporting my analysis

 

I get the above as well. But when it gets to the level of someone deciding they know about my life, and who I am - I get irritated.

If so, why do you still get involved in this discussion? Just do what I did with the Christian preachers, walk away ... You can't say that you are fed up, but still you keep replying here and there in this thread. That's a contradiction.

 

I do not feel degraded, and I have no faith.

That's funny

 

Wassalam,

Y

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I may put them in several categories. So no worries about that

You'll need about as many categories as there are Atheists.

 

Rendering your attempt at psychoanalysing Atheists about as useful as psychoanalysing people who like oranges.

 

I anticipate that my analysis result will vary ... but we can see a pattern from the analysis/sample. This is quite scientific

Uh, no.

 

You will see absolutely no pattern in the mentality of golfers. All you will see is no consistency.

 

You are supporting my analysis

How, exactly?

 

If so, why do you still get involved in this discussion? Just do what I did with the Christian preachers, walk away ... You can't say that you are fed up, but still you keep replying here and there in this thread. That's a contradiction.

No, it isn't. It is a willingness to defend myself.

 

Moreover, are you implying you are going to tell me about my life? Are you implying you are going to tell me how I think and what I do?

 

That's funny

What is funny?

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You'll need about as many categories as there are Atheists.

Are you sure? Many atheists that I have talked to seem to have the same pattern of thinking in explaining their disbelief in Higher Power.

 

Rendering your attempt at psychoanalysing Atheists about as useful as psychoanalysing people who like oranges.

Uh, no.

People include all humans while Atheists is just one group of the people. There is a difference.

 

You will see absolutely no pattern in the mentality of golfers. All you will see is no consistency.

Don't be too sure ... most golfers choose to play golf for a specific reason.

 

How, exactly?

We don't know what is in the blind's man heart, if he is just stupid, then there is excuse for him. But if he is a normal person who can think for himself, then he is responsible for any decisions that he made. Unless, it is beyond his power.

 

No, it isn't. It is a willingness to defend myself.

Those who are threatened always feel the need to defend themselves : )

 

Moreover, are you implying you are going to tell me about my life? Are you implying you are going to tell me how I think and what I do?

No, I was just trying to suggest to you some reasonable ways to do if you are bored and fed up with this kind of discussion or the people that you are debating with.

 

What is funny?

Your psychology

 

Wassalam,

Y

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Are you sure? Many atheists that I have talked to seem to have the same pattern of thinking in explaining their disbelief in Higher Power.

Correct.

 

But they have a likely different mentality on most other things.

 

People include all humans while Atheists is just one group of the people. There is a difference.

An 'Atheist' is not by definition of being an Atheist in any group of people since Atheists are not a coherent group with a command, or accepted ideology. By your own argument people who like oranges are all in a group and can be psychoanalysed based on that.

 

Don't be too sure ... most golfers choose to play golf for a specific reason.

Yes. They enjoy it.

 

You will find that most people play golf because they enjoy it. Your findings will not show you anything else about them.

 

We don't know what is in the blind's man heart, if he is just stupid, then there is excuse for him. But if he is a normal person who can think for himself, then he is responsible for any decisions that he made. Unless, it is beyond his power.

Yes.

 

So? I still do not see your point in any of this.

 

Those who are threatened always feel need to defend themselves :

I have told you, from my own mouth that I am not threatened at all. You are willfully ignoring what I said and instead telling me that I am threatened. You are saying that what you think of me is more accurate than what I think of myself.

 

Do you realise how incredibly arrogant that is? Especially as you have never conversed with me outside of this forum.

 

Your psychology

So what exactly, pray tell is my psychology?

Edited by Skavau

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Correct.

But they have a likely different mentality on most other things.

correct, did i deny that?

 

An 'Atheist' is not by definition of being an Atheist in any group of people since Atheists are not a coherent group with a command, or accepted ideology.

atheists are people who are not theist. why do you make it complicated?

 

By your own argument people who like oranges are all in a group and can be psychoanalysed based on that.

yes, of course. why not?

 

Yes. They enjoy it.

You will find that most people play golf because they enjoy it. Your findings will not show you anything else about them.

why not? the next question that you should ask is: why do they enjoy it? The answer might vary. Such as: some like stroking balls, while some others love the nature aspect of it ...the hills, trees and water, and etc.

