Jump to content
Islamic Forum
rustykaks

Apostasy in Islam

Recommended Posts

This means that the muslims did the opposite of Allah's will! That is impossible. Allah chooses when the man will die, not His creation. If the man died because of the apostasy law, then Allah chose him to die then. Nobody on earth can do anything oppsite of what Allah wants.

 

 

then why try kill him, if Allah wants him dead, he'll die.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
PropellerAds

:D

Peace.

The main conclusion i've drawn from the Islamonline site is that there is definitely "NO ground at all in the Qur’an for killing an apostate for mere apostasy".

 

"The Qur'an makes clear that there can be no compulsion in religion"

 

:D My opinion to apostasy is that there is nothing to prevent us from refuting our religion or harming anyone else who strayed from the right path. I believe that everyone is entitled to follow his/her own way - Even if that way is wrong.

 

Now, many people may disagree with me on the previous point, but Islam is a religion of submission to Allah, NOT to the state or other people. If someone decides something about his/her life, there is absolutely no way - as long as he/she does not do harm to other people - we should discriminate or punish him/her. He or she cannot submit to the will of other people.

 

Allah gave us the brains, the hands and the will to figure things out by ourselves (it's mentioned in the Quran - forgive me for not citing the verses as i don't quite remember which exact ones) and if that man has decided that Christianity is his way, then let him. As long as THIS does not harm other people in any way, let him be. Allah is more than powerful enough to punish any of His creations if need be. I believe that we cannot deal out the kind of justice that is meant to be dealt out on the Day of the Judgement. :D

 

that was my reaction to the online forum...

 

Peace.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

:D again

 

Might i add that even though everyone is entitled to freedom of thought and all, if someone commits apostasy from Islam, i vehemently approve of peacefully convincing that person to think again. I find that a perfectly acceptable alternative than to end his life...

 

Peace again

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Abdul Rahman's Family Values

 

An official police report on the Christian convert in Afghanistan alleges a tawdry domestic life.

 

By RACHEL MORARJEE/KABUL

 

Western leaders breathed a sigh of relief yesterday at the release of Abdul Rahman, a Christian convert who had faced the death penalty under Afghanistan's Islamic law for renouncing his Muslim faith. Rahman, 40, has become the poster boy for the Christian right and for religious freedom. Closer up, however, the picture painted by the local police who arrested him shows a candidate not quite ready for family values. Rather, a portrait emerges of a deadbeat dad with psychological problems who couldn't hold down a job, abused his daughters and parents and didn't pay child support.

 

(www.)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_www.time(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/time/world/article/0,8599,1178054,00.html"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_www.time(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/time/world/article/0,8...1178054,00.html[/url]

 

/against death penalty for Abdul Rahman anyway b/c there are many requirements that have to be met that are not....

Edited by GLOW

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My view is that the penalty for apostasy in Islam is as stated in the Qur'an below:

 

"Those who believe, then disbelieve, then again believe, then disbelieve and thereafter go on increasing in disbelief, Allah will never forgive them, nor guide them to any way of deliverance". (4:137)

 

I think that it would immediately be obvious that if a person were to be put to death for apostasy, i.e. for disbelieving, it would not be possible to "believe, then disbelieve, then again believe, then disbelieve..."

 

A basic tenet in Islam is that there is no compulsion in religion. Death for apostasy therefore does not make any sense, unless such apostasy was accompanied by a betrayal of or treason or enmity/fighting against the Islamic state/community.

 

Perhaps it may be useful to look into the context and circumstances of the hadiths decreeing the death penalty so that this controversial (and to me unnecessary) subject is laid to rest.

 

Unfortunately I cannot as yet post links here, but my opinion is close to that in the following article:

 

"Is Killing An Apostate in the Islamic Law?" by Ibrahim B. Syed, Ph. D.

President of the Islamic Research Foundation International, Inc.

 

Ridda or Irtidãd: Literally means "turning back". The act of apostasy -- leaving Islam for another religion or for a secular lifestyle.

