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3dshocker

Islam And Discrimination

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Does Islam discriminate against non muslims and people who do not accept the Islamic way of life? -->

 

1 - Does it say to treat them differently from those who accept the Islamic way?

 

2 - Is there a place for such ppl in Islamic society and if so what are the key differences between how these people and muslims are viewed?

 

3 - What happens to those who associate with the non muslim people?

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PropellerAds

Allright..i get to take a first swing at a post. :D

Discriminate tends to have negative implication, the question in a sense sounds like a setup but we'll assume that being a good guy that you are, you don't set up no one. Moving on. .. :D

1 - Does it say to treat them differently from those who accept the Islamic way?

In my view, sure Muslims and non muslims are to get separate treatment, I mean a muslim wouldn't invite a muslim to go to a Masjid with him.

Is there a place for such ppl in Islamic society and if so what are the key differences between how these people and muslims are viewed?

yes but it's not the same place as for muslims, a muslim would rather favor a muslim than a non muslim like maybe a cannibal Satanist for instance.

3 - What happens to those who associate with the non muslim people?

Those who associate with non muslims..when in heaven get only 69 virgins instead of 70...

just kidding, :D but your question was rather open ended though.

 

But honestly , I personally got mixed messages ,here is why.

Quran states " do not befriend christians and jews" but we also know about the story where a women dropped garbage on the prophet everyday and when she became ill and couldn't, the prophet went to her aid. confused? yeah me too but Was the prophet a nice guy or what?

 

As far as the real world practical answer, you know the deal, it's not even about Islam vs Non Islam.

People divide and favor those that are similar to them.On the macro level, we will favor earthlings against aliens (ok.hypothetically) but on the micro level, we favor close relatives vs strangers.

If I didn't answer your questions then next time be specific :D

Or put it in laments terms

peace :D

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Discrimination has a negative implcation only if you want it to. In the west we have things called bonified discrimination against people like pedophiles and murderers. This is discrimination :D Hell, I discriminate against religious ppl on a regular basis :D

 

I was not asking how muslims would deal with non muslims, I was asking how Islam and the Koran(sp?) addresses the issue of non muslims. This forum thus far has me believing I'd be relatively unharmed in an Islamic society cuz it itself is one, but my main question is would people such as me (atheists) be regarded as inferior, evil, damned, isolated or neutral by the teachings of Islam?

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Discrimination has a negative implcation only if you want it to. In the west we have things called bonified discrimination against people like pedophiles and murderers. This is discrimination :D Hell, I discriminate against religious ppl on a regular basis :D

 

I was not asking how muslims would deal with non muslims, I was asking how Islam and the Koran(sp?) addresses the issue of non muslims. This forum thus far has me believing I'd be relatively unharmed in an Islamic society cuz it itself is one, but my main question is would people such as me (atheists) be regarded as inferior, evil, damned, isolated or neutral by the teachings of Islam?

The non mulims have the freedom to practise their religion and non-religion.They have different laws compared to muslims..all the punishment for legal crimes are different unless the crime is committed on a muslim in which u will have to suffer the same punishment for a muslim.Its imperssible to take life of a nonmuslim whos living in muslim lands and such a crime is punishable by death.

 

Muslims in general look down upon other creeds but that doesnt mean ur legally going to be persecuted because of that .

Nothing is wrong with associating with non-muslims ....just that a distance should be kept to be not too influenced by their belief

 

In my view, sure Muslims and non muslims are to get separate treatment, I mean a muslim wouldn't invite a muslim to go to a Masjid with him.

According to Islam a non muslim can enter a masjid provided hes properly dressed and behaves normally..ofcourse u will see some muslims objecting to this ..but thats due to lack of knowledge

Edited by al-malabari

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....um, there is no such thing as legal crimes.

 

Anywho, can you give me an example of the difference when Islamic law is broken? Like say if some atheist commits adultery.

 

So Islam establishes a way of life for non-believers as well? By what authority can this be done as these people would have rejected the existence of god? And what should happen if they go against the way of life set for them by Islam? Like a woman walking down the street in very revealing clothing.

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In the west we have things called bonified discrimination against people like pedophiles and murderers

but u see aren't the criminals rather neagtive people, see how discrimination tends to have negative implication.

 

About surviving athiesm in an Islamic society, I wouldn't bet on it. Just like you can't survive it in a predominantly christian or a jew society without being discrimated against. Also it depends on which society in particular as not all Islamic societies are the same. Forexample, if you move to to Albania is not the same as moving to saudi Arabia (good luck).The important thing is not what are the principles that a society operates upon but what how they practically justify and apply it.also the literacy rate is also inversely related to discrimination. The laws for athiests aren't different, but you won't escape the bias.