 

So? I still do not see your point in any of this.

well, i give you another example. you hold a knife. and i said, don't play with a knife, it could make you hurt. you ignore my warning and keep playing with the knife and you cut your fingers. still don't see my points?

 

I have told you, from my own mouth that I am not threatened at all. You are willfully ignoring what I said and instead telling me that I am threatened. You are saying that what you think of me is more accurate than what I think of myself.

i don't know you well enough. so you should not expect me to trust you. what i tell you about yourself is what i read from your statements, i read between the lines. so be careful in expressing your opinions. most of the times it describes what you feel. it's like a pupil who is asked if he is nervous to give a presentation, he keep saying he is fine, but his physical body shows that he is nervous. got it?

 

Do you realise how incredibly arrogant that is? Especially as you have never conversed with me outside of this forum.

telling you my simple observation about you has nothing to do with arrogance.

 

So what exactly, pray tell is my psychology?

sometimes i feel something is funny, and i don't have to explain or to justify it to others why it is funny.

 

wassalam,

y

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[

Good point. The time starts after a cause starts an effect. Thus, that is why there is no time before singularity converts into our universe and there won't be after this universe goes back to singularity. Thanks for the good point. Now we can explain why there is no time constraint in afterlife and in God.

you welcome :sl: ..but my point was that cause and effect may not apply to God if he is oustide time...but by the same token, time and effect doesn't apply to multiple Gods...If it's possible for a God to exist eternally..uncuased...then it's possible for 10 Gods to exist eternally..uncaused.

 

Thanks again. Since we are not zero and we have a begining, an origin. Wherever we have originated from is not zero. Something doesn't come from zero something doesn't go back to zero. Zero is the atheist's explanation of universe! Zero is the end product of atheist's efforts in this world. No meaning no contribution... :no:

So If God is infinity and not zero than he must also have a starting point? :sl:

No, my friend. Simply we can find meaning in life only by finding God.

And what meaning is that? dedicate one's entire life as a mindless subordinate robot ignoring freewill and logic while God plays Hide and seek? If all god wanted from us is praise than what good all the tons of Angels he have to do the same?

What good is a test for which we already know the outcome?

What good is this poor design of beings that we call humans ..which can't even do the job they are programmed for (find God)

 

This is not me believing God exists and then questioning his motives..this is me rationalizing to see if God exists based on the givens.

 

Imagine that you do that to your father or mother. They might be upset.

But that is not the same with God. It is you who run away from God. You deny to acknowledge him. Because you are not trying to find a meaning in your only life. Your only chance. It is you my friend.

You choose a path going the opposite way of God. Well, then you end in the opposite side. As far as you can be from God. You choose your direction you get to your destination.

How can any one run away from The God?

How can myself and atheists be not trying if we here bumping heads against concrete trying to make sense out of things?

If god made us and designed our capabilities than how can we do what we are not designed to do?

That was your personal duty my friend. You enjoyed all the blessings of Allah in this life and never felt uncomfortable to acquire how did that happen. You didn't value the chance God gave you. Your one and only chance. You wasted it.

1 chance? Wasted it?

Hmm..do you like think I am dead or something?

You see all the blessings and joy of life that I am supposedly unthankful for..but do you turn a blind eye to all the pain and suffering? Life maybe all peachy and flowery for you but if take hard look around you and weigh everything..than tell me where is God when a poor mother watches her infant dies slowly from starvation, and all the praying can’t provide a meal on the table?

After all, this life serves as testing facility. Well, you failed the test. Somebody also has to fill the hell with ungrateful beings. May be it serves as a nuclear plant to maintain the power of heaven, who knows?(Allah forgive me. I was just kidding)

Sure…. life is a test, we are all guinea pigs…What are we being tested for? Again..tests are conducted when outcome is unknown, we know this is not the case as God knows future…even if it’s a test facility why does is often resemble a torture chamber?

The veil falls on you once you insist on your disbelief. The chance of recovery decreases with each step in opposite direction.

That’s like the weakest explanation by far….disbelief is the result of veils..not the other way around…why would some one who already disbelieve would even need a veil?

If you run away as fast as you can why God should stop you. If there is justice then those who try their best and submit to God should be rewarded. What makes you special?

Again what’s with running away?..does God need a visa to get into U.S.A? How can any thing outrun an omnipotent God? And I am special because I am human like every one else..my life is worth same as yours..do you disagree? Is a believer’s life worth more?