Murtadd: Literally means "one who turns the back." An apostate.

Murtad Fitri: Literally means apostate - natural. A person born of a Muslim parent who later rejects Islam.

Murtad Milli: Literally means apostate - from the community. A person who converted to Islam and later rejected the religion.

 

Due lack of education and critical thinking several myths have taken root in the Muslim world over the ages, and there have not been any efforts in the past to clear these doubts. On the contrary, there has been a sort of effort to strengthen these myths and misconceptions. These misinterpretations of Islamic teachings have taken their toll on the Muslim world and have strengthened a misplaced perception that Islam is a symbol of obscurantism, a religion of intolerance and answers everything with the sword.

 

And there is no bigger misconception-strengthened with misunderstanding of Islamic beliefs over the years-other than the belief that Islam doesn't tolerate apostasy. The Christian missionaries and the Western world are cashing in on it. Ulama have tried to strengthen their point of view and several leading Muslim reformists have failed to tackle the issue. This misconception has also presented Islam as a medieval and killer religion. Islam bashers have time and again tried to carry the point by pointing out that Islam orders the killing of a person if he or she reverts to another religion from Islam.

 

No body is forthcoming to challenge this widely held belief as well as put forth a convincing argument about the misinterpretation of Qur'anic teachings by Ulama.

 

The Qur’an is completely silent on any worldly punishment for apostasy and the sole Tradition that forms the basis of rulings is open to many interpretations.

 

Prophet (pbuh) is reported to have said: ‘Whosoever changes his religion, Kill Him (man baddala Dinahu faqtuluhu)’”. It is this last quote from the Prophet that forms the basis of the said ruling.

 

While jurists are agreed on the authenticity of this tradition, they differ very widely on the appropriate interpretation and thus, the law concerning apostasy. Understanding the different viewpoints, and arriving at the truth is crucial to our discussion of this subject.

 

This tradition does not refer to Muslims who leave the religion of Islam for other religions. Finally, there is the crucial dispute over the nature of the punishment and the crime. Al-Nakha’ee and, according to Sha’rani, al-Thawri, hold that the apostate is a grave sinner who should however be continuously called back to the fold for the rest of his life, and not killed. By implication, they do not consider the offence a hadd (fixed penalty) offence with a fixed punishment that must be carried out. This view is similar to the view that apostasy is a sin that carries no fixed punishment, and any penalty for it is discretionary (ta’zeer). This is a view held by the Hanbali scholar, Ibn Taimiya and he attributes it as well to the Maliki Imam al-Baji. Among Hanafites, the jurist Shamsuddeen al-Sarakhshi holds the same view. He says in al Mabsut that the fixed penalties or hudud are generally not suspended because of repentance, especially when they are reported and become known to the Imam. He then adds in the case of apostasy “renunciation of the faith and conversion to disbelief is admittedly the greatest of offences, yet it is a matter between man and his Creator, and its punishment is postponed to the day of Judgement. (“fa’l jaza’ ‘alayha mu’akhkhar ila dar al-jaza”).

 

If repentance is accepted, then apostasy is not a hadd offence with a fixed punishment. Secondly, once scholars accept that a Muslim apostate has the right to be given the opportunity to repent, they lose the right to set a time limit for his repentance.

 

Allah (SWT) says in the Glorious Qur’an (39: 53-54: Say: “ O you servants of Mine who have transgressed against your own selves! Despair not of God’s mercy. Behold God forgives all sins, for verily He is much forgiving, a dispenser of grace! Hence, turn toward your sustainer and surrender yourselves unto him before the suffering (of death and resurrection) comes upon you for then you will not be succored.”

 

Any scholar who says the death sentence applies to leaving the faith, then the convict is to be given a life-time to repent, and this is the view of Sufyan al-Thawri, Ibrahim al-Nakha’ee, Shamsuddeen al-Sarakhshi, Imam al-Baji and, by strong implication, Ahmad Ibn Taimiya. One must conclude that the death sentence is not for “simple apostasy” (mujarrad al-ridda), but for apostasy accompanied by treason and sedition, or by the abuse and slander (sabb) of the Noble Prophet.

