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Our Muslim Credibility Problem: It's A Conspiracy

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So you're saying that Hamas didn't break any international or Palestinian laws when they took control of Gaza?

 

Please just give me a yes or no answer.

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So you're saying that Hamas didn't break any international or Palestinian laws when they took control of Gaza?

 

Please just give me a yes or no answer.

 

Why don't you read my posts above? I have already answered your questions again and again and I find that you are trying to distract me from discussing the real issues by asking me the same twisted questions again and again. The real issues are the Zionist genocide of the defenseless and innocent Palestinian people, the illegal Zionist occupation of Palestine, the Zionist violation of the International Law etc. Why don't you discuss these issues instead of framing and slandering Hamas? Please don't behave like a typical Zionist who tends to exaggerate the nonsensical Zionist fairy tales to frame Hamas and condone Zionist crime against humanity and downplaying the Zionist crime against humanity.

 

Why don't you discuss the Lavon Affair and other Zionist covert operations and false flag operations? I am sure Zionists are afraid to discuss the Zionist crime against humanity.

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The real issues are the Zionist genocide of the defenseless and innocent Palestinian people, the illegal Zionist occupation of Palestine, the Zionist violation of the International Law etc.

 

concur!! israeli zionists whine for peace with their hapless palestinian brethren yet they suck them (palestinians) dry of their lands. now the illegal jewish settlers in west bank are fearful of palestinian retaliation as they wanna celebrate purim. they've (zionists) themselves to blame if they were to be massacred in their bed since they've stolen occupied territories lands to build their illegal settlers. :sl:

 

from haaretz

 

Last update - 06:42 09/03/2009

IDF imposes closure on West Bank ahead of Purim

By Haaretz Service

 

The israel Defense Forces imposed a general closure on the West Bank at midnight Sunday ahead of the Jewish holiday of Purim, which begins on Monday evening.

 

The army said it will lift the closure at midnight Wednesday in accordance with security assessments.

 

"The IDF regards the Purim holiday as a highly sensitive period in terms of the security risk," it stated in a communique.

 

In addition to the closure, the IDF was also to boost its deployment in areas it views as "points of friction." The army said it would do this in order to ensure the safety of israeli citizens, while preserving the daily life of the Palestinian population to the best of its ability.

 

Palestinians in need of medical care will be permitted to pass into israel proper in order, the army said.

 

It added that the passage of humanitarian aid as well as medical personnel, NGO members and other officials would be authorized by the District Coordination and Liaison offices.

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Our Muslim Credibility Problem: It’s A Conspiracy

 

there's truth in this article. some if not most muslims have this conspiracy mentality - blaming others instead of admitting and correcting their weaknesses. a classic example - the muslims blame israel, the us, britain, eu etc for the tragedy befallen the palestinians. they dont dare blame the arab world lest they gonna fall from grace with socalled oil rich/depleting arab nations. if one were to study the situation with an open mind, one gonna realise arab nations are to blame for the palestinians misery. muslims more so arab nations must face the HARDfact that they have to be united. only with unity n undivided backing for palestinians, can they counter israeli terrorism n get a part of palestine to remain palestine. they cant wait for lone ranger obama to twist israel's arms.

 

as we can see the muslims tragic weakness is their disunity. oic, arab league are quite impotent - o i see that's all they're able to say. :sl:

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Why don't you read my posts above? I have already answered your questions again and again and I find that you are trying to distract me from discussing the real issues by asking me the same twisted questions again and again. The real issues are the Zionist genocide of the defenseless and innocent Palestinian people, the illegal Zionist occupation of Palestine, the Zionist violation of the International Law etc. Why don't you discuss these issues instead of framing and slandering Hamas? Please don't behave like a typical Zionist who tends to exaggerate the nonsensical Zionist fairy tales to frame Hamas and condone Zionist crime against humanity and downplaying the Zionist crime against humanity.

 

Why don't you discuss the Lavon Affair and other Zionist covert operations and false flag operations? I am sure Zionists are afraid to discuss the Zionist crime against humanity.

 

You won't tell me whether Hamas came to power over Gaza legally or illegally.

 

Illegal = broke the law to come to power

Legal = didn't break the law to come to power

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You won't tell me whether Hamas came to power over Gaza legally or illegally.

