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Muhammed (pbuh) & The Bible

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As Salaam Alaikum

I believe that our beloved prophet (PBUH)is mentioned both in the Torah & the Bible.

A sister i met on IF yesterday says she has studied the Bible but found no mention of Muhammed (PBUH).

she is a christian

Alhamdolillah she does not beieve in the trinity.

can anyone at IF can help prove to her that Bible does prophesy the coming of the last prophet?

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PropellerAds

:D

 

(www.)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_www.Islam-qa(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/index.php?QR=44018&ln=eng"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_www.Islam-qa(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/index.php?QR=44018&ln=eng[/url]

 

Some of the things mentioned in the previous Books are as follows:

 

1 – In the Torah, in the Book of Deuteronomy 18:18-19 it says:

 

“I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their brothers; I will put my words in his mouth, and he will tell them everything I command him.

 

If anyone does not listen to my words that the prophet speaks in my name, I myself will call him to account.â€

 

(New International Version)

 

This text is still extant among them. With regard to the phrase “from among their brothers†– if that prophet were to be from among the Children of israel, it would have said, “I will raise up for them a prophet from among them.†But it says “from among their brothers†– i.e., from among the sons of Ismaa’eel (Ishamel).

 

Secondly, it says in the Gospel of John 16:6-8, 12-13:

 

“It is for your good that I am going away. Unless I go away, the Counselor [Paraclete] will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you. 8When he comes, he will convict the world of guilt in regard to sin…

 

I have much more to say to you, more than you can now bear. 13But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all truth. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come.â€

 

(New International Version)

 

This cannot apply to anyone except the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him).

 

And Allaah knows best.

:D

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:D

 

(www.)"http://Islam-qa/index.php?QR=44018&ln=eng"]Islam-qa/index.php?QR=44018&ln=eng[/url]

 

Some of the things mentioned in the previous Books are as follows:

 

1 – In the Torah, in the Book of Deuteronomy 18:18-19 it says:

 

“I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their brothers; I will put my words in his mouth, and he will tell them everything I command him.

 

If anyone does not listen to my words that the prophet speaks in my name, I myself will call him to account.â€

 

(New International Version)

 

This text is still extant among them. With regard to the phrase “from among their brothers†– if that prophet were to be from among the Children of israel, it would have said, “I will raise up for them a prophet from among them.†But it says “from among their brothers†– i.e., from among the sons of Ismaa’eel (Ishamel).

 

Secondly, it says in the Gospel of John 16:6-8, 12-13:

 

“It is for your good that I am going away. Unless I go away, the Counselor [Paraclete] will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you. 8When he comes, he will convict the world of guilt in regard to sin…

 

I have much more to say to you, more than you can now bear. 13But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all truth. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come.â€

 

(New International Version)

 

This cannot apply to anyone except the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him).

 

And Allaah knows best.

:D

 

 

 

 

Jesus Christ is the center of history as time was split by his birth, death and resurrection;

 

BC and AD is because of Jesus Christ. No man effected the world like Jesus Christ.

 

When God handed down the Law to Moses at Sinai the descendents of Ishmael were not even there.

 

Present with Moses were the twelve tribes, which were the descendents of the twelve sons of Jacob.

 

Over four hundered years had passed since Abraham.

Remember the israelis were four hundred years in slavery in Egypt.

 

(They started out in Goshen when Joseph was prime minsiter of Egypt, but a Pharoah rose who knew not Joseph)

 

So when God told Moses what he did recorded in Deuteronomy 18.18 he did not refer to any of Ishmael's descendents, they were not even there.

 

"......I will raise up a Prophet unto them......."

 

"them" is israel.

 

israel does not recognize Muhammed as a prophet.

 

How could you think that God raised up Muhammed unto israel?

 

"From among their brothers" Jesus of the tribe of Judah was RAISED FROM THE DEAD

 

You cannot be more raised than that. Muhammed was never raised fromt he dead.

 

In Acts 3.22-26.... Peter explains that the Prophet Moses spoke of is Jesus Christ.

 

Also Jesus said that Moses spoke of him inJohn 5.47 ...he referred to Deuteronomy 18.18

 

 

The Comforter came in Acts 2 when the Holy Ghost was poured out on the Day Of Pentecost as prophesied by the prophet Joel and clarified by Peter.

 

 

The Bible is true from beginning to end, there are no contradictions.

 

I could prove that so called contradictions are not contradictions at all.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

'

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The Koran states that Allah does not beget;

 

BUT, the Bible says that God beget a Son...it is Jesus

 

so the Koran and the Bible do not agree.

 

And the Torah was given over 2500 yeatrs before Muhammed was born in Mecca.

 

The Old Testament as proved by the Dea Sea Scrolls is over 2000 years old, whereas all that Muhammed taught is centuries after the Jews gave the world monotheism that the Lord is One.

 

 

Please consider that I amn ot trying to offend or insult you prople, but as we decided we are discussig the Bible and Muhammed.

 

The Bible tells the story of Jesus and of only Jesus.

 

I could prove this.

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:D

 

Please take the time to watch this and then judge for yourself. :D

 

Prophet Muhammed (pbuh) mentioned in the Bible by Name. A talk by the late Sheikh Ahmed Deedat.