Like i said b4, people tend to stick together,

according to anthropological statistics, that the variation of behavior amongst one society is greater than the vaiation between two average individuals from different societies.It wouldn't be fair to draw behavioral inferences based on a society's belief system.

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But honestly , I personally got mixed messages ,here is why.

Quran states " do not befriend christians and jews" but we also know about the story where a women dropped garbage on the prophet everyday and when she became ill and couldn't, the prophet went to her aid. confused? yeah me too but Was the prophet a nice guy or what?

 

:D

 

that is not the actual translation of the verse

 

please provide with the correct translation and base your argument on that(even though this question is directed towards muslims)

:D

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:D

as to answer your question 3dshocker:

 

Islam treats all equally. For instance, zakat(giving charity to the poor) must be distributed amongst the poor, that means muslim and non-muslim. The justice system in Islam is not swayed at all if it is between a muslim and a non-muslim. There are two very specific examples, and if you really would like to know, just ask.

 

The fact is, we must treat everyone with justice. I might not like you because you are an athiest and because you dont believe in god. I may not respect you, but nevertheless, I must treat you with justice like I must treat everyone.

 

:D

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Partial equality is not equality.

 

Al mahal bari pointed out that they are dealt with by different laws, and you say it is all under the same laws. Which is it?

 

It's easy to prove lack of equality in this case since only one instance is needed. As for defending equality in Islam you'd have to succesfully defend against claims of inequality within Islam.

 

Q1 - Is it true that Islam forbids relations with non muslims like llogical said with christians and jews?

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:D

 

you blokes are just so full of it. it is actually funny how ignorant your posts on this thread are.

 

:D

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:D

 

that is not the actual translation of the verse

 

please provide with the correct translation and base your argument on that(even though this question is directed towards muslims)

:D

which 1?

Assuming you mean "do not befriend chrsitian and jews"

Yes it is. For arabic Aya...Look up Quran 5:51

Here are 3 translations

 

YUSUFALI: O ye who believe! take not the Jews and the Christians for your friends and protectors: They are but friends and protectors to each other. And he amongst you that turns to them (for friendship) is of them. Verily Allah guideth not a people unjust.

 

PICKTHAL: O ye who believe! Take not the Jews and the Christians for friends. They are friends one to another. He among you who taketh them for friends is (one) of them. Lo! Allah guideth not wrongdoing folk.

 

SHAKIR: O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people.

Peace

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....um, there is no such thing as legal crimes.

 

Anywho, can you give me an example of the difference when Islamic law is broken? Like say if some atheist commits adultery.

Legal crimes are crimes which are defined by law

If its with a muslim woman u will have to face the punishment for the muslims..if its not and u have ur own laws then i guess that will be followed

 

So Islam establishes a way of life for non-believers as well? By what authority can this be done as these people would have rejected the existence of god? And what should happen if they go against the way of life set for them by Islam? Like a woman walking down the street in very revealing clothing.

Not really..but u will have to adjust to the conditions.Of course if a woman does that she will be told to stop doing that because it offends the muslims.

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Legal crimes

...crimes are illegal though, thats why they're labeled "crimes" :D

 

Not really..but u will have to adjust to the conditions.Of course if a woman does that she will be told to stop doing that because it offends the muslims.

Just realized from that statement our societies had a lot more in common than I realized :D

Have got a bit of thinking to do now... :D

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...crimes are illegal though, thats why they're labeled "crimes" :D

Oops i mean actions which are crimes under law ..sorry

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which 1?

Assuming you mean "do not befriend chrsitian and jews"

Yes it is. For arabic Aya...Look up Quran 5:51

Here are 3 translations

 

YUSUFALI: O ye who believe! take not the Jews and the Christians for your friends and protectors: They are but friends and protectors to each other. And he amongst you that turns to them (for friendship) is of them. Verily Allah guideth not a people unjust.

 

PICKTHAL: O ye who believe! Take not the Jews and the Christians for friends. They are friends one to another. He among you who taketh them for friends is (one) of them. Lo! Allah guideth not wrongdoing folk.

 

SHAKIR: O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people.