 

Illegal = broke the law to come to power

Legal = didn't break the law to come to power

 

I have answered your question in my posts above.

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there's truth in this article. some if not most muslims have this conspiracy mentality - blaming others instead of admitting and correcting their weaknesses. a classic example - the muslims blame israel, the us, britain, eu etc for the tragedy befallen the palestinians. they dont dare blame the arab world lest they gonna fall from grace with socalled oil rich/depleting arab nations. if one were to study the situation with an open mind, one gonna realise arab nations are to blame for the palestinians misery. muslims more so arab nations must face the HARDfact that they have to be united. only with unity n undivided backing for palestinians, can they counter israeli terrorism n get a part of palestine to remain palestine. they cant wait for lone ranger obama to twist israel's arms.

 

as we can see the muslims tragic weakness is their disunity. oic, arab league are quite impotent - o i see that's all they're able to say. :sl:

 

The truth is the Western nations are the imperialists throughout history by carrying out the policy of extending a nation's authority by territorial acquisition or by the establishment of economic and political hegemony over Muslim nations. And we know that influential Zionists such Winston Churchill control many of the Western regimes and the israeli regime of terror invent fairy tales as a pretext to wage war against Muslim nations, carry out covert operations to frame Muslim nations and they attack, invade and occupy Muslim nations and plunder the natural resources and riches of Muslim countries and terrorize, enslave and massacre innocent and defenseless Muslims.

 

Balfour Declaration of 1917 is a Zionist-Western conspiracy to establish the illegal israel by attacking, invading and occupying Palestine, terrorizing and massacring and robbing Palestinian people of their land, freedom, basic human right, homes, villages, towns etc and we know that the Christians and Zionists were the ones who had planned and carried out Balfour Declaration of 1917.

 

The Balfour Declaration of 1917 (dated 2 November 1917) was a classified formal statement of policy by the British government stating that "His Majesty's government view with favour the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people" with the understanding that "nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country."[1]

 

The declaration was made in a letter from Foreign Secretary Arthur James Balfour to Baron Rothschild (Walter Rothschild, 2nd Baron Rothschild), a leader of the British Jewish community, for transmission to the Zionist Federation of Great Britain and Ireland, a Zionist organization. The letter reflected the position of the British Cabinet, as agreed upon in a meeting on 31 October 1917. It further stated that the declaration is a sign of "sympathy with Jewish Zionist aspirations."

 

The statement was issued through the efforts of Chaim Weizmann and Nahum Sokolow, the principal Zionist leaders based in London but, as they had asked for the reconstitution of Palestine as “the” Jewish national home, the Declaration fell short of Zionist expectations.[2]

 

The "Balfour Declaration" was later incorporated into the Sèvres peace treaty with Turkey and the Mandate for Palestine. The original document is kept at the British Library.

 

Balfour explained:

 

"The contradiction between the letters of the Covenant [of the League of Nations] and the policy of the Allies is even more flagrant in the case of the ‘independent nation’ of Palestine than in that of the ‘independent nation‘ of Syria. For in Palestine we do not propose to even go through the form of consulting the wishes of the present inhabitants of the country though the American Commission is going through the form of asking what they are.

 

The Four Great Powers [britain, France, Italy and the United States] are committed to Zionism. And Zionism, be it right or wrong, good or bad, is rooted in age-long traditions, in present needs, and future hopes, of far profounder import than the desires and prejudices of the 700,000 Arabs who now inhabit that ancient land. In my opinion that is right.

 

 

The anniversary of the Declaration, 2 November, is widely commemorated in israel and among Jews in the Jewish diaspora as Balfour Day.

 

Source: (you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_en.wikipedia(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/wiki/Balfour_Declaration_of_1917"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_en.wikipedia(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/wiki/Balfour_Declaration_of_1917[/url]

The Lavon Affair is just one of the countless Zionist covert operations and false flag operations to frame, slander and blame innocent Muslims and pit Muslim countries against the US regime and its allies.

 

I also blame the traitorous Muslim politicians who become the US-Zionist puppets by serving the interest of the US regime, the israeli regime of terror and their allies and denying the right of Muslims to have a good Muslim government. They and their Zionist masters are responsible for ( I quote your words) the muslims tragic weakness.

