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umar abdullah

[fatwa]making Pork Pie For Christian Grandma

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as-salmu alikum.

 

dear brother/sister in Islam, i am in a bind. my grandmother asked me to help her make meat pie for christmas. i agreed. i asked after if there was pork in the pie and there was. so i asked her that i do not touch the pork at all.

 

so i rolled the pie dough for her while she did all the stuff with the pork (she is christian). i did not eat the pork, not did i even touch it, and after everything was all said and done, i disinfected the entire kitchen with javex, as well as anything i and her touched, wherever i walked, washed my clothes and did ghusel.

 

but i am still not sure if this was haram to even do help her make pie with pork in it, and i fear that i may have done somthing very, very bad. my niyat was to just help her because she is my elder. i reverted to Islam 3 months ago and i am confused to weather if even helping her is haram.

 

peace and blessing, salam.

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:sl:

Dear brother

It is permissible to make the meat pie for your Christian grandmother, even if it has pork in it. You are allowed to handle the pork and cook it for her, as long as you do not eat from it, and you are sure no other Muslim will eat from it, and since you live in a non-Muslim country. This is according to a similar fatwa that was published here:

(you are not allowed to post links yet)"http://[##][/##]"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetgawaher(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/show.php/showtopic/255905.html[##][/##]""]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetgawaher(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/show.php/showtopic/255905.html[/url]

 

edit:

My apologies, I was wrong. Please review the fatwa mentioned at post #6

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:sl:

The above post was based on a fatwa that we have received from scholars of 'Dar Al Fatwa of Egypt' in response to a similar question.

Members may discuss this issue by replying below. This post is a separator between the fatwa that we have officially received, and members' views and comments.

 

Readers are advised not to take the following posts as fatwa/ruling. They only represent the views of their posters.

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:sl:

Dear brother

It is permissible to make the meat pie for your Christian grandmother, even if it has pork in it. You are allowed to handle the pork and cook it for her, as long as you do not eat from it, and you are sure no other Muslim will eat from it, and since you live in a non-Muslim country. This is according to a similar fatwa that was published here:

(you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetgawaher(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/show.php/showtopic/255905.html"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetgawaher(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/show.php/showtopic/255905.html[/url]

 

Wa Alaikum Assalam,

 

I completely disagree with this post but do not necessarily disagree with the Fatwa.

The fatwa is more then likely referring to serving non-halal food from a pizza shop not owned by a Muslim. If the shop was owned by a Muslim then it would be impermissible to serve it.

 

This might be helpful to explain my position:

(you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_qa.sunnipath(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/issue_view.asp?id=750"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_qa.sunnipath(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/issue_view.asp?id=750[/url]

(you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_qa.sunnipath(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/issue_view.asp?id=2835"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_qa.sunnipath(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/issue_view.asp?id=2835[/url]

 

Important to note: “Anything Haram to use by oneself is Haram to give to another.” (See: Ibn Nujaym, al-Ashbah; Majalla)

 

Secondly, in my school of Fiqh I believe it is sinful to carry articles of major filth without a valid reason. (I may be wrong about this?)

 

Thirdly, also in my school of Fiqh, you will need to purify your kitchen and utensils again as disinfecting them with javex wont suffice.

You need to wash once with earth (cloudy water, preferably the first wash) and then another six times with water that is pure and purifying (can not be the same water six times).

 

May Allah accept your good intention and elevate your rank André

Edited by Aussie

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salam.

 

ok, so who is right?

 

as for sanitization i will wash again, and again.

 

brothers you have no idea i appricate your answers but i would really like an answer from a scholer, with all due respect.

 

salam

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Neither fatwa listed (e.g. the one by dot, and the ones from Sunnipath) suggest that making a pork pie would be permissible.

 

brothers you have no idea i appricate your answers but i would really like an answer from a scholer, with all due respect.

 

With respect Andre, if you want an answer from a scholar you will have to ask one rather then ask on a forum. I personally dont believe in taking rulings via websites or forum posts but if you must here is one I googled earlier:

 

Question:

 

I have recently become Muslim, but my family does not know yet. I plan to tell them when the time is right.