 

(www.)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_video.google(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/videoplay?docid=1837525168870785121&q=muhammad+in+the+bible"]Part 1[/url]

 

 

(www.)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_video.google(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/videoplay?docid=-7198131202643066388&q=muhammad+in+the+bible"]Part 2[/url]

Edited by ~mehnaz~

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:D

 

Please take the time to watch this and then judge for yourself. :D

 

Prophet Muhammed (pbuh) mentioned in the Bible by Name. A talk by the late Sheikh Ahmed Deedat.

 

(www.)"http://video.google/videoplay?docid=1837525168870785121&q=muhammad+in+the+bible"]Part 1[/url]

(www.)"http://video.google/videoplay?docid=-7198131202643066388&q=muhammad+in+the+bible"]Part 2[/url]

 

 

 

I've already seen all that. I have studied the Koran for three years, and the Hadiths.

 

How convenient for you people here, that not one of you can debate,

so you copy and paste.

 

Is there not one Muslim here who can debate a Christian?

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I've already seen all that. I have studied the Koran for three years, and the Hadiths.

 

How convenient for you people here, that not one of you can debate,

so you copy and paste.

 

Is there not one Muslim here who can debate a Christian?

 

 

Greetings,

 

We engage in discussions here, not debate. We do not believe in winning or losing "debates".

 

Everyone has their own style and way of doing things. Some cut and paste, some do more. That has no bearing on the level of a person's knowledge or ability to discuss or "debate".

 

I am engaged in other discussions right now so may not be able to provide immediate feedback, but if there's anything you would like to really discuss do let me know. When I have a bit of free time I may address some of the issues which you have raised.

 

Regards,

 

yusufar

(www.)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_www.islamicunityfoundation(contact admin if its a beneficial link)"]The Islamic Unity Foundation[/url]

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I've already seen all that. I have studied the Koran for three years, and the Hadiths.]

As salaam Alaikum

I am happy that you have studied the Quran for three yrs and the Hadiths too.

let me clarify some points:

1. in your first post you had said that you do not believe in the trinity. well muslims also do not believe in the trinity. could you tell the name of the Bible you read so that i can read it too. it obviosly is not the roman catholic or the methodist version.

2. you say you believe in only one God that is Jehova. In Arabic the same God is called Allah. Just like the names of some prophets - eg Joseph (pbuh) is called yousuf in arabic. so where is the conflict.

3. From the time of Adam (pbuh) till Muhammed (pbuh) all the prophets have preached the same religion. there is only one God.

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I've already seen all that. I have studied the Koran for three years, and the Hadiths.

As ssalaam alaikum

there is one more question i want to ask sharon. Do you believe in the original sin?

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As ssalaam alaikum

there is one more question i want to ask sharon. Do you believe in the original sin?

 

 

 

Yes, I believe in one God because of

Deuteronomy 6.4" Hear O israel, the Lord our God is one Lord"

 

The trinity notion was invented by the Catholics in about the 3rd century or so,

but the apostles never taught a trinity.

No, I do not believe in original sin, but I do believe in the Genesis account

of how sin entered the world.

 

God gave Adam and Eve a clear command...that they could eat of every tree

in the garden, except for the one in the midst of the garden.

That eating from it would cause their death.

 

They were in perfect obedience to God until the serpent came and

called God a liar.

But immediately God dealt with them and actually spoke to the serpent

telling him he would put enmity between his seed (serpent)

and the seed of the woman.

 

Since a woman does not have seed (only a man does)

this clearly indicated a virgin birth.

It would have to mean that a woman will become impregnated

somehow with seed not from a man.

 

The story continues through the Bible about how this

seed is brought into the world.

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I'm sorry, I forgot to answer your question

asking which Bible do i read.

 

I own about tweny Bibles, and have also the talking Bible,

The Illustrated Bible on cassettes.

 

The Bible I least like is the Living Bible,

but the one I like the best is the King James version.

 

My problem with the Koran is I have not found anything in it that I don't

already know.

 

I started reading God's Word when I was 17 years old

and studied it for many, many years seriously,

but I did not start reading the Koran until about three years ago,

but after reading the Koran, I did not find even one thing I did not already know from reading God's written Word, the Bible.

 

Exactly what is the message of the Koran?

 

because I could not find anything in it that Moses did not already say.

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My problem with the Koran is I have not found anything in it that I don't

already know.

 

I started reading God's Word when I was 17 years old and studied it for many, many years seriously, but I did not start reading the Koran until about three years ago, but after reading the Koran, I did not find even one thing I did not already know from reading God's written Word, the Bible.

 

Exactly what is the message of the Koran?

 

because I could not find anything in it that Moses did not already say.

 

 

Greetings Sharon,

 

The central theme of the Qur'an basically is about the Absolute Unity of God. This concept is found in "The Unity Chapter" - Surah At-Tawhid (also known as "The Sincerity Chapter" - Surah Al-Ikhlas and guidance to the right path or way, which is the 5 times daily prayer, the very first or "The Opening Chapter" - Surah Al-Fatihah.

 

Since Islam is a continuation and seal of the whole Prophetic tradition, the central message is the same as it has always been from the time of Adam (pbuh) to Abraham (pbuh) to Moses (pbuh) and to Jesus (pbuh).

 

The Qur'an confirms all previous Scripture, including the Torah and the Gospel (the Bible).