 

Freedom to convert to or from Islam

 

"Everyone has the right to freedom of thought, conscience and religion; this right includes freedom to change his religion or belief, and freedom, either alone or in community with others and in public or private, to manifest his religion or belief in teaching, practice, worship and observance." Article 18 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights.

 

The Glorious Qur'an says, "Let there be no compulsion in the religion: Surely the Right Path is clearly distinct from the crooked path." Al Baqarah, 2:256.

 

"Those who believe, then disbelieve, then believe again, then disbelieve, and then increase in their disbelief - Allah will never forgive them nor guide them to the path." Surah An-Nisa', 4:137.

 

For example, the Qur'an says: "Let him who wishes to believe, do so; and let him who wishes to disbelieve, do so." (Al-Kahf: 29)

 

In another verse, Allah Almighty says: "Yours is only the duty to convey the message; you are not a guardian over them." (Al-Ghashiyah: 21- 22)

 

The quotation from Surah An-Nisa', 4:137, shown above, seems to imply that multiple, sequential apostasies are possible. That would not be possible if the person were executed after the first apostasy.

 

From the above verses it can be argued that religious freedom and the absence of compulsion in religion requires that individuals be allowed adopt a religion or to convert to another religion without legal penalty.

 

Hence the death penalty is not an appropriate response to apostasy.

 

The former Chief Justice of Pakistan, SA Rahman, has written that there is no reference to the death penalty in any of the 20 instances of apostasy mentioned in the Qur'an.

 

Muslims who support the death penalty for apostasy use as their foundation the above cited hadith, in which the Prophet (pbuh) is reported to have said: "Kill whoever changes his religion." But this is a weak foundation because this hadith was only transmitted from Muhammad (pbuh) by one individual. It was not confirmed by a second person. According to Islamic law, this is insufficient confirmation to impose the death penalty. The Shari`ah has not fixed any punishment for apostasy.

 

The hadith is so generally worded that it would require the death penalty for a Christian or Jew who converted to Islam. This is obviously not the prophet's intent. The hadith is in need of further specification, which has not been documented. Many scholars interpret this passage as referring only to instances of high treason. (e.g. declaring war on Islam, Muhammad (pbuh), God, etc.).

 

There is no historical record, which indicates that Muhammad (pbuh) or any of his companions ever sentenced anyone to death for apostasy.

 

The issue of killing a murtad or the apostate is not a simple one. Scholars have debated it from various angles and it is not simply an issue of killing someone for choosing one religion or another.

 

The question of apostasy has been debated among scholars based on their interpretations of some hadiths since the Qur'an does not specify any worldly punishment for it. For example, there was a case at the time of the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) where a man came to him in three consecutive days and told him that he wanted to apostate. The Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) never took any action against him, and when the man finally left Madina, the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) never sent anyone to arrest him, let alone kill him.

 

This is why some scholars distinguished between individual apostasy and apostasy which is accompanied by high treason. So, it cannot be confused with the freedom of conscience for every individual, which has been guaranteed in the Qur'an through hundreds of verses.

 

For example, one version of a hadith narrated by `A'isha (RA) concerning apostasy relates to one who left his religion and fought against Muslims.

 

QUR'ANIC VIEWS

 

The Qur’an has referred to the issue of apostasy at more than one place (for example see Al-Baqarah 2: 217, Al-Baqarah 2: 108, A’l Imra’n 3: 90, Al-Nisa’ 4: 137 and Al-Nahl 16: 106). But at none of these places does the Qur’an mention the punishment of death for such people who change their religion. The Qur’an does mention that such people shall face a terrible punishment in the hereafter but no worldly punishment is mentioned at any of these instances in the Qur’an. This situation obviously raises a question mark in the mind of the reader that if Allah had wanted to give the punishment of an apostate a permanent position in the Shari`ah, the punishment should have been mentioned, at least at one of the above mentioned places. If the Qur’an had kept completely silent about the apostate, the matter would have been different. But the strange thing is that the Qur’an mentions apostasy, and still does not mention the punishment (if any) it wants the apostate to be subjected to.

