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3dshocker

Origins Of Morality

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This is actually a spin off of the other atheism thread.

 

Is it just me or do all religious people actually believe that religion is the cause of morals?

*generalization intended as it does seem to apply to all*

 

lemme rephrase that,

 

How many people here (non-atheists) can explain why an atheist has morals without using a reference to religion? Or does that seem as an impossibility?

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It seems like atheists draw them from societal norms, which tend to have their basis in religion. Atheists are just too short-sighted to see that.

 

Look at the 'wild west' of America before the 1900's. Killing 'a chinaman' was not any kind of an issue worth hesitating over. People needed to be told not to murder...throughout history. This amongst other moral issues like having sex with the immediate family <puke>

 

People aren't inherently cognizant of the morals laid down by Islam. Islam being the religion of all the Prophets, may Allah exalt the mention of all of them.

 

Peace,

AS

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This is actually a spin off of the other atheism thread.

 

Is it just me or do all religious people actually believe that religion is the cause of morals?

*generalization intended as it does seem to apply to all*

 

lemme rephrase that,

 

How many people here (non-atheists) can explain why an atheist has morals without using a reference to religion? Or does that seem as an impossibility?

 

Society is based on religious contracts, if u fallows the norms of society. Then u fallow religious authority, but Atheists are to blind to see that. A true Atheist would be a person who excapes the norms of society and does what ever he wishes.

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Society is based on religious contracts, if u fallows the norms of society. Then u fallow religious authority, but Atheists are to blind to see that. A true Atheist would be a person who excapes the norms of society and does what ever he wishes.

 

 

No. That would be a true Anarchist. An atheist is one who doesn't believe in a god or goddess. It has nothing to do with morals. Morality is defined by ones culture, and tend to be fairly pan-global. They also predate religion. Usually, ethics keep one in check with ones society and keep him from doing anything to harm the (tribe, community, country, etc.) through shared values. These values were absorbed into religions, they did not stem from them.

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:D

 

athiests have no real guidelines over generations, so are subject to change and influence. the west is a perfect example of the degredation of morals when religion fails, and how vested interests can influence change.

 

Islam is attractive to many non muslims because of its moral strength. hence its growing popularity , even in the west where it is purposely demonised. Islam keeps going back to its roots, re inventing itself, sheding the toxic skin of negative influence.

 

the west or athiests cant do that . they are subject to influence of media, advertising, interest groups etc. muslims hold strong against these negative forces. and so moral standards are upheld.

 

:D

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:D

 

athiests have no real guidelines over generations, so are subject to change and influence. the west is a perfect example of the degredation of morals when religion fails, and how vested interests can influence change.

 

Islam is attractive to many non muslims because of its moral strength. hence its growing popularity , even in the west where it is purposely demonised. Islam keeps going back to its roots, re inventing itself, sheding the toxic skin of negative influence.

 

the west or athiests cant do that . they are subject to influence of media, advertising, interest groups etc. muslims hold strong against these negative forces. and so moral standards are upheld.

 

:D

care to give a list of the immoral things the west believes in?

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:D

 

athiests have no real guidelines over generations, so are subject to change and influence. the west is a perfect example of the degredation of morals when religion fails, and how vested interests can influence change.

 

If morals didn't change, we would still be keeping slaves and watching men die in Collosseums. If we were still ruled by religion we would be burning young girls as witches and have the Spanish Inquistion roaming the country, torturing whoever they please.I would rather we learned from our elders and changed accordingly, instead of repeating the same mistakes throughout eternity.

 

Islam is attractive to many non muslims because of its moral strength. hence its growing popularity , even in the west where it is purposely demonised. Islam keeps going back to its roots, re inventing itself, sheding the toxic skin of negative influence.

 

I don't really see anyone flocking to Islam in the west. I know it's big in Prisons, though. Most Nation of Islam members join while incarcerated.

 

the west or athiests cant do that . they are subject to influence of media, advertising, interest groups etc. muslims hold strong against these negative forces. and so moral standards are upheld.

 

The west is subject to free information, freedom to choose, and opposing views. Is this really worse than being subject to a small cadre of all-powerful Ayatollahs? And murder is more rife in Islamic countries than western, so how are moral standards upheld? Oh right, the victims are women...