The only time when there is no chance of mercy is when you disbelief or associate partners to God. So, I am sorry but no mercy for you. Get your sun screen ready...

And making fun of God reservs you the best spot in Hell. Have fun!

Thanks for the verdict but you my friend are neither judge or jury…Besides…shirk is polytheism..which I am not …associating imaginary Gods with hypothetical God is probably a imaginative shirk. Now let me pass you the sunscreen since you just got burned by a nonbeliever :j:

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My dear brothers,

as you can witness here we have an example of an agnostic friend with nickname "illigocal" and one atheist called "skavau". As a result of their volunteering we had a chance to witness how their views reflect their total unwillingness to search for meaning of this life.

Apparently a dialogue with you is equivalent to not searching for truth. :sl:

Allah warns us about them in many verses of Qur'an. They are like the blind and they won't believe. Their hearts and minds are sealed to the truth. They didn't try to search for the truth, well they simply don't get it. Instead, they chose to become jokers. Thus they didn't save themselves from the future disaster.

Thanks for your prediction ...you oracle of truth you..

And once they go so astray, Allah SWT doesn't prefer to help them either.

 

Most of people like them die in disbelief and without any clue of what they have done and where are they going.

Says the greatest statistician of all. :j:

My illogical friend wanted to blame Allah SWT for his inablity to believe. Despite the fact he was given all the necessary signs and proofs in his life and in the universe. The most important thing he also knows about the message of Islam. He didn't like it. Instead he prefered to listen to what Satan has wispered in his ears.

How polite of Satan..whispering in ears instead of yelling outloud…But If you are right then either My ignorance prevails God's guidence...orperhaps Satan is more convincing than God. :no:

I know why my illogical friend doesn like it, but, I still would like to remind you about the Gaussian distribution of normalcy in any given human population. It is a fact mentioned to as by Allah SWT.

ROFL..Guassian Curve was mentioned by Allah? I’l take a wild guess here..you don’t have any proof of that now would ya?....maybe if i serach deep in my heart I can find where Allah mentions Guassain Curve...surprise ..surprise. :D

 

Let me see you actually draw a curve and label it…apparently you have no understanding of how bell curve works, but maybe I don’t..perhaps you can make one real quick and prove me ignent so I can fix myself. :sl:

 

 

Some of us who are lucky to be born in a Muslim country are given their answers early in their life. Later on, they simply add more proofs to support their belief and their position in the curve gradually migrates to the positive end.

Sorry to interrupt you O wise one..but I was borned in a muslim country so your theory is flawed yet again.

 

People like my friend "illogical" insists to stay on the 0 point. Like kids. It is a kind of self deceiving and immature way to attempt to maintain innocense.

 

According to Islam there is no original sin. There is original innocence. Thus we are born at point 0. And until we mature, which is reaching puberty, we are not held responsible for our actions. My illogical friend insists that he can claim his innocense if he can maintain his position at point 0.

I also maintain that your statistics teacher be stripped of his/her degree and you should be take in for a mental observation but what do I know anyway.

"Illogical" do you intend to grow beyond childhood or you are fooling yourself?

Well think about it …I have responded to each and every one of your post and tried to reason right?…So ofcource I am fooling myself :D

 

peace

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correct, did i deny that?

So your psychoanalysis only seeks to find out why Atheists disbelieve in God and nothing else?

 

atheists are people who are not theist. why do you make it complicated?

I don't make it complicated at all. And by the way, not all non-theists are Atheists.

 

yes, of course. why not?

How can you psychoanalyse an entire person's mentality based on his or her like of oranges?

 

why not? the next question that you should ask is: why do they enjoy it? The answer might vary. Such as: some like stroking balls, while some others love the nature aspect of it ...the hills, trees and water, and etc.

Exactly. The answers will vary and you will probably get little consistency, indicating that other things influence their opinions rather than just golf.

 

well, i give you another example. you hold a knife. and i said, don't play with a knife, it could make you hurt. you ignore my warning and keep playing with the knife and you cut your fingers. still don't see my points?

I do see your point - don't play with a knife.

 

I do not see the relevance of that to anything.

 

i don't know you well enough. so you should not expect me to trust you.

That is a very unfortunate and thoroughly despicable standpoint. You don't know me, so therefore you will conclude what you like about me and tell people the misinformation you have concluded about me.

