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Saltwater Nomad

Muslims Against Sharia?

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Karachi protest at Sharia Masjid

 

The rally was organised by the Muttahida Qaumi Movement

 

 

Karachi protest

Tens of thousands of people have protested in the Pakistani city of Karachi against a radical Masjid and its religious schools in Islamabad.

The chief cleric of the Lal Masjid (Red Masjid), Abdul Aziz, had announced a Taleban-style Islamic court would be set up to curb "vulgar" activities.

 

He also gave the government a month to close video shops and brothels.

 

The protest organisers, the Muttahida Qaumi Movement (MQM), branded the Masjid "religious terrorists".

 

Fatwa

 

The MQM is largely supportive of the policies of the President Pervez Musharraf.

 

MQM leader Altaf Hussain told the rally by telephone from London via loudspeakers: "Islam is a religion of peace and there is no place in it for using force or terrorism.

 

"The people of Islamabad are insecure and under threat due to the activities of these religious terrorists."

 

Abdul Aziz is a vocal critic of the Pakistan government's support for the US-led war on terrorism.

 

Last week he announced a court based on Islamic Sharia law and began an anti-vice campaign.

 

The court passed a fatwa on Tourism Minister Nilofar Bakhtiar after she was pictured hugging a man following a paragliding flight.

 

Mr Aziz has also threatened to "take action" if the government moved against his Masjid.

 

Analysts say Mr Musharraf has been criticised for not taking a harder line but may be reluctant in an election year.

 

(you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/6558501.stm"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/6558501.stm[/url]

 

----------------------

 

 

Surprising turn for most of us Westerners, but good on the Pakistanis for standing up against the goons who are trying to radicalise their religion. I truly believe that nations like Pakistan are key in defeating the rising monster of Islamist extremism, and keeping Islam as much of a religion of peace as possible. Salaam Aleikum to the good men and women of Pakistan.

Edited by Saltwater Nomad

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Peace Saltwater Nomad,

 

I think someone beat you with 5 minutes.... :sl:

 

(you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetgawaher(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/index.php?showtopic=39758&pid=418397&st=0entry418397"]same topic[/url]

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Peace Saltwater Nomad,

 

I think someone beat you with 5 minutes.... :sl:

 

(you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetgawaher(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/index.php?showtopic=39758&pid=418397&st=0entry418397"]same topic[/url]

 

 

Dang! but isn't this news rather than Islamic Discussiion...? Plus, I don't think I'm qualified to partake in and Advanced Isllamic discussion..

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saltwater: why is it so surprising? Despite what western media tries to paint, and despite the fact that there IS a rising tide of Islamic fervour sweeping the world (i merely note it, not judge or justify it), still the strongest counter-force to this fundamentalism comes from within Islam itself. As indeed it must, the self-proclaimed anti-islamic-fundamentalism of bush and his merry (fundamentalist) nazis are actually one of the prime causes of this.

 

true evolution comes from within, and this is as true of organisations as it is people.

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saltwater: why is it so surprising? Despite what western media tries to paint, and despite the fact that there IS a rising tide of Islamic fervour sweeping the world (i merely note it, not judge or justify it), still the strongest counter-force to this fundamentalism comes from within Islam itself. As indeed it must, the self-proclaimed anti-islamic-fundamentalism of bush and his merry (fundamentalist) nazis are actually one of the prime causes of this.

 

true evolution comes from within, and this is as true of organisations as it is people.

 

 

It's surprising because Abdul Aziz and his Masjid wield tremendous power in his area, and I did not expect such a large demonstration against him.

 

It's the same as an 10,000 strong Anti-Bush rally composed of Texan Baptist Gun-owners in Crawford... there's no reason it shouldn't happen, but it's not something you expect.

 

 

Hopefully Aziz gets the message and stops thinking he is the incontrovertible voice of the people after this.

Edited by Saltwater Nomad

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MQM, lol, and these uninformed Westerners. lol.