 

Furthermore, the Qur’an has strictly disallowed the imposition of the death penalty except in two specific cases. One of them is where the person is guilty of murdering another person and the other is where a person is guilty of creating unrest in the country (fasa’d fil-ardh) like being involved in activities that create unrest in a society, for example activities like terrorism etc. The Qur’an says:

 

Whoever kills a person without his being guilty of murder or of creating unrest in the land, it is as though he kills the whole of mankind. (Al-Ma’idah, 5: 32)

 

Obviously, apostasy can neither be termed as "murder" nor "creating unrest in the land".

 

Thus, in view of the above facts, we are left with one option only. We can only say that either the saying has been wrongly ascribed to the Prophet (pbuh), as it is clearly contradictory to the Qur’an and the Prophet could not have said anything contradictory to the Qur’an, or that the saying ascribed to the Prophet (pbuh) relates not to all apostates but to a particular and specific people.

 

Shaykh Subhani

 

Shaykh Inayatullah Subhani (author of the Book Apostasy doesn't carry death penalty in Islam) says that neither Islam forces any person to embrace neither Islam nor it forces him to remain within its fold. He writes, "Apostasy has been mentioned several times in Qur'an. It also describes the bad treatment that will be meted out for committing apostasy, but it never talks of punishment for the crime in this world." The learned scholar mentions three Ayaat (verses) from Qur'an on apostasy (Al-Baqara 217, Muhammad 25-27 and Al-Maida 54) and then says that none of these Ayaat prescribes any punishment for that though these Ayaat pass strictures on the people who commit it. There are several other Ayaat on the same issue and none of them prescribes either death penalty or any other punishment for apostasy in this world. He then adds that had there been some punishment in Islam for apostasy there was no reason as to why the issue was mentioned repeatedly in Qur'an but no punishment was prescribed.

 

Misinterpretation of the hadith, Man baddala Dinahu faqtuluh (kill him who changes his religion) has caused the problem. This order has been made to look general and permanent, though it was said in a particular circumstance for a particular group. Shaykh Subhani writes that this order was made to counter a scheme prepared by Jews of Madinah. They had planned that some of them embrace Islam for some time and then return to their old religion. Then some other people do the same. It was aimed to create restlessness among Muslims against their own leadership so that the strong Muslim unity should start crumbling. It was made clear in Qur'an in (Aal Imran, 3: 72-73).

 

To counter this planning the Prophet (SAW) ordered his companions to act in such a manner. Despite this order lengthy investigations were made to ascertain that the case was true and the person concerned was given adequate time to explain before the punishment was carried out.

 

Shaykh Subhani says lack of clear grasp of Qur'an misguided even leading Ulama. Otherwise it was not difficult to understand the hadith. Qur'anic teachings on the issue were not kept in mind.

 

He emphasizes that people who were awarded death penalty for reverting to other religions from Islam during the time of the Prophet (SAW) or during the reign of his caliphs were not given the punishment for the crime of apostasy but for the fact that they were at war with Muslims and Islamic government.

 

Shaykh Subhani regrets that punishment that was prescribed for certain people under special circumstances was made to look like a general order. He says that it was the order for people who posed threat to Islamic state and became at war with Islam and not for any person who reverts to other religion.

 

A number of Islamic scholars from past centuries, Ibrahim al-Naka'I, Sufyan al-Thawri, Shams al-Din al-Sarakhsi, Abul Walid al-Baji and Ibn Taymiyyah, have all held that apostasy is a serious sin, but not one that requires the death penalty. In modern times, Mahmud Shaltut, Sheikh of al-Azhar, and Dr Mohammed Sayed Tantawi have concurred.

 

In conclusion, we must never confuse the issue of killing a murtad with the freedom of conscience guaranteed in the Glorious Qur'an. For a detailed discussion, one should read (1) the Dr. Yusuf Al-Qaradawi's book on this issue: Jareemat ar-riddah wal murtadd (The Crime of Apostasy and Apostate) - published by Ar-Risalah foundation.