 

The big difference is of course the position of the Prophet Muhammad (pbbuh) as the Seal (last) of all the Prophets of God, in whose mouth God put His Word, which became the Qur'an or "The Recital".

 

Because most previous Scripture has either disappeared or been corrupted, there will also be other significant differences from what you think you already know from the Bible.

 

May God guide you to the Right Way, the Way of Jesus (pbuh) and the Prophets before him and the Way of the Prophet (pbbuh) after him.

 

Regards,

 

yusufar

(www.)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_www.islamicunityfoundation(contact admin if its a beneficial link)"]The Islamic Unity Foundation[/url]

Edited by yusufar

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but after reading the Koran, I did not find even one thing I did not already know from reading God's written Word, the Bible.

 

Exactly what is the message of the Koran?

 

because I could not find anything in it that Moses did not already say.

As salaam alaikum

dear sharon-that is the whole point. Moses, Noah, Abraham, Lot, Solomon, jesus & all other prophets( peace be upon them) preached the same thing . you have the Quran. if you open to surah XXVI Surah Shu'ara you will undestand what i mean.

the Quran Says clearly that there is no Trinity. Does king James version say this too?

and you did not answer my other question about original sin.

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As salaam alaikum

dear sharon-that is the whole point. Moses, Noah, Abraham, Lot, Solomon, jesus & all other prophets( peace be upon them) preached the same thing . you have the Quran. if you open to surah XXVI Surah Shu'ara you will undestand what i mean.

the Quran Says clearly that there is no Trinity. Does king James version say this too?

and you did not answer my other question about original sin.

 

 

 

Well, God bless you, but I believe that Jesus is God himself.

 

Jesus came preaching repentance and the Kingdom of God.

 

I did answer your query about original sin. I am very much against trinity doctrine

and the Roman Catholic Church, the Mormons, the Jehovah's Witnesses,etc.

 

I think it is neat how you people pray five times a day.

It seems you are really into your beliefs.

 

I do not believe that Muhammed said what the Lord said

the Lord was crucified for our sins and was risen from the dead by God's power.

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God said, through Prophet Muhammed (peace be upon him):

 

"I who cannot fit into universes upon universes, fit into the heart of the sincere believer."

 

This shows how vast, and immense our hearts have the potential to be. I think it's one of the most beautiful things i've heard.

 

Sharon, I don't want to hurt you, but God is so immense He cannot fit into a human body. Anything we can imagine God to be, is not Him.

 

When Jesus (pbuh) speaks of the coming of the Comforter in the Bible, the word Comforter is translated "Muhammadim" in the Hebrew Bible.

 

I pray that God opens up your heart to see the Truth, and I hope you give Quran another chance.

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I own about tweny Bibles,

The Bible I least like is the Living Bible,

but the one I like the best is the King James version.

As Salaam Alaikum

You own 20 Bibles and the are all different to some extent. that is why you like the King James version & not the Living Bible.there may be more than 20 versions.

HAVE YOU EVER THOUGHT ABOUT WHY THERE IS ONLY ONE VERSION OF THE QURAN?

whether you buy it in UK or USA or Dubai or China The Quran is the same . word to word .

The Quran Has remained unchanged since Prophet Muhammed's (pbuh) time because every word is true and Allah has Himself taken the responsibility of preserving it.

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Jesus Christ is the center of history as time was split by his birth, death and resurrection;

 

BC and AD is because of Jesus Christ. No man effected the world like Jesus Christ.

 

This is no longer true. The terms BC and AD are no longer used in the present times - BCE and CE are used instead. In any event, historically it appears that the dating of Jesus' (pbuh) birth was not accurate.

 

There are two different accounts in the Gospels that chronologists find incompatible.

 

In Matthew it is stated that Jesus (pbuh) was born at a time when Herod the Great was still alive and that Herod ordered the slaughter of infants two years old and younger (Matt. 2:16). Since Herod died in 4 BC (contra Dionysius Exiguus), it has been concluded that the year 6 BC is the most likely year of Jesus' birth. So Jesus (pbuh) would have been around 4 to 6 years old in AD/CE 1.

 

But Luke places Jesus' (pbuh) birth during a census conducted under the governorship of Quirinius. According to Josephus, this census was done in AD 6. Which then is the correct account?

 

When God handed down the Law to Moses at Sinai the descendents of Ishmael were not even there.

 

Present with Moses were the twelve tribes, which were the descendents of the twelve sons of Jacob.

 

Over four hundered years had passed since Abraham.

Remember the israelis were four hundred years in slavery in Egypt.

 

(They started out in Goshen when Joseph was prime minsiter of Egypt, but a Pharoah rose who knew not Joseph)

 

So when God told Moses what he did recorded in Deuteronomy 18.18 he did not refer to any of Ishmael's descendents, they were not even there.

 

"......I will raise up a Prophet unto them......."

 

"them" is israel.

 

israel does not recognize Muhammed as a prophet.

 

How could you think that God raised up Muhammed unto israel?

 

"From among their brothers" Jesus of the tribe of Judah was RAISED FROM THE DEAD

 

You cannot be more raised than that. Muhammed was never raised from the dead.

 

In Acts 3.22-26.... Peter explains that the Prophet Moses spoke of is Jesus Christ.

 

Also Jesus said that Moses spoke of him in John 5.47 ...he referred to Deuteronomy 18.18

The Comforter came in Acts 2 when the Holy Ghost was poured out on the Day Of Pentecost as prophesied by the prophet Joel and clarified by Peter.