Peace

 

:D

 

It has been addressed many times by ulamaa. I dont know if you are arbic or not, but the word is one of those which is difficult to translate. The word is AWLEYAA. The CORRECT translation of this word, or the closest, i should say, is ALLIES or PROTECTORS. The only reason the word "friend" is put in there, is because in the arabic culture, a friend is different from a friend in the american culture. So, now to 3dshocker, it is permissable to have chirstian or jewish friends, or even athiest friends.

 

:D

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:D

this is a more accurate translation:

 

O you who have believed, do not take the Jews and the Christians as allies. They are [in fact] allies of one another. And whoever is an ally to them among you – then indeed, he is [one] of them. Indeed, Allāh guides not the wrongdoing people.

 

(www.)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_www.islambasics(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/view.php?bkID=120&chapter=5"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_www.islambasics(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/view.php?bkID=120&chapter=5[/url]

 

:D

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:D

 

It has been addressed many times by ulamaa. I dont know if you are arbic or not, but the word is one of those which is difficult to translate. The word is AWLEYAA. The CORRECT translation of this word, or the closest, i should say, is ALLIES or PROTECTORS. The only reason the word "friend" is put in there, is because in the arabic culture, a friend is different from a friend in the american culture. So, now to 3dshocker, it is permissable to have chirstian or jewish friends, or even athiest friends.

 

:D

 

So you can befriend an athiest but can't take him as an allie?

that makes much more sense. NOT.

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:D

this is a more accurate translation:

 

O you who have believed, do not take the Jews and the Christians as allies. They are [in fact] allies of one another. And whoever is an ally to them among you – then indeed, he is [one] of them. Indeed, Allāh guides not the wrongdoing people.

 

(www.)"http://islambasics/view.php?bkID=120&chapter=5"]islambasics/view.php?bkID=120&chapter=5[/url]

 

:D

I posted the source of my translation. The translation by Abdullah Yusufali alone is the most widely

accepted one. I may not know what Awliyaa means but then he is wrong as well as Shakir and Pickthal.

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Does Islam discriminate against non muslims and people who do not accept the Islamic way of life? -->

 

1 - Does it say to treat them differently from those who accept the Islamic way?

 

Muslims treat each other as brothers and sister, I guess that means we do treat others diffrantly.

 

2 - Is there a place for such ppl in Islamic society and if so what are the key differences between how these people and muslims are viewed?

 

Omg, I don't get this question. If u mean can they live in peace? Look at Christian ARAB muslims, who have been living their lives with Muslims in harmany for centuries.

 

3 - What happens to those who associate with the non muslim people?

 

Umm, What's wrong with associating with non muslims? Although it is prefered to stay close to peopel who are of the same faith. (Please dont tell me about ur holy "crusade" where u don't care about a persons ethnicity. Everyone has their own discriminations including me.)

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I dont recall saying that?

 

 

I can tell the future in most cases. :D

Aactualy when debating I find that most people make smart comments like that.

So, I decided to put in () that you shouldn't make a smart comment like that, since no human is perfect. We ALL make mistakes, including the prophets.

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There is a hadith that I read on a powerpoint presentation from Medina Masjid in Texas and it said (well it said a lot of things) but the hadith that I am pointing out says "Whoever harms a non-believer I will be his prosecutor on the day of Judgement"-(Prophet Muhammed PBUH) (not exact wording). and there was a Jew who stole I think Umar al Khattab(RA)'s sword (during his Khilafa!!)and he took that Jew to court, everyone knew that Umar(RA) was truthful but the evidence proved that it was the Jew's sword so then the Jew was awarded the sword. The Jew converted on this basis because of the justice and equality of Islam. I ask you non-muslims, if I stole your President's "sword" and the evidence proved it was mine, who would receive the sword. Answer Truthfully.

 

Salamu Alaikum

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:D

 

 

Umar r.a was in one of the cities when he saw a old jew beging on the street. he called who ever was incharge, and told him that the jew had been paying tax all his lfe and now when he was old why should he beg (something to this effect). So he got is income from the state fixed...

 

 

But you have to keep in mind it would be a theocracy so there would be some discrimination on the basis of religion...

 

w/salaam

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I can tell the future in most cases. :D

 

Your prediction fails :D

 

I don't answer my own questions like that, If I thought I had the answers I'd present it as a theory - like in my war on muslims thread.

 

I asked those questions cuz I wanted legitamite Islamic answers to them.

Edited by 3dshocker

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Your prediction fails :D

 

I don't answer my own questions like that, If I thought I had the answers I'd present it as a theory - like in my war on muslims thread.

 

I asked those questions cuz I wanted legitamite Islamic answers to them.

 

 

Omg, I hope u dont take everything to literaly.

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