 

what i tell you about yourself is what i read from your statements, i read between the lines. so be careful in expressing your opinions. most of the times it describes what you feel. it's like a pupil who is asked if he is nervous to give a presentation, he keep saying he is fine, but his physical body shows that he is nervous. got it?

Read through and find all the gaps all you like. I'm telling you now: I am not threatened, only peeved with being told by someone over the internet that I am.

 

sometimes i feel something is funny, and i don't have to explain or to justify it to others why it is funny.

Then why are you here? You're supposed to be 'psychoanalysing' are you not?

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brother illogical i know maybe your thinking if i become a muslim i must follow the rules and not do sins , and do prayings and stop talking to girls etc... , dont prefer the obstacles from heaven brother :sl:

think more because an infinite hell is waytoo much for you to handle

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So your psychoanalysis only seeks to find out why Atheists disbelieve in God and nothing else?

yes

 

How can you psychoanalyse an entire person's mentality based on his or her like of oranges?

i ask and listen to them

 

Exactly. The answers will vary and you will probably get little consistency, indicating that other things influence their opinions rather than just golf.

such as?

 

I do see your point - don't play with a knife.

I do not see the relevance of that to anything.

the relevance is the warning that you ignore

 

That is a very unfortunate and thoroughly despicable standpoint. You don't know me, so therefore you will conclude what you like about me and tell people the misinformation you have concluded about me.

yes, i can tell you what i think about you from my observation, and they don't have to be nice things that you only want to hear

 

Then why are you here? You're supposed to be 'psychoanalysing' are you not?

i'm doing it right now

 

wassalam,

y

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yes

So just ask - don't assume, and 'read between the lines'.

 

We're all happy to give you a clear answer.

 

i ask and listen to them

But what would their responses have to do with their like of oranges? If you ask someone who likes oranges what their favourite sport is, would their answer be due to their like of oranges?

 

such as?

I have no idea. I'm not a golfer.

 

the relevance is the warning that you ignore

What warning would this be exactly?

 

yes, i can tell you what i think about you from my observation, and they don't have to be nice things that you only want to hear

And yet you refuse to listen to the direct source (me).

 

i'm doing it right now

I have to say, I find the very method you use of psychoanalysis immoral. It is as if I am an experiment, or a subject to you. Am I right?

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Thanks for clarifying..God is not the word authority but some one with authority?..making a lot more sense now and it totally changes what I said before.

i lost track now ... your explanation doesn't make sense

 

Right the Ulama... humans who often disagree :sl:...point was they are not the author.

they disagree only on small issues, but about the existence of God, or God is one, and everything that is related to His Existence, there is no any disagreement

 

kkk watch this.. muslim is someone who submits..I submit to agnosticism :j: ..or better yet I submit to a God that I don't thnk exist..therefore I am a muslim :D

you are confused? :no:

 

But yea I can't clarify it more then I did.. "non muslims" in the context used were people who don't believe in Quran or Hadith..It's like telling some one wants to learn about the invisible car to the invisible manual.

so i am correct that agnostics/agnotism falls under the category of non-Muslim?

 

NVM...so gays are not all genetically homo..some turn that way on their own (maybe bcaz of Devil or America or both) Still, even if 1 person is borned genetically gay, who is responsible for that person's doomed fate?

is that confirmed that gayness is genetic?

 

It's Pete from down the block :sl:..but what if it were?

sad, you might be feeling deceived now. and it could makes you a little bit more biased in seeing the Higher Power.

 

The problems with the argument is the misuse of principle of analogy...the fact that designs often have few designers..etc etc.

that's another issue ... but now you've admitted that there is a design

 

so yea death can mean no more party…but perhaps when I die, I'll become a ghost and walk through walls and haunt people (watchout Yasnov :D ) and do other cool stuff which does not suck. So knowing I am bound to die, I am cool with dying.

perhaps ... perhaps .. perhaps ... i guess you are ready with all the consequences of that perhaps, whatever it turns out to be? ok, anyway, thank you for letting me know of your plan : )

 

wassalam,

y

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amazing , every non muslim when we talk to them they think we are psychoanalysing them lol

 

believe me i understand its another proof for you Atheist , you see when you know that we are normal and can control such fraud then why not just not admit it and just be a muslim why make it a fuss for yourself , brother we muslims use the quran knowledge as you can see we can understand how nonmuslims are.