The Bible is true from beginning to end, there are no contradictions.

 

I could prove that so called contradictions are not contradictions at all.

 

Perhaps you could start by proving when exactly Jesus (pbuh) was born.

 

So you agree then that Jesus (pbuh) was just a Prophet? Obviously Moses (pbuh) did not say that God would raise His "Son" from among their brothers. If Jesus (pbuh) was the "Son of God" as Christians claim, or that this prophecy referred to him, why doesn't it say so then?

 

Ishmael's (pbuh) descendants may not have been there with their "cousins" (brothers) but they were certainly all over the area at that time.

 

Why does God say that the Prophet would come from their "brothers" if it was already obvious and referred to them?

 

Your argument also contradicts itself since israel did not recognize Jesus (pbuh) as a prophet either - which he was, or "The Prophet" or that Prophet - "like unto Moses" - which Jesus (pbuh) was not but which Muhammad (pbbuh) was.

 

There has always been a messianic expectation among the "long-suffering" Jews, but the Prophet prophesied by Moses was not to come from them but their brothers, although he would be raised "unto them".

 

Being raised as a mercy to mankind, this would necessarily include israel as well, and it is in this sense that it can be said that Muhammad (pbbuh) was raised unto israel. He was also a continuation of a long line of Prophets, many but not all of whom were Jews.

 

There is nothing in this prophecy about that Prophet being raised from the dead. israel did not know of this and never acknowledged it and neither did Jesus (pbuh) or his disciples teach it.

 

Regards,

 

yusufar

(www.)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_www.islamicunityfoundation(contact admin if its a beneficial link)"]The Islamic Unity Foundation[/url]

Edited by yusufar

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Bismillahirrahmaanerraheem

 

Prophet Mohammad pbuh was mentioned in the Song of Songs (in the Old Testament) which is also known as Song of Solomon.

The original name of this song was Shir Hashirim.

This is what it says in Hebrew, 5:16

Chiku mamtakim v'khulo machamadim zeh dodi v'zeh re'i b'not yerushalayim

In English, 5:16:

His conversation is sweetness itself, he is MACHAMADIM, such is my beloved oh daughters of Jerusalem.

The word MACHAMADIM:

Firstly, the CH used is the same as the H used in arabic for the word MOHAMMAD. The IM at the end is just like the one used for ELOHIM. The IM at the end of ELOHIM is agreed by Jews and most Christians to be a sign of respect, like THE ELOH, or the Great Eloh, or the Majestic Eloh, etc.

Hence, the same applies to Machamadim. So the actual word is Machamad, and as we discussed the CH is the same as the H in Mohammad so the word is MAHAMAD!

 

Finally, the vowels are agreed by Biblical scholars to have been inserted much later in history. So the actualy word is MHMD. This is exactly how the word Mohammad is written in Hebrew. In other words, if the Bible was to mention the name of Prophet Mohammad pbuh, it would be mentioned as MHMD, and this is the case in Shir Hashirim.

Also, the name of the song is very intresting. The original name was Shir Hashirim, which means Song of Hashirim. The IM as we have already shown is a sign of respect, so it's actually Shir Hashir, meaning Song of Hashir.

In Sunan Tirmidhi (a famous Hadith book) we read that one of the names of Prophet Mohammad pbuh was Hashir !!!

Shir Hashirim also gives a description of MHMD, which fits in exactly with the description of Prophet Mohammad pbuh as recorded in the Hadith books. If anyone is intrested, I can give a list of such narrations.

 

Peace unto those who follow the Guidance

Edited by newnew

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Prophet Mohammad pbuh was mentioned in the Song of Songs (in the Old Testament)

 

As salaam alaikum

your post was very interesting and informative. please do give more references of Mohammed pbuh in the Bible or Tauret. also in the new testament.

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Bismillahirrahmaanerraheem

 

So the name MHMD (Mohammad) is certainly in the Bible, in the "Song of Songs", also known as "the song of Solomon", the correct name being "Shir Hashirim". This book is in the Old Testament so it is agreed upon by both Christians and Jews.

Now let us see who this person is... who is MHMD ? What is his description?

Let us continue reading the Song of Songs/Shir Hashirim:

 

SONG OF SONGS 5:10

"My beloved is white and ruddy, the chiefest among ten thousand."

 

Now let us compare this with the description of Prophet Mohammad (pbuh) in the Hadith:

HADEETH ON WHITE AND RUDDY (reddish) SKIN:

Rosy color [sahih Bukhari 4:747];

"White man reclining on his arm" [sahih Bukhari, 1:63];

Whiteness of his armpits [sahih Muslim, 4:1000];

Whiteness of his legs [sahih Muslim, 4:1014, 19:4437];

Whiteness of his cheek [sahih Muslim 4:1208];

Whiteness of his belly [sahih Muslim 19:4442].

In all these narrations his whiteness is pointed out as something exceptional for an Arab.

 

HADEETH ON "THE CHIEFEST AMONG TEN THOUSAND":

 

"The Prophet left Medina (for Mecca) IN THE COMPANY OF TEN THOUSAND (Muslim warriors) in Ramadan" [sahih Bukhari 5:574]

Also see Sahih Bukhari 5:622; 626

 

SONG OF SONGS 5:11

"His head is as the most fine gold, his locks are bushy, and black as a raven."