 

(2) Apostasy doesn't carry death penalty in Islam (Book: Tabdili-e-Mazhab aur Islam) by Maulana Inayatullah Asad Subhani)-published by Idara Ihya-e-Deen, Bilariya Ganj, Azamgarh (UP, India) Pages: 108, Price Rs 30.

 

REFERENCES

1. (www.)"http://religioustolerance#####/isl_apos.htm"]religioustolerance

#####/isl_apos.htm[/url]

 

2. "Islam, Apostasy and PAS," 1999-JUL-22, at: (www.)"http://muslimtents/sistersinislam/"]muslimtents/sistersinislam/[/url]

 

3. S.A. Rahman, "Punishment of apostasy in Islam," Kazi Publ., (1986). Limited availability from Amazon online bookstore).

Edited by yusufar

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
This means that the muslims did the opposite of Allah's will! That is impossible. Allah chooses when the man will die, not His creation. If the man died because of the apostasy law, then Allah chose him to die then. Nobody on earth can do anything oppsite of what Allah wants.

If Allah is letting us do whatever we want..If he will not interfere with our will than sure we can make the wrong choice. Because would u say that Allah wants people to burn in hell? I doubted ....since he is good. still he lets people disobey him ..this proves that he will not interfere with our will.

Furthermore You do not know what Allah wills.. than how can u say what he wills or not will.... we just don't know what he wills.

peace

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hmmm, what happened to a large part of my post? Seems to have been reversed, although I'm quite sure it was all right earlier. Are hackers at work in this forum? Or is it some glitch we are not aware of?

 

Regards,

 

yusufar

islamicunityfoundation

One God One Religion One Community One Nation

Anti-Arab = Anti-Semiticism

Anti-Muslim = Anti-Peace

Anti-Islam = Anti-Civilisation

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Deleted by yusufar - repetition

Edited by yusufar

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
My view is that the penalty for apostasy in Islam is as stated in the Qur'an below:

 

"Those who believe, then disbelieve, then again believe, then disbelieve and thereafter go on increasing in disbelief, Allah will never forgive them, nor guide them to any way of deliverance". (4:137)

 

I think that it would immediately be obvious that if a person were to be put to death for apostasy, i.e. for disbelieving, it would not be possible to "believe, then disbelieve, then again believe, then disbelieve..."

 

A basic tenet in Islam is that there is no compulsion in religion. Death for apostasy therefore does not make any sense, unless such apostasy was accompanied by a betrayal of or treason or enmity/fighting against against the Islamic state/community.

 

Perhaps it may be useful to look into the context and circumstances of the hadiths decreeing the death penalty so that this controversial (and to me unnecessary) subject is laid to rest...................

 

In conclusion, we must never confuse the issue of killing a murtad with the freedom of conscience guaranteed in the Glorious Qur'an. For a detailed discussion, one should read (1) the Dr. Yusuf Al-Qaradawi's book on this issue: Jareemat ar-riddah wal murtadd (The Crime of Apostasy and Apostate) - published by Ar-Risalah foundation.

 

(2) Apostasy doesn't carry death penalty in Islam (Book: Tabdili-e-Mazhab aur Islam) by Maulana Inayatullah Asad Subhani)-published by Idara Ihya-e-Deen, Bilariya Ganj, Azamgarh (UP, India) Pages: 108, Price Rs 30.

 

So you are saying that their is absolutely no evidence in the Quran for death for apostasy ?

 

And you quoted "1" hadith that was for it and said that it is weak.

 

What about the other evidence for it in hadith though ?

 

Volume 9, Book 84, Number 57:

 

Narrated 'Ikrima:

 

Some Zanadiqa (atheists) were brought to 'Ali and he burnt them. The news of this event, reached Ibn 'Abbas who said, "If I had been in his place, I would not have burnt them, as Allah's Apostle forbade it, saying, 'Do not punish anybody with Allah's punishment (fire).' I would have killed them according to the statement of Allah's Apostle, 'Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him.'"