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amazing , every non muslim when we talk to them they think we are psychoanalysing them lol

No. Just ones that say they intend to psychoanalyse Atheists in a thread called 'Atheist's Psychology'.

 

believe me i understand its another proof for you Atheist , you see when you know that we are normal and can control such fraud then why not just not admit it and just be a muslim why make it a fuss for yourself , brother we muslims use the quran knowledge as you can see we can understand how nonmuslims are.

I can't make sense of that paragraph. Are you suggesting that us Atheists all secretly agree that you're normal and know how Non-Muslims are?

 

Because the final part, in my case is false. You haven't the slightest clue how any Non-Muslim is much less Non-Muslims per se. My evidence? Your posts.

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amazing , every non muslim when we talk to them they think we are psychoanalysing them lol

yea , pretty miraculous I would say…especially since the title of this thread is “Atheist psychologyâ€

 

i lost track now ... your explanation doesn't make sense

You can look on the previous thread..unless your retention memory buffers are overflowing yet again. :sl:

 

they disagree only on small issues, but about the existence of God, or God is one, and everything that is related to His Existence, there is no any disagreement

They are not all small issues…the small differences between Sunni and Shia often lead to bloody consequences...but to keep argument short ..let’s say the differences are small.

Do the same ulema disagree that Gravity exists..or 2+2=4?…I am sure they don’t…so why do they disagree even a little about Perfect God’s perfect instructions?

you are confused?

Maybe I am..but tell me this..did muslims exist before Propher Mohammad SW did?

I was told yes..bcaz muslims are people who submit…so based on this rationale…I am saying I submit also to a God that’s non existent…all we have to do now is to prove he exists and bam! :sl:

so i am correct that agnostics/agnotism falls under the category of non-Muslim?

Im going to be technical and say “it depends on your definition of muslimâ€

is that confirmed that gayness is genetic?

I never said it was…I only brought up gayness genes in parallel to religion genes.

So If a religious gene is confirmed than sure gayness gene is also confirmed…

 

that's another issue ... but now you've admitted that there is a design

Design? hmm..Sure a poor one….but I can admit if it helps you make your point.

perhaps ... perhaps .. perhaps ... i guess you are ready with all the consequences of that perhaps, whatever it turns out to be? ok, anyway, thank you for letting me know of your plan : )

Consequences consequences consequences…..I thought by now you would understand that people can’t be scared or threatened into believing…but yea I don’t have much options here..and don’t worry I was just kidding about haunting you…..I am too passive to hold grudges or take revenge…well maybe I’ll haunt just a little for fun’s sake ya know. :no:

Peace

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Do the same ulema disagree that Gravity exists..or 2+2=4?…I am sure they don’t…so why do they disagree even a little about Perfect God’s perfect instructions?

such as?

 

Maybe I am..but tell me this..did muslims exist before Propher Mohammad SW did?

I was told yes..bcaz muslims are people who submit…so based on this rationale…I am saying I submit also to a God that’s non existent…all we have to do now is to prove he exists and bam! :sl:

yes, Muslims are people who submit to the existing Creator. what is your question again?

 

Im going to be technical and say “it depends on your definition of muslimâ€

so, you want to be considered as a Muslim using your own definition of the word Muslim? shouldn't you be emberassed by now, illogical?

 

Consequences consequences consequences…..I thought by now you would understand that people can’t be scared or threatened into believing…

don't get me wrong, i am not threatening or scaring you. i just want to make sure you are aware that every decision brings consequences.

 

wassalam,

y

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So just ask - don't assume, and 'read between the lines'.

sometimes i ask, sometimes i listen, sometimes i read between the lines and sometimes i make conclusions. why are you telling me what to do? this is my research/survey, not yours ... what an arrogant atheist you are

 

We're all happy to give you a clear answer.

thanks

 

But what would their responses have to do with their like of oranges? If you ask someone who likes oranges what their favourite sport is, would their answer be due to their like of oranges?

i don't really understand what you meant by that

 

I have no idea. I'm not a golfer.

at least give me an example for what you said previously

 

What warning would this be exactly?

do you get any warnings? and do you understand the warnings?