 

"His hair GLOSSY AND BLACK, INCLINED TO CURL, he wore long." [Zad al Ma`d 2:45]

"His head was large, well formed and set on a slender neck." [Zad al Ma`ad 2:45]

"When he (The Prophet, May Allah peace and blessings be upon him) died, HE HAD SCARCELY TWENTY WHITE HAIRS IN HIS HEAD AND BEARD." [sahih Bukhari 4:747,748]

"Anas was asked about the old age of Allah's Apostle (May Allah peace and blessings be upon him). He said, 'Allah DID NOT BLEMISH HIM WITH WHITE HAIR." [sahih Muslim 30:5784]

"I said to him: O son of my brother, the hair of the Messenger of Allah (May the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) was THICKER THAN YOUR HAIR AND THEY WERE FINER (than yours)." [sahih Muslim, 3:642]

 

SONG OF SONGS 5:12

"His eyes are as the eyes of doves by the rivers of waters, washed with milk, and fitly set."

 

"He had black attractive eyes finely arched by continuous eyebrows." [Zad al Ma`d 2:45]

 

"Allah's Messenger (May the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) had a broad face with REDDISH (wide) EYES.." [sahih Muslim 30:5776] (Note: Doves have reddish eyes. To see the eyes of a Whitewing dove of Palestine click here)

 

SONG OF SONGS 5:13

"His cheeks are as a bed of spices, as sweet flowers: his lips like lilies, dropping sweet smelling myrrh."

 

"He (The Prophet, May the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) also patted my cheek and I experienced a coolness or a fragrance of his hand as if it had been brought out from the scent bag of a

perfumer." [sahih Muslim, 30:5758]

 

"I never smelt ambergris or musk as fragrant as the fragrance of the body of Allah's Messenger (May the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him)." [sahih Muslim, 30:5759]

 

"I never smelt musk or ambergris and found its fragrance as sweet as the fragrance of Allah's Messenger (May the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him)." [sahih Muslim 30:5760]

 

"Allah's Messenger (May the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) had the most handsome face amongst men." [sahih Muslim 30:5772]

 

SONG OF SONGS 5:14

"His hands are as gold rings set with the beryl: his belly is as bright ivory overlaid with sapphires."

 

"The Prophet had big hands, and I have never seen anybody like him after him" [sahih Muslim 7:792]

 

"I never touched brocade and silk (and found it) as soft as the softness of the palm of Allah's Messenger (May the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him)" [sahih Muslim, 30:5760]

 

"WHITENESS OF HIS BELLY" [sahih Muslim 19:4442]

 

 

SONG OF SONGS 5:15

"His legs are as pillars of marble, set upon sockets of fine gold: his countenance is as Lebanon, excellent as the cedars."

 

"He (The Prophet, May the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) was innocently bright and had BROAD COUNTENANCE." [Zad al Ma`ad 2:45]

 

"..my knee touched the thigh of the Prophet of Allah (May the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him). The wrapper got aside from his thigh, and I could see its whiteness." [sahih Muslim 19:4437]

 

 

Notice all the above are from the same Chapter. Finally we get to verse 16, where it says:

His conversation is sweetness itself, he is MACHAMADIM, such is my beloved oh daughters of Jerusalem.

 

As we've already seen on my previous post, Machamadim is the same as Mohammad.

 

We also mentioned that the song's name is Shir Hashirim, and that Hashir is one of the names of Prophet Mohammad (pbuh). Here is the Hadith:

 

"Abu Musa al Ash`ari reported that Allah's Messenger (May the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) mentioned many names of his and said, 'I am Mohammad, Ahmad. Muqaffi, Hashir, the Prophet of

Repentance, and the Prophet of Mercy." [sahih Muslim, 30:5813]

 

 

 

After the coming of Prophet Mohammad (pbuh) some Christians and Jews have tried to alter the meaning of the Songs of Songs...some say it's about a Woman!! Most Christians say it's about the Church, and most Jews say it's about God!!

 

Let's see what classical Jewish scholars had to say about this book (song of songs/shir hashirim):

"The whole world is not worth the day on which the Song of Songs was given to israel; for all the writings are holy, but the Song of Songs is the holiest of the holy."

[Rabbi Akiva (died AD 135), Tractate of Yaddayim (3:5), Mishna]

 

"...and the book itself as an allegory depicting in great detail the experiences of the nation in its relations with its God from the Exodus down to *THE COMING OF THE MESSIAH AND THE BUILDING OF THE THIRD TEMPLE.* This in general is also the interpretation of the Midrash Rabbah and such famous scholars as Saadia ben Joseph, Rashi, and Ibn Ezra, although they differ considerably among themselves in details."

[The Interpreter's Bible Encyclopedia]

 

Ofcourse, Prophet Mohammad (pbuh) is not the Messiah, and ofcourse the Song of Songs never says it is about the coming of the Messiah, but let us remember that Jews often referred to future Prophet/prophets as "Messiah". The "Third Temple" mentioned here is none other than Ka'bah in Meccah.

 

This so-called "Third Temple" is mentioned in other parts of the Bible as the Next house of God (which is a better description of Ka'bah).

In another book of the Old Testament, Haggai, we read:

Haggai 2:7 "And I will shake all nations, AND THE DESIRE OF ALL NATIONS SHALL COME: and I will fill this house with glory saith the Lord of hosts."