 

Therefore, we can see the roles of Christians and Zionists as the imperialists in Muslim nations.

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I have answered your question in my posts above.

 

I'm sorry ######, I forget what I asked and I forget what I said.

 

Please answer my question about Hamas coming to power.

 

Did they come to power illegally, or legally?

 

Illegal = broke the law to come to power

Legal = didn't break the law to come to power

 

Thank you.

 

-Sky

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I'm sorry ######, I forget what I asked and I forget what I said.

 

Please answer my question about Hamas coming to power.

 

Did they come to power illegally, or legally?

Thank you.

 

-Sky

 

I have already answered your questions in my posts above.

 

You can refer the word 'illegally' to the barbaric Zionists who would be pleased to tell you that Zionists have been attacking, invading and occupying Palestine etc illegally by using illegal means, violating the basic human right and the International Law etc, and torturing, raping, murdering, massacring and robbing the innocent and defenseless Palestinian people of their land, homes, farms, villages, towns, freedom, basic human right etc since 1948 so that the barbaric Zionist can establish the illegal israel.

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Please answer my question about Hamas coming to power.

 

Did they come to power illegally, or legally?

 

i believe palestinians in gaza elected hamas to lead them. washington post also believes so. dont think the news is a lie. consequently superpower usa, israel n eu being sourgrape punished gazans via economic blockade, withholding financial n economic support etc n lately plundering n murdering in gaza. btw what's your source which says hamas won illegally? :sl:

 

from washintonpost

 

Hamas Sweeps Palestinian Elections, Complicating Peace Efforts in Mideast

By Scott Wilson

Washington Post Foreign Service

Friday, January 27, 2006; Page A01

 

RAMALLAH, West Bank, Jan. 26 -- The radical Islamic movement Hamas won a large majority in the new Palestinian parliament, according to official election results announced Thursday, trouncing the governing Fatah party in a contest that could dramatically reshape the Palestinians' relations with israel and the rest of the world.

 

In Wednesday's voting, Hamas claimed 76 of the 132 parliamentary seats, giving the party at war with israel the right to form the next cabinet under the Palestinian Authority's president, Mahmoud Abbas, the leader of Fatah.

 

Fatah, which has dominated the legislature since the previous elections a decade ago and the Palestinian cause for far longer, won 43 seats. A collection of nationalist, leftist and independent parties claimed the rest.

 

Prime Minister Ahmed Qureia, another Fatah leader, resigned his post along with his cabinet early Thursday, as reports of Hamas's victory began to circulate. Although the cabinet would have been required to step aside even if Fatah had retained its majority, Qureia acknowledged in submitting his resignation that Hamas had earned the right to form the next cabinet.

 

"This is the choice of the people," Qureia, a member of the party's discredited old guard who did not run for reelection, told reporters here. "It should be respected."

 

Abbas, on the other hand, will continue to serve the four-year presidential term he won in an election a year ago, shortly after the death of his predecessor, Yasser Arafat, the founder of Fatah. Abbas will maintain the broad power to create national policy and control the security services, though he needs parliamentary approval for his budget and legislative proposals. He will also shape peace policy with israel as head of the Palestine Liberation Organization, which does not include Hamas.

 

The arrival of Hamas, formally known as the Islamic Resistance Movement, in the Palestinian Authority as a nearly equal partner will severely complicate Abbas's efforts to begin negotiations with israel under the U.S.-backed peace plan known as the "road map." Hamas, which emerged in 1987 during the first Palestinian uprising as an offshoot of Egypt's Muslim Brotherhood, favors the creation of a Palestinian nation on land that now includes israel rather than the road map's two-state solution.

 

The election results stunned U.S. and israeli officials, who have repeatedly stated that they would not work with a Palestinian Authority that included Hamas, which both countries and the European Union have designated as a terrorist organization. In Washington, Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice said that a party could not "have one foot in politics and the other in terror. Our position on Hamas has therefore not changed."

 

Javier Solana, the European Union's foreign policy chief, said in a statement that the Palestinian people had "voted democratically and peacefully." But, he added, "these results may confront us with an entirely new situation which will need to be analyzed" at a meeting of European foreign ministers next week.