 

And yet you refuse to listen to the direct source (me).

i listen to you

 

I have to say, I find the very method you use of psychoanalysis immoral. It is as if I am an experiment, or a subject to you. Am I right?

what's wrong with that? did i force you to be an object/subject of my "experiment"?

 

wassalam,

y

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such as?

I thought i gave the example :sl: ... like scholars who differ on Sunni and Shia madhabs etc..that's a big deal because often Shia Sunni scuffles turn out pretty bloody.

yes, Muslims are people who submit to the existing Creator. what is your question again?

Not a question..more of an inference...if the word muslim means "some one who submits" and not necessarily the followers of Prophet Muhammad (as I have been told) then heck I can argue that I am a muslim too :sl:

 

so, you want to be considered as a Muslim using your own definition of the word Muslim? shouldn't you be emberassed by now, illogical?

Embarrased? :no: ...we are having a dialogue, it's not ike I am running around naked on the streets why would I be embarrased? Besides Not my definition...look up what the word "Muslim" means in Arabic.

 

don't get me wrong, i am not threatening or scaring you. i just want to make sure you are aware that every decision brings consequences.

Perhaps not intentianally..but constant reminder of dire consequences kinda comes off threatening..not that I feel threatened or anything...I don't scare that easily..u know trying to be rational and all :j: ...Maybe bcaz I know the pitch..I hear it from family and friends all the time and for it does come off threatenning peace

Edited by llogical

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sometimes i ask, sometimes i listen, sometimes i read between the lines and sometimes i make conclusions. why are you telling me what to do? this is my research/survey, not yours ... what an arrogant atheist you are

I am not telling you what to do. I am asking you to be honest.

 

i don't really understand what you meant by that

You can psychoanalyse someone. You can psychoanalyse anyone. Let us say for arguments sake you can psychoanalyse someone who likes oranges.

 

How likely do you think their like of oranges will influence their results or be the model for their mentality?

 

do you get any warnings?

I will repeat: What warning would this be exactly?

 

and do you understand the warnings?

I don't even know what 'warnings' you are referring to.

 

what's wrong with that? did i force you to be an object/subject of my "experiment"?

No you did not. But it is just how you talk to me. I always feel as if you are talking down to me and combined with you claiming to be psychoanalysing, I seem to think you view me as a 'subject' or an 'experiment'.

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If Islam is true, then it is Allah's fault (Omniscience vs. Free-Will contradiction). If Islam is not true, then it is the consequence of llogical's upbringing in life. No-one can choose their beliefs. You can only choose what you would like to study.

I don't have problem with free will. There is no contradiction. I praise Allah SWT that he didn't create me as robot.

Why that bothers you?

 

This is in total contrast with your assertion that everyone who is blind will always be blind.

 

That is analogy. Elhamdulillah religious blindness is not permanent. It is not doom...

You can get it if you want it. If you insist to refuse it not much chance. Only a disaster, accident or grave medical problem can make you brake the chains of vicious cycle.

Bu if If you want that experience you can earn it. Because you are hardwired for belief.

What does the term "temple" tells you?

Temple is place for worship. Do we have a temple in our body?

We do. It is located in our right temporal lobe which is located beneath our right temple? Amazing eh?

 

Our reasoning is in he frontal lobe. Interesingy love and memory is located at the same place with religion.

Keep activating your love experience combined with your memory then you may experience religious feeling of oneness... Because if you choose to forget people you can' love them... If you choose not to remember God you may not maintain love towards him...

 

If choose not to think about the meaning of life you won't get the answer...

 

 

I love it. On one hand, you express the importance of asking 'Why' and being curious about everything with the motive to discover truth - and in the other hand you appear to support the idea of everyone simply being told what is true. You are showing us exactly what it means to be totally opposed to anti-intellectualism, Ghazi Turk. People born in a Muslim country are not at all given their answers early on in life. They are just told that all search is void. They are just told that the conclusion of reality is known in a book called the Qu'ran. That isn't searching, that is accepting what someone tells you is true.

 

Not everybody but many of us get to hear the truth but we choose to overlook it. For example you had enough to hear about the truth of Islam. Thus you don't have any excuse to claim on the day of judgement...

 

But Allah SWT tell us that those who were not notified about the message Allah may choose to forgive them.

Who am I talking about? Those who lived before our prophet Mohammed (PBUH) or hose who died without knowing his message(aborigenes, etc.).

 

You see your position is way beyond that...