 

MQM , Mutahida Qoumi movement is a state sponsored organization , and whole state power was backing this protest. They only have power in only one city KARACHi and their politics is based on rasism, and mostly , infact all supporters of this party are muhajir. They rule Karachi for last 20 years, but last elections witnessed for the first time that they lost two key seats in Karachi and one in hyderabad against Islamists (MMA) for the first time in 20 years. There is a clear evidence in last elections about the rise of Islamist supporters in Karachi, people turning their back towards this secular organization and supporting Islamists of Jammat e Islami. Their vote bank fall down sharply, although they won majority of seats, but the margin of votes was very thin and at every area, runners up were Islamists.

 

My own family was supporter of this idiot Altaf Hussain, but now like many, are supporting jammat e Islami atleast at the time of election. MQM itself is a terrorist organiozation, you can easily find latest guns in the hands of their young workers. Most of their leaders are out of Pakistan including their crap leader Altaf hussain, because most of them are involved in murder cases.

 

Go, and tell him to organize same rally out of Karachi, you will find less than 10 people.

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Finally.

 

hahahahaha do you know what the MQM is...........they are responsible for so much fighting and bloodshed in karachi........they hate other people of pakistan just because they are from a different province and speak a different language........

 

 

the MQM have fought with the people who speak punjabi or who are from punjab, they fought people from all over pakistan just for speaking a different language.........pathans, balochis...you name 'em. If you westerners support them ...you are supporting real terrorists.

 

and just like bro iftikharalam said...that if the MQM organised a rally outside of karachi lol lol lol lol lol lol lol lol lol :sl: :sl:

Edited by SJ54

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We know that the rally was political, just show of power in city, he can arrange a rally with this big number over a death of a dog in the city, using his racist politics. We know that these were not general Pakistani public, these are supporters of MQM, and mostly only muhajir people.

 

And this crap media, lol...

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We know that the rally was political, just show of power in city, he can arrange a rally with this big number over a death of a dog in the city, using his racist politics. We know that these were not general Pakistani public, these are supporters of MQM, and mostly only muhajir people.

 

And this crap media, lol...

 

 

Well then, looks like there's no hope then, is there?

 

And when you guys talk about how the MQM doesn't show the will of the poeople because they are all... mujahir, was it?... you sound just like the anti-taliban muslims who say the only Taliban reporters are gun-crazy pashtons.

 

 

But I guess Pakistan is hopeless. Kind of expected that.

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Salaam,

 

Saltwater, to be fair, on the basis of this thread I asked a Pakistani (from Karachi) friend of mine about MQM. He kind of giggled in the same way the English do when asked about 'Cornish Separatism' (Cornwall being a county in SW England). I doubt there are Saskatchewan separatists but it would be similar (though not on geographical scale:)). He said that they were racist separatists outside of power and that now they're racist, non-separatists sharing power.

 

 

I think your holding out of hope on this particular issue is doomed to failure.

 

 

 

 

Peace and Love,

 

DARLA

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Salaam,

 

Saltwater, to be fair, on the basis of this thread I asked a Pakistani (from Karachi) friend of mine about MQM. He kind of giggled in the same way the English do when asked about 'Cornish Separatism' (Cornwall being a county in SW England). I doubt there are Saskatchewan separatists but it would be similar (though not on geographical scale:)). He said that they were racist separatists outside of power and that now they're racist, non-separatists sharing power.

I think your holding out of hope on this particular issue is doomed to failure.

Peace and Love,

 

DARLA

 

 

No Skatchies, but we do have the Bloc Quebecois...

 

Ah well, thought I saw a glimmer of hope on the horizon. Turns out we have a fanatical racist secular bloc against a fanatical racist religious one. Pass me another whiskey, Darling, I think I need to drown some hope.

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But I guess Pakistan is hopeless. Kind of expected that.