 

This one has been dealt with what about the others ? These are supposed to be Sahih ! :D

 

Translation of Sahih Bukhari

 

"Allah's Apostle said, The blood of a Muslim, who confesses that none has the right to be worshipped but Allah and that I am His Apostle, cannot be shed except in three cases: In Qisas for murder, a married person who commits illegal sexual intercourse and the one who reverts from Islam (apostate) and leaves the Muslims." 9:83:17

 

The legal regulation concerning the male and the female who reverts from Islam (apostates). Ibn 'Umar, Az-Zuhri and Ibrahim said, "A female apostate (who reverts from Islam), should be killed. And the obliging of the reverters from Islam (apostates) to repent. Allah said: — 'How shall Allah guide a people who disbelieved after their belief and (after) they bore witness that the Apostle (Muhammad) was true, and that Clear Signs had come unto them? And Allah does not guide the wrong-doing people. As for such the reward is that on them (rests) the curse of Allah, the Angels, and of all mankind. They will abide there-in (Hell). Neither will their torment be lightened nor it will be postponed (for a while). Except for those that repent after that and make amends. Verily Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful. Surely those who disbelieved after their belief, and go on adding to their defiance of faith, never will their repentance be accepted, and they are those who have gone astray.' (Sura 3:86-90) Bukhari Volume 9, Book 84, Chapter 2, p. 42-43.

 

This hadith actually uses the Quran as well to back up his argument. The first followers believed in the death for aposasy punishment !

 

58. Narrated Abu Burda: Abu Musa said, "I came to the Prophet along with two men (from the tribe) of Ash'ariyin, one on my right and the other on my left, while Allah's Apostle was brushing his teeth (with a Siwak), and both men asked him for some employment. The Prophet said, 'O Abu Musa (O 'Abdullah bin Qais!).' I said, 'By Him Who sent you with the Truth, these two men did not tell me what was in their hearts and I did not feel (realize) that they were seeking employment.' As if I were looking now at his Siwak being drawn to a corner under his lips, and he said, 'We never (or, we do not) appoint for our affairs anyone who seeks to be employed. But O Abu Musa! (or 'Abdullah bin Qais!) Go to Yemen.'" The Prophet then sent Mu'adh bin Jabal after him and when Mu'adh reached him, he spread out a cushion for him and requested him to get down (and sit on the cushion). Behold: There was a fettered man beside Abu Musa. Mu'adh asked, "Who is this (man)?" Abu Muisa said, "He was a Jew and became a Muslim and then reverted back to Judaism." Then Abu Musa requested Mu'adh to sit down but Mu'adh said, "I will not sit down till he has been killed. This is the judgment of Allah and His Apostle (for such cases) and repeated it thrice. Then Abu Musa ordered that the man be killed, and he was killed. Abu Musa added, "Then we discussed the night prayers and one of us said, 'I pray and sleep, and I hope that Allah will reward me for my sleep as well as for my prayers.'" 9:84:58

 

271. Narrated Abu Musa: A man embraced Islam and then reverted back to Judaism. Mu'adh bin Jabal came and saw the man with Abu Musa. Mu'adh asked, "What is wrong with this (man)?" Abu Musa replied, "He embraced Islam and then reverted back to Judaism." Mu'adh said, "I will not sit down unless you kill him (as it is) the verdict of Allah and His Apostle." 9:89:271

 

These Sahih Hadiths contradict the Quran !!! :D

 

Real

Edited by Real Truth Seeker

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
So you are saying that their is absolutely no evidence in the Quran for death for apostasy ?

 

And you quoted "1" hadith that was for it and said that it is weak.

 

What about the other evidence for it in hadith though ?

 

 

 

This one has been dealt with what about the others ? These are supposed to be Sahih ! :D

 

Translation of Sahih Bukhari

This hadith actually uses the Quran as well to back up his argument. The first followers believed in the death for aposasy punishment !