:D

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:D

 

 

care to give a list of the immoral things the west believes in?

 

see the seven deadly sins. oh, and read the ten commandments while your at it. you will see.

 

:D

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:D

see the seven deadly sins. oh, and read the ten commandments while your at it. you will see.

 

:D

 

Muslims break these rules too, Zukiful. Find me a Muslim Saudi Prince who isn't both "Gluttonous" and "Greedy". What about the Palestinian terrorists ( or freedom fighters) who murder and steal israeli weaponry? And can you honestly say there isn't one Muslim who hasn't ever "coveted his neighbours wife?"

 

:D

 

Nice try though, kiddo. You'll make the team next year!

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:D

see the seven deadly sins. oh, and read the ten commandments while your at it. you will see.

 

:D

oh yes, how insightful and mature :D

 

Another churchy complaining about how the west does not follow religious moral code. In other words you complain about rational throught free of religious faith and influence. You fail to grasp the flip side of the wonders the west has to offer and the only complaints you have about us is that we do not fit your religious version of a perfect society. I'f you're not even mature enough to think beyond religious stereotypes against those who aren't religious then just don't bother coming to the west side :D.

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:D

 

you do write such dribble 3d

 

come to the west? im in it, born here.

 

care to give a list of the immoral things the west believes in?
:D

 

see the seven deadly sins. oh, and read the ten commandments while your at it. you will see.

 

 

i gave you the list dummy. stop whinging.

go and watch some .

 

have you ever travelled 3d?

 

 

:D

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ofcourse I have? 3d is not immobile.

 

P.S. How old are you again?

Edited by 3dshocker

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:D

 

and where has your mobility taken you?

 

:D

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This is actually a spin off of the other atheism thread.

 

Is it just me or do all religious people actually believe that religion is the cause of morals?

*generalization intended as it does seem to apply to all*

 

lemme rephrase that,

 

How many people here (non-atheists) can explain why an atheist has morals without using a reference to religion? Or does that seem as an impossibility?

Speaking for myself atleast, I don't think that religion is the SOLE cause of morals.

Culture in general is the cause.

NOt sure why you felt necessary to link this with the athiesm discussion but it's a good discussion anyway. Now b4 we get to philosophy of ethics, I suggest a pollto see if people actually think athiests have no morals. Because otherwise you 're arguing something that people already agree to.

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Hopefully we can find agreement that an atheist has morals that are different from a religious person.

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:D

 

Hopefully we can find agreement that an atheist has morals that are different from a religious person.

 

agreed. however, a religious person would consider some athiest morals , immoral, whilst the athiest would be hard pressed to find anything immoral in religious morals.

 

 

i think you would agree that religions have a stronger, better set of moral standards.

 

how can a society of athiests have a stable society when the y all have their own mish mash of individual moral standards?

 

 

:D

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whilst the athiest would be hard pressed to find anything immoral in religious morals.

immoral? perhaps not. But we do find everything in religion irrational including the basis for morals :D

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:D

 

or that america is home of the brave?

 

:D

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Please Elaborate, with examples

 

Salamu Alaikum

The rationality behind religious morals is by authority of god. Believing in gods existence is irrational and a matter of faith :D

 

lets stick to atheist morals or lack thereof shall we?

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:D

 

3d. could you show us a compilation of athiest moral standards please?

 

:D

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There is no "set standards" or "list" of morals by which atheists live.

 

We are generally individualists who operate under our own code of morals that we have reasoned out. There are several similarities and common ethical views held by atheists but it was not reached through consensus with others but purely through individual thought (it is how we became atheists in the first place ^_^).

 

Some of the morals I live by are stuff like

 

happiness matters more then anything

survival matters second

hating ppl or holding grudges is a waste of time

dont kill except in self defense and defense of another

don't take advantage of another persons handicap -->cheating a salesman who sucks at math

integrity and honesty must never be abandoned

be openminded--> don't accept anything as absolute-->only that it works for now

credentials are the only thing valid to discriminate by

don't steal it if you don't need it to live

etc

 

it really varies from atheist to atheist but stuff like dont kill, be happy, dont steal are usually common

 

 

(So about the question of where does atheist morality come from--> it comes from reasoned out logic about survival. This is a much bigger topic and I'll go into it later in the week when I have time.)

Edited by 3dshocker

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