 

In place of "desire of all nations", the Hebrew text uses one single word: "CHMD" which is pronouncable as "ACHMAD" (which is "AHMAD" in Arabic). Thus, the translation would be, "And I will shake all nations, AND AHMAD SHALL COME: and I will fill this house with glory saith the Lord of hosts."

 

Immediately after that, Haggai 2:9 says "The glory of this latter house shall be greatesr than the former: and in this place will I give PEACE, saith the Lord of hosts."

 

And we know that one of the meanings of Islam is Peace.

 

Christians and Jews should certainly open their eyes, what more could they want?

 

Infact, there is more, there is another chapter of the Bible that gives a perfect description of Prophet Mohammad's Hijrah. But for now, this is enough.

 

Peace unto those who follow the Guidance

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also in the new testament.

Wa alaykumussalam wa Rahmatullah

Sorry sister I have not found any clear refrences to Prophet Mohammad (pbuh) in the New Testament other than those already pointed out by other brothers and sisters on this thread.(there are many more from Old Testament though, but I feel we've shown enough for the time being.) Wassalam

Edited by newnew

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Jesus Christ is the center of history as time was split by his birth, death and resurrection;

 

BC and AD is because of Jesus Christ. No man effected the world like Jesus Christ.

 

When God handed down the Law to Moses at Sinai the descendents of Ishmael were not even there.

 

Present with Moses were the twelve tribes, which were the descendents of the twelve sons of Jacob.

 

Over four hundered years had passed since Abraham.

Remember the israelis were four hundred years in slavery in Egypt.

 

(They started out in Goshen when Joseph was prime minsiter of Egypt, but a Pharoah rose who knew not Joseph)

 

So when God told Moses what he did recorded in Deuteronomy 18.18 he did not refer to any of Ishmael's descendents, they were not even there.

 

"......I will raise up a Prophet unto them......."

 

"them" is israel.

 

israel does not recognize Muhammed as a prophet.

 

How could you think that God raised up Muhammed unto israel?

 

"From among their brothers" Jesus of the tribe of Judah was RAISED FROM THE DEAD

 

You cannot be more raised than that. Muhammed was never raised fromt he dead.

 

In Acts 3.22-26.... Peter explains that the Prophet Moses spoke of is Jesus Christ.

 

Also Jesus said that Moses spoke of him inJohn 5.47 ...he referred to Deuteronomy 18.18

The Comforter came in Acts 2 when the Holy Ghost was poured out on the Day Of Pentecost as prophesied by the prophet Joel and clarified by Peter.

The Bible is true from beginning to end, there are no contradictions.

 

I could prove that so called contradictions are not contradictions at all.

'

 

 

Please tell me how Jesus had affected the world.

 

My response: There were prophets such as Adam, Enoch, Noah, Heber, Shelah, Abraham, Lot, Ishmael and Isaac before Jacob because Allah (God) had chosen them to be His prophets and they were not the israelites. Therefore non-israelites had their right to be the prophets of Allah(God). The prophethood did not and does not belong to israelites. Can you dictacte to God what you like and what you don't? You can't!

 

Sharon said: "israel does not recognize Muhammed as a prophet."

 

My response: israel is not God so israel has no right to say that Muhammad is not a prophet!

 

 

Sharon said: "How could you think that God raised up Muhammed unto israel? "From among their brothers" Jesus of the tribe of Judah was RAISED FROM THE DEAD. You cannot be more raised than that. Muhammed was never raised fromt he dead."

 

 

My response: Muhammad was a brethren of the israelites because Muhammad was a descendant of the prophet Ishmael and Ishmael was the legitimate eldest son of Abraham and isaac was his younger brother.

 

 

Sharon said: "In Acts 3.22-26.... Peter explains that the Prophet Moses spoke of is Jesus Christ. Also Jesus said that Moses spoke of him inJohn 5.47 ...he referred to Deuteronomy 18.18"

 

My response: Nowhere in the Old Testament mention Jesus by name. The term 'Messiah', translated as 'Christ', is nota name but a title. Is there a single Prophecy where it says that the name of the Messiah will be JESUS, and that his mother's name will be MARY, that his supposed father will be JOSEPH THE CARPENTER; that he wil be born in the reign of HEROD THE KING, etc. etc.? No! There are no such details!

 

The Biblical prophecies on the advent of the Prophet Muhammad are evidence of the truth of Islam for people who believe in the Bible.

 

In Deuteronomy 18, Moses stated that God told him: “I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their brothers; I will put my words in his mouth, and he will tell them everything I command him. If anyone does not listen to my words that the prophet speaks in my name, I myself will call him to account.†(Deuteronomy 18:18-19).1

 

From these verses we conclude that the prophet in this prophecy must have the following three characteristics:

1) That he will be like Moses.

2) That he will come from the brothers of the israelites, i.e. the Ishmaelites.

3) That God will put His words in to the mouth of this prophet and that he will declare what God commands him.