These Sahih Hadiths contradict the Quran !!! :D

 

Real

 

 

Nothing can contradict the Qur'an! :D Perhaps these hadith may not be so sahih after all or there is a context to them which you may not be aware of. Try harder. :D

 

As I have stated in another thread on a similar issue, which since you are bringing it up again, I will repeat here:

"First of all, if Muslims accept the fact that the Qur'an is the literal Word of God that was put in the mouth of the Prophet (pbbuh), which they do, then there cannot be any contradictions, except for later verses which have abrogated other previous verses.

 

On this issue the Qur'an is very clear - there is no compulsion in religion - that is a basic tenet of Islam. There really is freedom of choice to believe or not to believe in Islam. The Qur'an itself does not specify any temporal or worldly penalty for not believing or even for apostacy (disbelieving after believing).

 

How does this square with the fact that punishment in the Hereafter is prescribed for not believing? Isn't that compulsion and isn't that therefore a contradiction?

 

Here one has to be extremely careful about one's position. God has prescribed punishment for unbelief or disbelief and He has also prescribed that there should be no compulsion in religion. What does this mean? Is God contradicting Himself here?

 

Far from it, in fact absolutely NOT.

 

Having prescribed a set of beliefs or truths for mankind's guidance and way of life in Islam, God has both also prescribed a punishment in the Hereafter for not believing and following that guidance and way of life AND given mankind the choice of whether to believe in it and follow it or not.

 

It cannot be any other way. The choice of whether to believe in Islam or not is and must be voluntary and of the individual's own free will, notwithstanding the other-worldly punishment for not believing and accepting Islam.

 

If such punishment had not been so prescribed, what would be the difference between believing and not believing then? No difference! - because whether you believed or not you wouldn't be punished. Happy bliss and real freedom of choice as far as non-Muslims are concerned! They can say what they like about God and His prescribed religion for humankind and get away with it - why become a Muslim then?

 

The difference is that - just as with any other belief - no one can force anyone else to follow Islam and become a Muslim. The acceptance of Islam and its beliefs must come out of real and voluntary internal conviction. This is the meaning of "there is no compulsion in religion".

 

There is no way therefore that there can be any punishment in this life for not believing or for apostacy.

 

Why does such a ruling or "law" exist in Islam therefore? This issue has of course troubled many Muslims minds and been capitalised on by practically all non-Muslims.

 

Let us be very clear about one thing - given the explanation above, such a ruling or law is not in accordance with the Qur'an or God's prescriptions and can therefore be regarded as non-Islamic or un-Islamic, notwithstanding any "scholarly" support for it or (mistaken) belief that it is/was prescribed by God or His Prophet (pbbuh).

 

What therefore should we make of any purported ruling by the Prophet (pbbuh) to "kill the apostates" and which has become the basis for such a law in "Islam"? Even if the majority of Muslims and Muslim scholars agreed on it, it would not be right according to the basic tenets of Islam. Yet it exists and Muslims are troubled to explain it or accept it without question or critical enquiry.

 

Most Muslim scholars who are against such a law point out that it is based on an unauthentified report. Whatever the case is, it certainly cannot be accepted as a bare ruling or law which contradicts the Qur'an. The circumstances surrounding such a ruling (if the fact of it has been authentified beyond doubt) must also be studied.

 

It is obvious that there can be no human law in Islam against (plain) apostacy per se or by itself. However, for example, apostacy which amounts to treason is or could be an entirely different matter. Even then it could amount only to a man-made law and not a God-given one. The Qur'an even cites the case of "multiple apostacy" which would not be possible if the death penalty was the penalty for even one instance of such an "offence".

 

Yet over the course of time, such a man-made law could become "accepted" as Islam, even if there is no prescription for it in the real Islam. Would this make such a law "Islamic"? I don't think so.

 

All nations have laws against treason - most notably the penalty is death, although in some countries a more "enlightened" citizenry with more "humane" ideas has resulted in this being changed to life imprisonment, but a serious penalty nevertheless.