 

you sound like you think you are the best people on earth. why do you say pakistan is hopeless.......Islam is returning to pakistan :sl: . inshAllah

 

did you know that soon Rome will fall to the muslims inshAllah

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you sound like you think you are the best people on earth. why do you say pakistan is hopeless.......Islam is returning to pakistan :sl: . inshAllah

 

did you know that soon Rome will fall to the muslims inshAllah

 

And if you know your history, you'll remember that the fall of Rome plunge the world into a couple hundred years of the Dark Ages. It's weird, I always use the fall of Rome as an example as to why the Western World has to seriously watch out for Musim Extremism... and you use it as a rallying cry of sorts... creepy.

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And if you know your history, you'll remember that the fall of Rome plunge the world into a couple hundred years of the Dark Ages. It's weird, I always use the fall of Rome as an example as to why the Western World has to seriously watch out for Musim Extremism... and you use it as a rallying cry of sorts... creepy.

 

lol lol lol u mean you were in the dark ages.....not the muslim world we were living prosperously...it was u ...lol dont say the whole world......

 

and i was referring to a hadeeth.....where the companions of the prophet(saw) asked him which city will fall first to the muslims, rome or constantinople. he said: constantinople(istanbul)

 

:sl:

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Salaam,

 

I got the impression that BQ, like the Scottish Nat. Party or Plaid Cymru (Welsh) were positively sensible compared to this group. I thought I'd choose a fairly remote province of Canada for the comparison...:sl:

 

SJ54 has got a point, whilst we decided to go back and live in caves the Arabs had decided that trying medicine that say, didn't kill the patient more than the disease, might be a pretty good invention. And alcohol (by which I believe it's meant distillation).

 

Hey, look on the bright side, their invention means 1700 years later you can drown your sorrows.

 

Peace, Love and Aspirin for the morning,

 

DARLA

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Salaam,

 

I got the impression that BQ, like the Scottish Nat. Party or Plaid Cymru (Welsh) were positively sensible compared to this group. I thought I'd choose a fairly remote province of Canada for the comparison...:sl:

 

SJ54 has got a point, whilst we decided to go back and live in caves the Arabs had decided that trying medicine that say, didn't kill the patient more than the disease, might be a pretty good invention. And alcohol (by which I believe it's meant distillation).

 

Hey, look on the bright side, their invention means 1700 years later you can drown your sorrows.

 

Peace, Love and Aspirin for the morning,

 

DARLA

 

Salaam

 

Darla, do you have any idea of what the muslims achieved in science, medicine, technology, etc....

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Salaam,

 

Yes, you see I studied history and I read about things that interest me, hence my presence for the last year on an Islamic forum :sl:

 

If you read it again, you'll note that my post gave the Arabs credit for inventing medicine which actually worked as well as alcohol. Not quite sure where the sarcastic suggestion that I was completely ignorant on this point came from!

 

 

Peace and Love,

 

DARLA

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Salaam,

 

Yes, you see I studied history and I read about things that interest me, hence my presence for the last year on an Islamic forum :sl:

 

If you read it again, you'll note that my post gave the Arabs credit for inventing medicine which actually worked as well as alcohol. Not quite sure where the sarcastic suggestion that I was completely ignorant on this point came from!

Peace and Love,

 

DARLA

 

sorry it wasnt meant to be sacrcastic......just wanted to ask if you or non-muslims in general knew that muslims made amazing progress....which sadly most people dont know about....

 

Salaam

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:sl:

 

 

It isn't much of an Islamic thing it's more about MQM and some dirty politics, to understand it you have to know Pakistan and it's politics. If today a referendum is held regarding shariah then you'd see how many people say no. :sl:

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:sl:

It isn't much of an Islamic thing it's more about MQM and some dirty politics, to understand it you have to know Pakistan and it's politics. If today a referendum is held regarding shariah then you'd see how many people say no. :j:

Assalamualikum

 

oh well, lets just sit back and watch the simpsons... :sl:

 

its the sad truth

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Well then, looks like there's no hope then, is there?