Sometimes you are rewarded with the truth early in your life sometimes later. May Allah SWT guide you in the right path.

 

Allah SWT tells us that at a given time not 100% of people would believe. There is going be differences in understanding. But those locations are dynamic, they change. Depending on your initiative. You see, this is left to you. To your free will. On your own initiative. It is the same as how some people choose to study hard and get higher scores in exams. You have that flexibility in religion, too. As you constantly improve yourself you get to better understanding of God and truth.

 

Keep looking for the truth. Don't give up...

PEACE

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Allow me to interject ..If i may :D

 

I don't have problem with free will. There is no contradiction. I praise Allah SWT that he didn't create me as robot.

Why that bothers you?

Quran says"we will what Allah wills" so our choices are ultimately God Given.

 

That is analogy. Elhamdulillah religious blindness is not permanent. It is not doom...

SO If Allah casts a blindness veil on me..I can outsmart him? the almighty? him...and who me? the puny ignorent human? really? :sl:

What does the term "temple" tells you?

Temple is place for worship. Do we have a temple in our body?

We do. It is located in our right temporal lobe which is located beneath our right temple? Amazing eh?

It would be more amazing if there were a Mosqual Lobe or Majidul lobe where the divine logic was hardwired...temple sounds a bit Non Muslimish but Frontal lobe.... maybe that I can use, as in please stop fronting :sl: or maybe that's where fuzzy logic is hardwired. :no:

Not everybody but many of us get to hear the truth but we choose to overlook it. For example you had enough to hear about the truth of Islam. Thus you don't have any excuse to claim on the day of judgement...
I personally hear lotta stuff from J witnesses ( man I have fun with those guys :D )..and Christianity etc...quantity doesn't mean nothing..quality does.
But Allah SWT tell us that those who were not notified about the message Allah may choose to forgive them.

Who am I talking about? Those who lived before our prophet Mohammed (PBUH) or hose who died without knowing his message(aborigenes, etc.)

You mean 140,000 messengers , yet some people still couldn't be contacted by God?..geographical barriers, no wireless signal..why couldn't those be contacted I wonder......but most impotatntly hows that fair?..really?

Some of us gotta bow kneel pray,be humble, no alcohol, no sex, no fun no nothing only because we are informed...while others are beyond reach so part all the time no problem...No fair ! :D

 

Keep looking for the truth. Don't give up...

Now this I can agree with :j:

Peace

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You are still fixated on the first cause...where did human intelleigence Come from?

perhaps where ever god came from...maybe The creator of this universe was also a creation of a bigger creator who made multiple Gods than gave each responsiblity to make and govern a universe...endless regression...who knows :sl:

Well, your argument is useless. After all I bet you are not trying to believe in limited God. You are simply putting your confusions in the way of logic. It would be different if you try to find an answer. Your efforts are against finding an answer. Against any commitment except of the of disbelief..

Assume I supported a limited God he I am almost certain you would be telling why God can't unlimited? Your way of searching for excuse can't help you. You can always find excuses. It is your way of life... Your choice. Going into circles.

 

Here are 2 main points I was trying to make.

1-This universe is not a perfect design.(something you can test by observing the world around us)

2-Human/Humans are also capable of designing great things ( again, observable fact)

 

The term perfect doesn't mean ideal. Perfect order is there. If there are certain things you don't comprehend you simply call them imperfect, bad and even heretic. That is what inquisition did in middle ages... You are on the smae track. Some incidents prove to bring good consequences only after some period of time... Whatever you are thinking of bad can transform into a higher good in some 10 years...

 

Doesn't matter if you still think that "this universe is a design and every design has a designer which is God" because

even if this is a perfect design, it can be a product of multiple architects.

It takes two to make the thing go right..

two people to create life..

Islam spread bcaz of God and Messenger=two

day and night Good/evil =two Bipoloar opposites= two

THERFORE

There must be Two Gods.

 

Childish reasoning... :sl:

Then do you believe in two Gods. Don't bother to answer, you don't. You don't even want to commit in one God, how do you reconcile two. You don't.

Then why do you say those things? Not for your own good but only to confuse others with your fruitless arguments and put them in a position like yourself. Bored there eh? But sorry it doesn't work on us.

You can come o our side. Believe me, more meaningful life and more happiness.

What do you have to offer? Confusion? No thanks...No life...