 

There is obviously more to the ruling "kill the apostates" than meets the eye and Muslims should not accept it as it is nor should non-Muslims condemn Islam on the basis of something which may not even be "Islamic" in the first place.

 

As I have pointed out in another thread in this forum, which pardon me for repeating, "many Muslims today, just like non-Muslims as well, carry with them the baggage of centuries of cultural, social and personal prejudices which to them represent "Islam" but is far from the real teachings of Islam.

 

Most people (Muslim and non-Muslim alike) find such entrenched prejudices self-comforting and will not make any effort to change or to even enquire about what the real situation is or should be, yet they will fight to the death and kill many innocents in the process to preserve or worse still propagate what is in reality only highly prejudiced and perverted beliefs. Sad, really.""

 

 

 

Kind regards,

 

yusufar

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

:D

 

These types of apostates should be killed:

 

1. Someone who was born into Islam but never accepted and later in secrecy coverts to another religion. Then without announcing this, he starts to attract others to conversion or he starts carrying out plans to create conflict within the ummah.

 

2. Someone who converts to Islam with the sole intention of creating conflict in the ummah.

 

These people should be advised to return back to the religion and given time to think about their actions. If they insist on staying with their decision and if they don't agree to stop acting in that manner towards the ummah, then if evidence of such actions should be found against them, death punishment should be carried out.

 

People who apostatise and are peaceful towards the ummah should be left alone as then we don't have any right to punish them (i.e it would be like killing an innocent) and the only punshiment for them remains with Allah :D

 

I have arrived with this opinion after reading the whole of this thread.

 

And Allah knows best.

 

Wa'ssalaam

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Mahid,

 

Shouldn't those people just be refused from the Masjid? How can someone claim a religion of peace wishes death on people who do this?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1. Someone who was born into Islam but never accepted and later in secrecy coverts to another religion. Then without announcing this, he starts to attract others to conversion or he starts carrying out plans to create conflict within the ummah.

 

Suppose he announces it and actively tries to convert people over to his side. Then what? Would you kill a man who believes he has found the right path and tries to get others onto it as well?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Peace

 

He's going to create fitnah in the ummah by preaching what he believes in so in that case should be warned and if he doesn't show any reaction then yes he should be killed.

 

Peace

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
He's going to create fitnah in the ummah by preaching what he believes in so in that case should be warned and if he doesn't show any reaction then yes he should be killed.

 

No he won't. Any real muslim would not be misled by his words. Do you think that if an apostate came to you and said: I have found the true path, Islam is false , join me in this or that religion, you would do it? I dont think you would, so why kill him? He would be annoying at best.

 

If "muslims" actually believe him and apostasize then it's good for the Ummah, because the Ummah will be cleansed from False Muslims.

 

Peace

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

:D

 

No he won't. Any real muslim would not be misled by his words. Do you think that if an apostate came to you and said: I have found the true path, Islam is false , join me in this or that religion, you would do it? I dont think you would, so why kill him? He would be annoying at best.

 

If "muslims" actually believe him and apostasize then it's good for the Ummah, because the Ummah will be cleansed from False Muslims.

 

Peace

 

I have a better idea make an announcement that whoever doesn't want Islam please apostatise so that we can separate the real and false muslims.

 

OR

 

We can appoint an apostate to each and every Islamic country so that he can go around the country preaching to separate false muslims from the real ones.

 

I'm talking about the dangerous apostates here not the peaceful ones.

 

Wa'ssalaam

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What exactly is a dangerous apostate?

 

Is Islam the only religion that has a significant portion of its followers that believe death is called for when some people change their religion?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

in modern day it is the biggest one one that believes that, the followers of christianity, judaism, hinduism, buddhism don't really care if you convert out, it's not something worth killing over.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I'm talking about the dangerous apostates here not the peaceful ones.

 

Peace

 

I understand you are saying they are dangerous, but what is so dangerous about them exactly? as long as they do not act violently against muslims, what's the big deal?

 

Peace

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


×