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Dear Looking By

 

I could say more and give arguments, but after an answer to anti-Christian allegations has been judged as "dawa" and edited accordingly, I prefer not to mention them.

 

That's great that you wish to adhere to forum rules, and since this is an Islaamic forum it is hardly surprising that "da'wah" to other religions is not allowed.

 

Thank you for your cooperation.

 

Regards

 

Aboo Uthmaan

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PropellerAds

Where I live, people still marry as young as 12, especially the fula tribe. We don't even raise an eyebrow because its perfectly normally. We'd rather be married at 12 than be pregnant without a husband at 16.

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Peace from our Lord,

That's great that you wish to adhere to forum rules, and since this is an Islaamic forum it is hardly surprising that "da'wah" to other religions is not allowed.

I didn't see it as dawa, I tried to correct a misrepresentation of my faith.

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Dear Looking By

 

I doubt will agree so I guess we will just have to agree to disagree...

 

Regards

 

Aboo Uthmaan

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I wonder how many "christian" or Atheist women living in America and Europe (or anywhere else) are virgins when they get married...

Maybe 1% ? Or 1.2% ?

 

And ofcourse, if you have sex before marriage, you are a FORNICATOR and according to the Old Testament have to be stonned to death!

 

How many Million Fornicators and Adulterours are there among Americans and Europeans (and other non-Muslim countries)...?

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Where I live, people still marry as young as 12, especially the fula tribe. We don't even raise an eyebrow because its perfectly normally. We'd rather be married at 12 than be pregnant without a husband at 16.

where is that? :D

Not to be Nosey or anything but I would like to know if u don't mind telling.

Peace :D

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Peace from our Lord,

I wonder how many "christian" or Atheist women living in America and Europe (or anywhere else) are virgins when they get married...

Maybe 1% ? Or 1.2% ?

As to "anywhere else", my wife comes from a country where I guess more than 90% of Christian women are virginal when they marry.

As to my country, estimates are 5-10% :D But there are Christian groups with a high percentage (officially 100%) of virginal men and women marrying.

 

And ofcourse, if you have sex before marriage, you are a FORNICATOR and according to the Old Testament have to be stoned to death!

Correct.

 

How many Million Fornicators and Adulterours are there among Americans and Europeans (and other non-Muslim countries)...?

How many fornicators and adulterers are there in Muslim countries? According to an anonymous poll, about 25% of young women in Algeria visit a gynaecologist before marriage to regain their virginity. How many of these are no fornicators, God only knows, but I guess there are not that much virginities innocently beeen lost.

 

The reactions to this poll were so strong that AFAIK no-one ever dared to do another such poll in an Islamic country. So this 25% is the only number we can base our estimates upon.

 

As to the number of Islamic adulterers, I know of no poll that may give us a hint. But the alf-lailah-wa-lailah Story is full of successful (i.e. not detected) adulteries in medieval Baghdad.

 

In an open society, You will not only have more adultery and fornicatrion, but You will hear much more about this, since there is not that much need to hide it. And in a society where many people think it is abnormal to stay chaste You will see that many young people want to hide the fact they are still virginal! This does not only apply to those who just didn't have the opportunity, but to some degree to those who don't want to give away their virginity. Not everybody has the courage to speak straight against the majority and suffer ridicule because he or her is still virginal.

 

Everyone is a sinner in this or other way, and the New Testament teaches us it are not just the deeds, but also the thoughts that are sinful. So one just dreaming about fornacation and adultery is no less a sinner in God's eyes than one who gets the opportunity to actually commit it.

 

And I don't know any statistics about how much Westerners, Muslims, Buddhists or whatsover enjoy such thoughts instead of keeping a pure mind...

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where is that? :D

West Africa.

(www.)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_en.wikipedia(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/wiki/Fulani"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_en.wikipedia(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/wiki/Fulani[/url]

Their language belongs to the Afroasiatic Language group, together with "Berber", Somali, Semitic languages and so on. The Plural Fulbhe (singular pullo) is quite regular!

(information from Greenberg, Languages and Language Groups in Africa)

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Everyone is a sinner in this or other way, and the New Testament teaches us it are not just the deeds, but also the thoughts that are sinful. So one just dreaming about fornacation and adultery is no less a sinner in God's eyes than one who gets the opportunity to actually commit it.

 

Actual fornication is a graver sin in God(swta)'s sight than thinking about fornication. If a thought of fornication just pops up in a person's head all of a sudden but he pushes it aside,then he hasn't commited a sin. But I think that if you dream/fantasize about fornication knowingly then it's a sin but less graver than actual fornication.

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If a thought of fornication just pops up in a person's head all of a sudden but he pushes it aside,then he hasn't commited a sin.

Agreed. I did not want to say anything diferent. Thank You for clearifying the matter, I'm sorry that I have been so imprecise.

 

But I think that if you dream/fantasize about fornication knowingly then it's a sin but less graver than actual fornication.

