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~ Girl Stoned To Death For Converting To Islam ~

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i ask you again where in the quran or sunnah do Allah or the prophet condone killing people for having differing beliefs

yes they are innocent if they were not the ones who killed the girl. period. if we could kill all people who did not believe than why did the prophet not. by your logic those 23 men deserved to die for not being muslim, so why don't we all just strap ourselves with guns and go on on a killing spree the majority of the worlds population is not muslim.

bro your ignorant i'm not saying your stupid but you just aren't knowledgable in the deen so do not speak of what you do not know

Allah says: “Let there be no compulsion in religion. Truth has been made clear from error. Whoever rejects false worship and believes in Allah has grasped the most trustworthy handhold that never breaks. And Allah hears and knows all things.” [sûrah al-Baqarah: 256

if you do not believe in Allah you will answer for it on the last day

peace

Edited by lateefah

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Please, brothers and sisters, be careful of what you say, i.e. think before you post.

 

And please, be kind to one another or this thread will be closed.

 

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I am going to refrain from replying to you, I don't think anyone would want to see what I have to say to you.

 

 

Mehmet

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why are you stalling? i asked for a hadith or an ayah in the quran that justifies killing innocent people for having differing beliefs. i could honestly care less about what you have to say to me, this is no about me or you this is deen.

i'll be waiting

peace

Edited by lateefah

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Ok. I'm going to try and be as nice a possible to you. But don't push your luck, please.

 

Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued. [9:29]

 

 

Mehmet

Edited by Righteous

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Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued. [9:29]Mehmet

What is your understanding of the above verse, Bro?

 

Wassalam,

Yasnov

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do you know the context in which that ayah was revealed or did you just cut and paste?

this ayah was revealed during the time when muslims were in constant warfare back in arabia. but let's just say we take the ayah at face value, i still don't see how it furthers your argument, where does it say we can just randomly kill people for not being muslim? this ayah is about warfare, not just grabbing random people of the streets and killing them for having diffrent beliefs. you condoned the actions of those people who killed 23 yezidi men for a crime they did not commit and you justified it by saying they were not muslims and so they deserved it.

again where in the quran does it justify killing people going about their daily lives for not being muslim?

peace

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I understand from this verse that if you are not in Islam, then you can never be truely innocent. That was the point I was making. If you disagree with me brother please let me know.

 

 

Mehmet

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Narrated Jubair bin Haiya: 'Umar sent the Muslims to the great countries to fight the pagans. When Al-Hurmuzan embraced Islam, 'Umar said to him. "I would like to consult you regarding these countries which I intend to invade." Al-Hurmuzan said, "Yes, the example of these countries and their inhabitants who are the enemies. of the Muslims, is like a bird with a head, two wings and two legs; If one of its wings got broken, it would get up over its two legs, with one wing and the head; and if the other wing got broken, it would get up with two legs and a head, but if its head got destroyed, then the two legs, two wings and the head would become useless. The head stands for Khosrau, and one wing stands for Caesar and the other wing stands for Faris. So, order the Muslims to go towards Khosrau." So, 'Umar sent us (to Khosrau) appointing An-Numan bin Muqrin as our commander. When we reached the land of the enemy, the representative of Khosrau came out with forty-thousand warriors, and an interpreter got up saying, "Let one of you talk to me!" Al-Mughira replied, "Ask whatever you wish." The other asked, "Who are you?" Al-Mughira replied, "We are some people from the Arabs; we led a hard, miserable, disastrous life: we used to suck the hides and the date stones from hunger; we used to wear clothes made up of fur of camels and hair of goats, and to worship trees and stones. While we were in this state, the Lord of the Heavens and the Earths, Elevated is His Remembrance and Majestic is His Highness, sent to us from among ourselves a Prophet whose father and mother are known to us. Our Prophet, the Messenger of our Lord, has ordered us to fight you till you worship Allah Alone or give Jizya (i.e. tribute); and our Prophet has informed us that our Lord says:-- "Whoever amongst us is killed (i.e. martyred), shall go to Paradise to lead such a luxurious life as he has never seen, and whoever amongst us remain alive, shall become your master." (Al-Mughira, then blamed An-Numan for delaying the attack and) An-Nu' man said to Al-Mughira, "If you had participated in a similar battle, in the company of Allah's Apostle he would not have blamed you for waiting, nor would he have disgraced you. But I accompanied Allah's Apostle in many battles and it was his custom that if he did not fight early by daytime, he would wait till the wind had started blowing and the time for the prayer was due (i.e. after midday)."

 

 

Mehmet

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On the permissibality of who can be killed and who not:

(you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetlivingislam(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/maa/dcmm_e.html"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetlivingislam(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/maa/dcmm_e.html[/url]

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Let me ask you something.. if there religion does not allow people to come to the TRUE religion (Islam) Then why should we not be fighting them? You saw what they did to that girl. Answer me this.