 

And when you guys talk about how the MQM doesn't show the will of the poeople because they are all... mujahir, was it?... you sound just like the anti-taliban muslims who say the only Taliban reporters are gun-crazy pashtons.

But I guess Pakistan is hopeless. Kind of expected that.

 

Actually sir, your country is hopeless. and well, what your hopes have to do with something happening in Pakistan? go and count the number of rapes occuring in your country, it will drown your hopes further down, lol.

 

For us hope is Islamic system, And will be established insha Allah soon.

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Actually sir, your country is hopeless. and well, what your hopes have to do with something happening in Pakistan? go and count the number of rapes occuring in your country, it will drown your hopes further down, lol.

 

For us hope is Islamic system, And will be established insha Allah soon.

How many rapes occur in Islamic countries? The ones you hear about are probably only the tip of the iceberg - if I was a woman who had just been raped I wouldn't then like to be accused of adultery and tried as such.

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don't post crap that has no basis again..

 

Give me a single case in Pakistani history pointing towards your statement.

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don't post crap that has no basis again..

 

Give me a single case in Pakistani history pointing towards your statement.

 

 

KABIRWALA, Pakistan -- Pursuing justice is not easy for a woman in Pakistan, not if the crime is rape. Ghazala Shaheen knows.

Two years ago, relatives say, an uncle eloped with a woman from a higher social caste. The revenge by the woman’s family was the rape of Ms. Shaheen, she and relatives charge, after a gang of men raided her father’s home and abducted her and her mother in late August.

It is not uncommon in Pakistan for women to suffer callous vendettas for the wrongdoings of their male relatives. That was the case for Ms. Shaheen, a 24-year-old from a relatively poor family who had nonetheless managed to earn a master’s degree in education. She says she wants to be a teacher.

Under what are known as the Hudood laws in Pakistan, a woman must produce four witnesses to prove rape. A failure to do so can result in her becoming a victim twice over, and being charged for adultery. The stigma alone is enough to keep many women from trying to bring their attackers to justice.

[...]

Ms. Shaheen recounted her ordeal at an uncle’s home in Kabirwala, a dusty farming town in the southern part of Punjab Province. It was not far from where she says more than a dozen men on Aug. 25 forced their way into the house owned by her father, who is a retired military police officer.

Some of the attackers were wearing police uniforms, Ms. Shaheen said. "‘Pick up the women,’ they shouted," she said. "They dragged me and my mother and put us on two motorbikes."

[...]

Ms. Shaheen said that evening at the police station that she had been threatened and harassed to keep silent about the ordeal by her attackers. A police official, too, told her not to mention rape, she said, and the police logged the case only as a kidnapping. "I was frightened. They threatened they would kill my father," Ms. Shaheen said, referring to the Miralis, who are a relatively well-connected family in the area.

[...]

Since then, Ms. Shaheen’s ambitions have been shattered, and it is she who suffers scorn for the rape. She says she feels helpless. The school where she was to teach has refused to accept her.

"They said they can’t accept me as it is a matter of their repute now," Ms. Shaheen said.

 

(you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetnytimes(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/j"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetnytimes(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/j[/url]

 

( Mods, I realize that just posting "nytimes(contact admin if its a beneficial link)" is kind of general for the link, but since you need a subscription to see the actual page, I didn't know what else to post)

 

 

"go and count the number of rapes occuring in your country, it will drown your hopes further down, lol"

 

Are you actually laughing about Rape? Man...

 

 

 

 

The fall of Rome and Arab advances were not connected, so the analogy doesn't fit. Rome was burned by hordes of uneducated savages, not by the scientists of the Arab lands... Today, rome (US) looks to fall to the uneducated savages of muslim terrorist societies... not the scientists of the world.

 

And my biggest peeve about Islam is related to that golden age of invention and medicine. Arab society was the worlds leader in science, art, medicine, etc.... and now look at it. Why the hell did you guys stop? What went wrong?

 

And don't blame israel or America, the fall occurred long before they came to power.

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