 

Jubilant Hamas leaders reiterated Thursday that they had no plans to pursue peace talks or disarm the party's armed wing, a condition israel has set for beginning negotiations under the road map. The plan, which calls for the creation of an independent Palestinian state by the end of 2005, has been frozen during recent years of violence.

 

Here in Ramallah, a Fatah stronghold where Hamas won every parliamentary seat except the one reserved for a Christian, dozens of activists from both parties clashed in front of the Palestinian Legislative Council, as the parliament is formally known.

Edited by tom

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The Balfour Declaration of 1917 (dated 2 November 1917) was a classified formal statement of policy by the British government stating that "His Majesty's government view with favour the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people" with the understanding that "nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country."[1]

 

indeed un, the us, eu more so israel failed to comply with the conditions as documented under balfour declaration. it's clearly stated palestinians be they arabs (muslims n christians), jews etc being the natives of palestine should'nt be abused n terrorized following un partition (of palestine). foreign jews upon getting their share of palestine turned nazi like against palestinians as recorded by bbc.

 

history tells us britain has asked arabs to help it topple ottoman empire, promising them nationlism as indicated by McMahon agreement. but britain lied, it failed to keep its promises to the arabs as recorded by bbc.

 

by right n as you've said it - britain, the us, un should consider the plight of palestinians before forcing them to share their lands with foreign jews. now israel has stolen almost 80% of palestinian lands via illegal jewish settlements, illegal outposts, illegal apartheid security walls zigzag deep inside occupied territories, illegal idf posts, illegal demolitions of palestinians homes n orchards etc. :sl:

 

from bbc

 

Sunday, 17 November, 2002, 17:19 GMT

The birth of israel

The former BBC Middle East correspondent, Tim Llewellyn, looks back at the history of israel.

 

On November 29, 1947, the UN General Assembly voted to partition Palestine into Jewish and Arab sectors.

 

There was violent and total Arab opposition, but wild Jewish acclaim. Fighting started almost immediately.

 

Even before the mandate ended, in April and May, Jewish fighters moved to protect, consolidate and widen the territory for the new Jewish state. Often they attacked areas designated for Arabs, and tried to depopulate Arab areas in the planned Jewish sector.

 

On April 9, Jewish fighters massacred scores of Palestinian villagers, including old people, women and children, in the West Jerusalem village of Deir Yassin, causing widespread panic and greatly augmenting the flight of Palestinians from their homes across the country.

 

As the Jewish authorities had predicted, Arab armies from Egypt, Jordan, Syria, Iraq and Lebanon tried to invade Palestine as soon as the British forces actually left. But the Arab campaign was a generally badly organised, uncoordinated affair with untrained units who were no match for the Haganah and, later, the israeli Defence Force.

 

The Palestinian militias and other Arab irregulars were also easily crushed.

 

from bbc

 

Shifting sands

 

At the time of World War I the area was ruled by the Turkish Ottoman empire. Turkish control ended when Arab forces backed by Britain drove out the Ottomans.

 

Britain occupied the region at the end of the war in 1918 and was assigned as the mandatory power by the League of Nations on 25 April 1920.

 

During this period of change, three key pledges were made.

 

In 1916 the British Commissioner in Egypt, Sir Henry McMahon, had promised the Arab leadership post-war independence for former Ottoman Arab provinces.

 

However, at the same time, the secret Sykes-Picot Agreement between war victors, Britain and France, divided the region under their joint control.

 

Then in 1917, the British Foreign Minister Arthur Balfour committed Britain to work towards "the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people", in a letter to leading Zionist Lord Rothschild. It became known as the Balfour Declaration.

 

The Lavon Affair is just one of the countless Zionist covert operations and false flag operations to frame, slander and blame innocent Muslims and pit Muslim countries against the US regime and its allies.

 

i'm not familiar with this, i'll look it up. :sl:

 

I also blame the traitorous Muslim politicians who become the US-Zionist puppets by serving the interest of the US regime, the israeli regime of terror and their allies and denying the right of Muslims to have a good Muslim government. They and their Zionist masters are responsible for ( I quote your words) the muslims tragic weakness.