Let us examine these three characteristics in more depth:

 

1) A prophet like Moses:

There were hardly any two prophets who were so much alike as Moses and Muhammad . Both were given a comprehensive law and code of life. Both encountered their enemies and were victorious in miraculous ways. Both were accepted as prophets and statesmen. Both migrated following conspiracies to assassinate them. Analogies between Moses and Jesus overlook not only the above similarities but other crucial ones as well. These include the natural birth, the family life, and death of Moses and Muhammad but not of Jesus. Moreover Jesus was regarded by his followers as the Son of God and not exclusively as a prophet of God, as Moses and Muhammad were and as Muslims believe Jesus was. So, this prophecy refers to the Prophet Muhammad and not to Jesus, because Muhammad is more like Moses than Jesus.

Also, one notices from the Gospel of John that the Jews were waiting for the fulfillment of three distinct prophecies. The first was the coming of Christ. The second was the coming of Elijah. The third was the coming of the Prophet. This is obvious from the three questions that were posed to John the Baptist: “Now this was John’s testimony, when the Jews of Jerusalem sent priests and Levites to ask him who he was. He did not fail to confess, but confessed freely, “I am not the Christ.†They asked him, “Then who are you? Are you Elijah?†He said, “I am not.†“Are you the Prophet?†He answered, “No.†(John 1:19-21). If we look in a Bible with cross-references, we will find in the marginal notes where the words “the Prophet†occur in John 1:21, that these words refer to the prophecy of Deuteronomy 18:15 and 18:18.2 We conclude from this that Jesus Christ is not the prophet mentioned in Deuteronomy 18:18.

 

2) From the brothers of the israelites:

Abraham had two sons, Ishmael and Isaac (Genesis 21). Ishmael became the grandfather of the Arab nation, and Isaac became the grandfather of the Jewish nation. The prophet spoken of was not to come from among the Jews themselves, but from among their brothers, i.e. the Ishmaelites. Muhammad , a descendant of Ishmael, is indeed this prophet.

Also, Isaiah 42:1-13 speaks of the servant of God, His “chosen one†and “messenger†who will bring down a law. “He will not falter or be discouraged till he establishes justice on earth. In his law the islands will put their hope.†(Isaiah 42:4). Verse 11, connects that awaited one with the descendants of Kedar. Who is Kedar? According to Genesis 25:13, Kedar was the second son of Ishmael, the ancestor of the Prophet Muhammad.

 

3) God will put His words in the mouth of this prophet:

The words of God (the Holy Quran) were truly put into Muhammad’s mouth. God sent the Angel Gabriel to teach Muhammad the exact words of God (the Holy Quran) and asked him to dictate them to the people as he heard them. The words are therefore not his own. They did not come from his own thoughts, but were put into his mouth by the Angel Gabriel. During the life time of Muhammad and under his supervision, these words were then memorized and written by his companions.

Also, this prophecy in Deuteronomy mentioned that this prophet will speak the words of God in the name of God. If we looked to the Holy Quran, we will find that all its chapters, except Chapter 9, are preceded or begin with the phrase, “In the Name of God, the Most Gracious, the Most Merciful.â€

 

Another indication (other than the prophecy in Deuteronomy) is that Isaiah ties the messenger connected with Kedar with a new song (a scripture in a new language) to be sung to the Lord (Isaiah 42:10-11). This is mentioned more clearly in the prophecy of Isaiah: “and another tongue, will he speak to this people†(Isaiah 28:11 KJV). Another related point, is that the Quran was revealed in sections over a span of twenty-three years. It is interesting to compare this with Isaiah 28 which speaks of the same thing, “For it is: Do and do, do and do, rule on rule, rule on rule; a little here, a little there.†(Isaiah 28:10).

Note that God has said in the prophecy of Deuteronomy 18, “If anyone does not listen to my words that the prophet speaks in my name, I myself will call him to account.†(Deuteronomy, 18:19). This means that whoever believes in the Bible must believe in what this prophet says, and this prophet is the Prophet Muhammad.

 

Sharon said: “The Bible is true from beginning to end, there are no contradictions.â€

 

My response: The entire Bible is corrupted and unreliable and is mostly filled with man-made laws and corruption! "`How can you say, "We [the Jews] are wise, for we have the law of the LORD," when actually the lying pen of the scribes has handled it falsely?' (From the NIV Bible, Jeremiah 8:8)"

 

The Revised Standard Version makes it even clearer: "How can you say, 'We are wise, and the law of the LORD is with us'? But, behold, the false pen of the scribes has made it into a lie. (From the RSV Bible, Jeremiah 8:8)"

 

In either translation, we clearly see that the Jews had so much corrupted the Bible with their man-made cultural laws, that they had turned the Bible into a lie!

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Bismillahirrahmaanerraheem

 

As promised, here is yet another prophecy about the coming of Prophet Mohammad (pbuh) in the Bible... the book of Isaiah.

 

Isaiah 21:

 

6 For thus said the Lord unto me: `Go, station the watchman, That which he seeth let him declare.' 7 And he hath seen a chariot -- a couple of horsemen, The rider of an , the rider of a camel, And he hath given attention -- He hath increased attention! 8 And he crieth -- a lion, `On a watch-tower my lord, I am standing continually by day, And on my ward I am stationed whole nights. 9 And lo, this, the chariot of a man is coming, A couple of horsemen.' And he answereth and saith: `Fallen, fallen hath Babylon, And all the graven images of her gods He hath broken to the earth. 10 O my threshing, and the son of my floor, That which I heard from YHWH of Hosts, God of israel, I have declared to you!'