I don't think You can judge how grave a sin is by just looking unto a table :D God judges what is in our hearts. We are told one who knows has greater sin than someone who was unlearned in that matter.

 

And if not committing the actual sin just because you don't have the oportunity (in this case: You find it impossible to get a fornication partner) makes you no better than one who got this oportunity.

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Dear all

 

Regarding intending to do good, in Islaam we get rewarded for such an intention, and if we carry out what we intended we get multiple rewards, however, for a bad intention (or thoughts) there is nothing on us, that is unless we carry out that bad intention or thought, but there is some detail to this, lets say a person intended to rob a bank but changed his mind, then such a bad intention will not be written down, but if a person intended to rob a bank and on his way to the bank his car broke down then it will be written down as a bad deed because he still intended to do the bad but was prevented. I hope that makes sense!

 

And Allaah knows best!

 

Regards

 

Aboo Uthmaan

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Agreed. I did not want to say anything diferent. Thank You for clearifying the matter, I'm sorry that I have been so imprecise.

I don't think You can judge how grave a sin is by just looking unto a table :D God judges what is in our hearts. We are told one who knows has greater sin than someone who was unlearned in that matter.

 

And if not committing the actual sin just because you don't have the oportunity (in this case: You find it impossible to get a fornication partner) makes you no better than one who got this oportunity.

 

Allah(swta) judges what is in our hearts but most importantly our actions,since you can love God(swta),know that you're gonna be judged and still knowingly commit a sin.

 

I think that we both agree that the best thing is not to fantasize about fornication,intend to fornicate since it all leads unto temptation.

 

Brother Abu Uthmaan gave a nice explanation.

 

Allah(swta) knows best.

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West Africa.

(www.)"http://en.wikipedia/wiki/Fulani"]en.wikipedia/wiki/Fulani[/url]

Their language belongs to the Afroasiatic Language group, together with "Berber", Somali, Semitic languages and so on. The Plural Fulbhe (singular pullo) is quite regular!

(information from Greenberg, Languages and Language Groups in Africa)

 

Thanks for answering that looking by.

Illogical I live in the Gambia, West Africa. Its very common to see fula girls especially and some other tribes get married as young as 12 and start their marriage life imediately and they do just fine.

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Thanks for answering that looking by.

Illogical I live in the Gambia, West Africa. Its very common to see fula girls especially and some other tribes get married as young as 12 and start their marriage life imediately and they do just fine.

we're going by the 400 day /yr calendar right? :D

Just kidding :D

thanks for the info...I would'nt have imagined it to be so otherwise.

Caz 12 in my eyes is way...wayy..wayyyy too young but that's just my opinion and

if the Fula people have theirs...So I gotta respect that..

thanks again... :D

 

peace :D

Edited by llogical

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peace

 

i'm going to copy and paste another part of my assighnment here: :D

 

 

 

Aisha was 6 years old when the prophet ﺼﻟﻰﺍﷲﻋﻟﻴﻪﻭﺴﻠﻡ married and 9 when the marriage was consummated†they claim this was raping when no proof could not be found of hazrat Aisha ever complaining of this.â€

Remember when she consummated her marriage she was an adult no longer a child, she had, had her first menstruation which means adolescence. I have got the following information from www.ageofconsent(contact admin if its a beneficial link)

 

“In the u.s.a last century the age of consent was 10 years old. California was the first state to change it to 14 which it did in 1889â€

 

Now compare the fact that Aisha was 9 yr old, an adult child when she consummated her marriage. No one ever during the era ever criticized the marriage. Even the bitterest enemies of Islam. As for Jewish religion they are allowed to get married to 3 years old girls no one what so ever criticized that. The basic fact to remember here is that a girl becomes a woman when she begins the menstruation cycles.

 

another part:

The marriage of Aisha has been discussed, but the point missed was that the prophet being an example in all aspects, he had to be an example in marriage as well, if he only married widowers, then it would have been a Sunnah to marry widowers not the virgins, keeping this in mind the prophet of Allah married Aisha, his only virgin wife, as in those days to get married to older girls, would rarely be getting married to a virgin. As in those days girls got married young.

 

peace out

Edited by twinkle

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“In the u.s.a last century the age of consent was 10 years old. California was the first state to change it to 14 which it did in 1889â€

100+ years is very long...I doubted in women or blacks could vote in the 1800s

In US the legal age varies amongst states...under 14 is a no no and under 18 require parental consent.

(www.)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_www.coolnurse(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/marriage_laws.htm"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_www.coolnurse(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/marriage_laws.htm[/url]

I personally thought 13 was too young and Under 13, a kid is legally a child regardless of MC.

peace

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100+ years is very long...I

peace

 

peace

 

illogical, i only made that point to show that around 1400 years ago the prophet consumated the marriage with Aaisha when she was 9, there was nothing wrong with it at that time, as there was nothing wrong with the age of consent being 10 around 100 yrs ago,

 

peace

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peace

 

illogical, i only made that point to show that around 1400 years ago the prophet consumated the marriage with Aaisha when she was 9, there was nothing wrong with it at that time, as there was nothing wrong with the age of consent being 10 around 100 yrs ago,

 

peace

Point well taken. :D

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Let me ask all the non-muslims here a question...