 

My question regards a traditional dish that contains pork. I know I cannot eat this dish with pork, but I am expected to make this dish, but I do not know if it is allowed in Islam. I suggested beef instead of pork, but that did not go over so well. Perhaps you can tell me what I can do?

 

In The Name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.

 

Answer:

All praise and thanks are due to Allah, and peace and blessings be upon His Messenger.

 

First of all, we would like to welcome you among your Muslim brothers and sisters. You are welcome to the fold of Islam where everyone enjoys the Divine light given to humanity. Welcome to the Path of Righteousness. Welcome to purity and chastity. Welcome to nobleness. Welcome to virtue and morality. May Allah guide you to the best of deeds and shower His mercy on you both in this world and in the Hereafter.

 

In his response to the question, Dr. Muzammil Siddiqi, President of the Fiqh Council of North America, states the following:

 

I am pleased to know that you accepted Islam and you are trying to live by its teachings. May Allah bless you and make it easy for you.

 

Whatever is haram for a Muslim to eat is also haram for him/her to serve to others. You should not cook this dish with pork. Try to make it with beef or chicken, etc.

 

If your family do not like it, they will not ask you next time to make it. If you feel that you should not reveal your Muslim identity to them at this time, you can tell them that you do not like pork any more. It is not good for any human being to consume pork, which is harmful to all people, Muslims and non-Muslims alike. May Allah help you.

 

Link: (you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetislamonline(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/servlet/Satellite?pagename=IslamOnline-English-Ask_Scholar/FatwaE/FatwaE&cid=1119503546268"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetislamonline(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/servlet/Satelli...d=1119503546268[/url]

 

I will leave my personal opinion out.

Edited by Aussie

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salam.

 

thnak you much brother, may Allah reward you.

 

 

now i have to fix things.

 

salam.

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Jazzakallah for the dua.

 

Just to add regarding the washing, what I wrote applies to my Madhab and is probably the safest option. There are other scholarly opinions so you may be able to take a dispensation. Ghusl is not necessary but doesn't hurt.

 

You didnt cook the pork so whether or not you legally sinned only an Scholar could tell you and only Allah can judge but regardless as you recently reverted you are probably safe anyway.

Edited by Aussie

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assalamu alaikum

 

there are some rulings concerning preparing pork or providing pork products for non-Muslims who live in Muslim lands as dhimmis.

 

May Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala forgive you for all you shortcomings and protect you from the punishment of the grave and the punishment of hellfire.

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Dear Aussie,

 

Though I agree with your opinion on the difference of the opinion for the pork pizza pie and that it doesn't apply in this one, I do have a disagreement with you regarding THIS statement:

 

"With respect Andre, if you want an answer from a scholar you will have to ask one rather then ask on a forum."

 

Though you are correct that taking fatwas from a forum random posting is a bad idea, this SPECIFIC forum room is meant to be answered by the Mufti from the Egyptian House of eftaa (read the note at the top of the page). It is a tool put to our disposal that we should be grateful for. That means however that you are the one out of place trying to give general opinions here (though like I said I agree with you) and asking people to look for a mufti somewhere else! :sl:

 

Dot, thank you for your effort and please keep this going with the Egyptian house of eftaa (Dar al-Ifta al-Misriyyah). It is very useful and a much more reliable source than many so-called internet advisors or any of our opinions.

 

God bless you and reward you for every viewer who gets guidance from any of these posts.

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:sl:

Dear brother

It is permissible to make the meat pie for your Christian grandmother, even if it has pork in it. You are allowed to handle the pork and cook it for her, as long as you do not eat from it, and you are sure no other Muslim will eat from it, and since you live in a non-Muslim country. This is according to a similar fatwa that was published here:

(you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetgawaher(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/show.php/showtopic/255905.html"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetgawaher(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/show.php/showtopic/255905.html[/url]

 

This is absolutely ridiculous, dot. If you don't have evidence to back up what you said then delete your post instead of causing confusion.

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Though you are correct that taking fatwas from a forum random posting is a bad idea, this SPECIFIC forum room is meant to be answered by the Mufti from the Egyptian House of eftaa ....

 

Thanks but I still cant see an answer from the Mufti.

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