 

11 The burden of Dumah. Unto me is [one] calling from Seir `Watchman, what of the night? Watchman, what of the night?' 12 The watchman hath said, `Come hath morning, and also night, If ye inquire, inquire ye, return, come.'

 

13 The burden on Arabia. In a forest in Arabia ye lodge, O travellers of Dedanim. 14 To meet the thirsty brought water have Inhabitants of the land of Tema, With his bread they came before a fugitive. 15 For from the face of destructions they fled, From the face of a stretched-out sword, And from the face of a trodden bow, And from the face of the grievousness of battle. 16 For thus said the Lord unto me: `Within a year, as years of a hireling, Consumed hath been all the honour of Kedar. 17 And the remnant of the number of bow-men, The mighty of the sons of Kedar are few, For YHWH, God of israel, hath spoken!'

 

The meaning:

First it mentions the coming of riders on hourses. Then the rider of an . Then the rider of a Camel.

The Prophecy states that these riders on hourses will defeat Babylon.

 

" A couple of horsemen.' And he answereth and saith: `Fallen, fallen hath Babylon, And all the graven images of her gods He hath broken to the earth. 10 O my threshing, and the son of my floor, That which I heard from YHWH of Hosts, God of israel, I have declared to you!' "

 

This is what Cyrse the Great did. Cyrus is mentioned in the Quran as "Zul-Qarnayn". He was a righteous King (and some say a Prophet) who saved the sons of israel from the oppression of the idol worshipping Babylonian Kingdom. The Persians are known to have been Monotheistic at the time, and so was Cyrus/ZulQarnayn.

 

The one riding an is clearly the Messiah, 'Eesa (Jesus) peace be upon him. Christians definitely agree that Jesus came after Cyrus, and that Jesus used to ride a donkey, and there are other prophecies in the Old Testament that mention the Messiah coming, riding on an /Donkey.

 

There is some explanation given regarding the rider on the :

"11 The burden of Dumah. Unto me is [one] calling from Seir `Watchman, what of the night? Watchman, what of the night?' 12 The watchman hath said, `Come hath morning, and also night, If ye inquire, inquire ye, return, come.' "

 

Seir is associated with Jesus in the Bible. The test also mentions something about returning and coming (which could be referring to the return of the Messiah in the ends of time.)

 

 

Finally we have the Clearest of all these prophecies! A prophecy about a man riding a Camel.

We know that Prophet Mohammad (pbuh) used to ride a Camel, as did all Arabs. We also know that Prophet Mohammad (pbuh) came after Cyrus and Jesus!

 

The Bible then gives an explanation, a clear prophecy about who this man is:

 

 

13 The burden on Arabia. In a forest in Arabia ye lodge, O travellers of Dedanim. 14 To meet the thirsty brought water have Inhabitants of the land of Tema, With his bread they came before a fugitive. 15 For from the face of destructions they fled, From the face of a stretched-out sword, And from the face of a trodden bow, And from the face of the grievousness of battle. 16 For thus said the Lord unto me: `Within a year, as years of a hireling, Consumed hath been all the honour of Kedar. 17 And the remnant of the number of bow-men, The mighty of the sons of Kedar are few, For YHWH, God of israel, hath spoken!

 

So it makes it clear that he will come from ARABIA.

It mentions an Arab FUGITIVE who must be helped by other tribes. This fugitive has fled from other Arabs (Kedar) who wanted to kill him.

This is just like the historical HIJRAH of Prophet Mohammad (pbuh) who left Meccah after it's people tried to kill him, and went to Medinah along with Hazrat Abu Bakr, both riding on Camels. When they came to Medinah, the people there helped him, gave him food and water, thus obeying the order in the book of Isaiah!!!

The Bible makes it clear that Kedar and Tema (the two tribes mentioned in Isaiah 21) are Arab tribes, the sons of Ishmael:

 

Genesist 25:13 and these [are] the names of the sons of Ishmael, by their names, according to their births: first-born of Ishmael, Nebajoth; and Kedar, and Adbeel, and Mibsam, 14 and Mishma, and Dumah, and Massa, 15 Hadar, and Tema, Jetur, Naphish, and Kedemah

 

So the Bible is ordering the people to help this fugitive, not to oppose him as the Jews and Christians did!

It also prophecises the defeat of Kedar (the Meccans were defeated without a fight, as they all surrendered to Prophet Mohammad pbuh and his companions as they came in from Medinah with an army).

 

This is certainly a clear prophecy, just as the previous one (Shir Hashirim) was. May Allah guide us to the right path, Ameen.

 

Peace unto those who follow the Guidance

Edited by newnew

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I've already seen all that. I have studied the Koran for three years, and the Hadiths.

 

How convenient for you people here, that not one of you can debate,

so you copy and paste.

 

Is there not one Muslim here who can debate a Christian?

 

Peace Sharon7!

 

I saw great confidence in your initial posts, and a challenge to 'debate' on a discussion forum. But you left the ground on 12 May when my brothers and sisters started presenting facts from the Old and New Testament.

 

In another post you have claimed that the Bible is God's word. My question to you, if you happen to come back is which of the 20 that you have are you refering to? Furthermore, aren't the books in the New Testament writings of the Apostles. They aren't even writings of Jesus (on him be peace), on whom the Injeel was revealed according to our beliefs.

 

Peace out

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Notice we dont see any Christians or Jews (or any other religion) posting on this thread anymore .....

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