 

 

Mehmet

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to my knowledge the 23 yezidi men killed were snatched of a bus or something like that and were killed as revenge for the girl. the actions of those who did this were not Islamic nor are they permissable.

as to the hadith posted i'll let a more knowlegeable member answer.

peace

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Please answer my question.

 

 

Mehmet

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Regarding the hadith that brother Righteous posted, here is the position of Ahl Sunnah wal Jamah:

 

As for the meaning of "people" [al-nâs] in the above well-related Hadith, it is confirmed by Ijmâ' that it refers to the same "mushrikîn" as in the Verse of Sura al-Tawba above, and therefore what is meant there is only the Jâhilî Arabs [muskhrikû l-'arab] during the closing days of the Final Messenger and the early years of the Righteous Caliphs and not even to any other non-Muslims.

 

From: (you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetlivingislam(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/maa/dcmm_e.html"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetlivingislam(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/maa/dcmm_e.html[/url]

Edited by Younes Ibn Abd' al-Aziz

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i did not know your question was directed towards me

but in answer to your question what those men did was not fighting it was disgusting and cowardly. i don't see anything worthy of saying Alahu akbar in their actions, there was nothing honourable in what they did

and if she had become muslim than i think muslims should have done a better in protecting her.

peace

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I understand from this verse that if you are not in Islam, then you can never be truely innocent.Mehmet

What is that supposed to mean? Are Muslim always innocent? Are they still innocent when they steal from non-Muslims or wronged them?

 

Let me ask you something.. if there religion does not allow people to come to the TRUE religion (Islam) Then why should we not be fighting them? You saw what they did to that girl. Answer me this.

Fighting back .. are you referring to this?

 

On April 23, gunmen stopped a bus carrying workers to her community, the village of Beshika 10 kilometres (six miles) outside Mosul, dragged out 23 Yazidis and shot them dead.

 

Wassalam,

Yasnov

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No, you have not answered my question. I will ask again.

 

If muslims are supposed to fight against OPRESSION and INJUSTICE, if these group of people KILL people who convert to Islam - What can be worse than that?

 

Allah tells us to fight against the enemy untill they feel subdued, untill Islam is above any other religion. And we don't, that is why we are in the situation we are in today.

 

Yet you call these people "innocents".

 

Mehmet

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To be honest brother Yasnov I don't know if that is what it is refering to [i'm assuming it is]

 

There's several things we have to consider in this scenario. But it is not as clear cut as people are making it out to be.

 

Calling these people "innocent" is far from the truth.

 

 

Mehmet

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If muslims are supposed to fight against OPRESSION and INJUSTICE, if these group of people KILL people who convert to Islam - What can be worse than that?

You surely know the difference between Yezidi mobs and Yezidi society, Bro?

 

Wassalam,

Yasnov

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Calling these people "innocent" is far from the truth.
What they did to the girl was wrong, but killing 23 men to avenge her death, what does that accomplish?

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To be honest brother Yasnov I don't know if that is what it is refering to [i'm assuming it is]

Referring to Mujahada's post #93 that you support, how sure are you that the twenty-nine Yezidis that were murdered were the same people that have stoned the girl?

 

Wassalam,

Yasnov

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Brother Yasnov. If a religion is causing opression, disallowing people to come to the Religion of Truth.. surely this is wrong? On top of that it seems they associate partners with Allah.. If we wanted to wage war against these people, would we be justified to be doing so on these grounds?

 

 

Mehmet

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yes i have answered your question, yes we should fight oppression and injustice and no what those people did was not fighting.

they were innocent people going about their daily lives when the were killed for a crime they did not commit, their only crime was being yezidi. where is that a punishable crime in Islam?

peace

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Brother Yasnov. If a religion is causing opression, disallowing people to come to the Religion of Truth.. surely this is wrong?

Please provide proof that it is Yezidi religion that has caused oppression, instead of mob mentality that want to keep the purity of their society/faith. Please provides proof that Yehidi religion ordered the killings of followers that convert to Islam.

 

On top of that it seems they associate partners with Allah.. If we wanted to wage war against these people, would we be justified to be doing so on these grounds?

No, it's not justified.

 

Wassalam,

Yasnov

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I would like to add something I have just come across...

 

On April 22, 2007, 23 Yazidis were shot and killed by gunman near the town of Bashika. The gunmen stopped the bus they were riding in and separated out Christian passengers. The remaining 23 Yazidis were driven to eastern Mosul where they were shot execution style. [7] This was apparently a reaction to video images of Yazidi from Bashika stoning to death a young woman, Du’a Khalil Aswad,[8] who had married a Muslim two weeks before.[9][10]. The murder was videotaped by the cellphones of onlookers and can be seen here [11].

 

Guess they can't be as "murderous" as your making out they are.

 

 

Mehmet

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