 

DO YOU THINK IT'S WRONG FOR A 9 YEAR OLD TO GET MARRIED BUT IT'S PERFECTLY OK FOR HER TO HAVE A BOYFRIEND???!!!

 

By what law do you judge? The law of the Creator or the law of man ???

 

not even law of man... but law of the godless "moderne man".

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Peace from our Lord,

DO YOU THINK IT'S WRONG FOR A 9 YEAR OLD TO GET MARRIED BUT IT'S PERFECTLY OK FOR HER TO HAVE A BOYFRIEND???!!!

Please stop shouting! :D There are other means for emphasis!

 

Sleeping with a 9-year old child is usually considered as child abuse (aka pedophelia) in the West. This applies to "boyfriends" (or "girlfriends", if the child is a boy), of course, as it is unlawful in Western countries to marry at such an age.

 

By what law do you judge? The law of the Creator or the law of man ???

Same question to You. An exception done by an exceptional person is not a "law". To mention a similar example: no Muslim will follow Muhammad in taking more than four wives ... this shows that You will be misguided if You just take everything Muhammad did as a law for Yourself.

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the main point of my post here is that this is a common anti Islamic allegation.

it needs to be discussed openly if you guys are ever going to be taken seriously. thank you for doing so.

does anyone here think it is ok to sleep with a 13 yr old girl in todays society?

 

As for ur first comment, u must understand that the Prophet marrying Asiah is a non-issue for Muslims. As for ur second question the legal age in Japan is 13, did u know that? Infect many countries with a population decline its the same. For example in America the legal age in some states is 14, also the Mormans have more wives younger then the age of 16 then any group of people in this planet.

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Very interesting AhQee,

 

I just wanted to say that if I had a daughter who reached puberty, I would allow her to get married IF:

 

1- She understands the meaning, importance, seriousness of marriage. As well as her rights as a woman and a wife and future mother and rights of her husband and a future father.

 

2-If the man who wishes to marry my daughter is Muslim

 

3-If the man who wishes to marry my daughter is a practicing Muslim that understands his position and duties as a Muslim husband. As is not some immature man who just wants to engage in sexual relations.

 

I was so surprised to find out that most of the boy and girls in North America have had some type of sexual experience by the time they're 12!!! Obviously they are not kids!

 

So if my 13 year old daughter found a suitable husband who loves and wants to take care of her all his life in an Islamic manner, of course I would let them get married!.

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Peace from our Lord,

I just wanted to say that if I had a daughter who reached puberty, I would allow her to get married IF:

...

What if she does not want to marry? Would You try to persuade her to marry if You think You got a suitable husband for her?

 

I was so surprised to find out that most of the boy and girls in North America have had some type of sexual experience by the time they're 12!!! Obviously they are not kids!

I'm not sure about that word. Im my mother tongue we borrowed the word "kid" with the meaning "adolescent", a person neither a child nor an adult.

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Guest amani
Peace from our Lord,

 

What if she does not want to marry? Would You try to persuade her to marry if You think You got a suitable husband for her?

 

Hi

 

such a marriage where the girl is married with force is considered forbidden Islamically and an opression. one can give their child advice but cannot force a child to get married

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:D / Peace to All

 

To mention a similar example: no Muslim will follow Muhammad in taking more than four wives ... this shows that You will be misguided if You just take everything Muhammad did as a law for Yourself.

 

Looking by, can you please clarify what you are saying here? I'm not offending you or looking for an argument, but are you doubting what our Prophet Muhammad :D did?

 

What if she does not want to marry? Would You try to persuade her to marry if You think You got a suitable husband for her?

 

In Islam, the girl is supposed to choose to either accept or decline a marriage proposal from a prospective groom's family. Nothing is to be forced upon her.

 

I'm not sure about that word. Im my mother tongue we borrowed the word "kid" with the meaning "adolescent", a person neither a child nor an adult.

 

Interesting language lesson...

 

Ironically, this is about what this thread is about. Who is to say which girl or boy has reached puberty in mental and physical attributes? Who is to say who is a child/adolescent/teenager/adult? Who is to say who is old enough to marry? This is all relative.

 

You cannot say Aisha (may Allah be pleased with her) was too young, because at that time it was normal according to the customs for young girls to get married. Aisha knew the responsibilities bestowed upon her as the Prophet's wife, and she entered the courtship willingly.

 

It's kind of strange to think that in some countries the age of consent (legal age to have sexual relations) is in the range of 13 to 16, and that's ok. But when it comes to marriage, its not.

 

I see that the topic starter was Mr BNP, a christian. May I ask how old was Mary (may Allah be pleased with her) when she was married to Joseph (may Allah be pleased with him)? Anyone can answer this...

 

:D / Peace

Edited by freedslave

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