 

Thus One singularity one God. Unlimited and infinite in good, love, justice and mercy...

That is what gives you the answer. The other possibilities simply don't lead anywhere. If you want an answer you get the ruh of God. If you don't keep circling around till your time expires. Your choice.

You are a living example of that wandering...

PEACE

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I don't have problem with free will. There is no contradiction.

Neither do I have a problem with free-will. But then that is because I am not a Muslim.

 

I praise Allah SWT that he didn't create me as robot.

Why that bothers you?

What you think Allah did does not bother me in the slightest.

 

That is analogy. Elhamdulillah religious blindness is not permanent. It is not doom...

Then the assertion 'everyone who is blind will always be blind' is rendered defunct. Please also use context when quoting me, I find it hard to follow what my comment was referring to.

 

You can get it if you want it. If you insist to refuse it not much chance. Only a disaster, accident or grave medical problem can make you brake the chains of vicious cycle.

Again however, you assert a capacity to change. A potential to see.

 

Bu if If you want that experience you can earn it. Because you are hardwired for belief.

It is debatable that we are hardwired to believe in certain things or certain concepts. It is nonsense that we are hardwired to believe in Islam specifically.

 

What does the term "temple" tells you?

Temple is place for worship. Do we have a temple in our body?

No we do not have a temple as you are describing in our body.

 

We do. It is located in our right temporal lobe which is located beneath our right temple? Amazing eh?

Not really.

 

Our reasoning is in he frontal lobe. Interesingy love and memory is located at the same place with religion.

You've yet to even show that a 'religious' part of the brain even exists. Your psuedo-science is undeveloped beyond assertion.

 

Keep activating your love experience combined with your memory then you may experience religious feeling of oneness... Because if you choose to forget people you can' love them... If you choose not to remember God you may not maintain love towards him...

I asked for peer-reviewed scientific journals documenting the existence of a religious section of the brain. You have yet to even attempt to provide this.

 

If choose not to think about the meaning of life you won't get the answer...

A good thing then, that I do think about the meaning of life. Your lies about me otherwise will be corrected each time you bring them up.

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Not everybody but many of us get to hear the truth but we choose to overlook it.

This is the thing. You are not about truth - you are about indoctrination. You already presumed that Islam is the truth. You already finished your search and you are happy to start throwing your results at everyone else. You are impervious to considering otherwise because according to you Islam is synonymous with truth.

 

Not everyone thinks this. If you really valued truth, you would agree that allowing people to search for themselves and you would support the sum total of all human knowledge. The sum total of all human knowledge combined is the 'truth' if there is an objective truth. What we know is only what we can assume to be the truth. The Qu'ran is not the truth by any standard other than the desire for it to be true.

 

For example you had enough to hear about the truth of Islam.

I've been told that Islam is true. I've been told equally that Christianity is true. On what basis do I have to differentiate here? Why believe your claims that Islam is true over the claims of another individual that Christianity is true? I have no reason to prefer either. The only sincere conclusion is to search. The only sincere conclusion is to study both Christianity and Islam and conclude whether they are true or false. That is searching for the truth. That is searching reality. What you propose and have proposed is indoctrination, or acceptance without question.

 

Many people dislike Dawkins but he made an incredibly pertinent point about religion with this: "It worries me about religion that it teaches people to be satisfied with not understanding."

 

Thus you don't have any excuse to claim on the day of judgement...

What 'day of judgment'? The day of judgment you invoke? The day of judgment that you think will happen? And what will I be judged for exactly? My inability to accept assertions without evidence? My inability to follow the line of obedience?

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The truth is supposed to explain things. The truth is supposed to make sense.

Truth makes this life meaningful.

 

Falsehood and nonsense are on the same camp. Falsehood and nonsense doesn't bring satisfaction and happiness in our life. Whatever lie it might be based on doesn't hold water for long. In several decades it perishes.

Example: atheist Soviet Union and its satellites...

 

 

Now, since we Muslims make sanse and our explanation makes this life meaningful thus we are talking about the truth. And that truth brings us happiness and peace into our lifes.

 

Since whatever you are saying doesn't make any sense and doesn't offer any explanation to the essense of life that means you are very far from the truth. Your way of life is far from claiming happiness and peace. It is more about confusion and compulsions...

 

How about that?

 

Why don't we just look at the endproduct?

 

PEACE

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