 

exactly. but thank the good lord, arab nations is beginning to see daylight as noted by bbc. :no:

 

from bbc

 

Tuesday, 10 March 2009

Saudis and Syrians cement detente

 

Saudi Arabia says King Abdullah is to hold talks with the Syrian leader in Riyadh on Wednesday.

 

The king and President Bashar al-Assad will discuss "ways to bolster bilateral ties", the Saudi press agency said.

 

He will also meet Egypt's President Hosni Mubarak, the agency said, without drawing a link between the visits.

 

Syrian-Saudi relations have come under strain in recent years, caused by sharp differences over Iran, Lebanon and the israeli-Palestinian conflict.

 

israel's 22-day military offensive against Gaza, which ended on 18 January and killed more than 1,300 Palestinians, exacerbated the schism.

 

Syria and Qatar firmly backing the militant group Hamas, while Saudi Arabia and Egypt sided with Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas of the rival Fatah group, who blamed Hamas for provoking the israeli bombardment.

 

Signs of improved relations began last week, when Saudi Foreign Minister Saud al-Faisal visited Damascus and issued an invitation for Mr Assad to visit after talks with Syria's Walid al-Muallim at an Arab foreign ministers' meeting in Egypt.

 

Correspondents say the Saudis are mending ties to restore a semblance of Arab harmony before a summit later this month due to be held in Doha.

Edited by tom

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The thing is "Hamas coming to power in Gaza": illegal. israel exploting occupied terroritories: illegal.

 

I feel like Wisguy hides behind the idea that "the law" makes sense and Hamas MUST have come to power legally, becuase that is the only way he can justify their existence.

 

Hamas is good for being honest, non-corrupt and treating most people equally. israel is... wrong for so many reasons...

 

But they are both governments, both acting illegally.

 

Until ###### admits that both Hamas and israel break international laws I won't be happy.

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My problem:

 

###### believes one side is entirely just, right, pious: the side that claims Hamas and other "terrorist" groups are always justified.

 

While the other side the United States, israel and other struggling governments, are wrong and evil.

 

The fact is, everyone is wrong a little, everyone is right a little. We need to focus on the part of the world that is right and promote it. That means not making excuses for Hamas and not making excuses for the United States and israel.

 

If we don't see any of this... If we don't understand... If we don't act. We are just as good as the people who keep this conflict going.

 

Peace.

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The thing is "Hamas coming to power in Gaza": illegal. israel exploting occupied terroritories: illegal.

 

i'm not taking sides. i'm with the palestinians all the way. why? simple. un divided palestine without consulting the palestinians. why? coz un's under the us's thumb. who's the us? israel's strongest ally n provider of billions worth of arms for israel to murder n plunder in occupied territories n consequently accomplice to israeli terrorism against palestinians.

 

I feel like Wisguy hides behind the idea that "the law" makes sense and Hamas MUST have come to power legally, becuase that is the only way he can justify their existence.

 

from your postings in this thread, i sense you wanna show you're cool, you wanna show you've empathy for both israel n palestinians. but i smell a rat in this post.

 

if you follow israeli palestinian conflict closely, you gonna find hamas is born in 1987 (?) while israel has been terrorizing palestinians since day one it took a part of palestine in 1948 (un partition of palestine). like the us, you seem to think palestinians being the weak n natives (like 'red indians' of america) must suffer in silence n remain impotent n live in reservations (like the 'red indians') following israeli onslaught against them. is that fair?

 

what do you expect palestinians/hamas do when israel terrorize them? you wanna them play coy like fatah while israel willy nilly expand its illegal settlements in west bank n east jerusalem?

 

Hamas is good for being honest, non-corrupt and treating most people equally. israel is... wrong for so many reasons...

 

hamas has its weaknesses n nobody wanna condone that. but simple commonsense should tell you when israel has billions worth of arms to plunder n murder in occupied palestinians, you cant expect hamas to play coy like fatah. right? it will come up with sucide bombers, firing rockets etc. it wouldnt be able to build illegal palestinians settlements, illegal hamas posts, illegal apartheid socalled security walls etc in israel proper. right?

 

But they are both governments, both acting illegally.

 

that's right. again simple commonsense should tell you the occupier/conqueror should be sympathic to the occupied/losers otherwise you gonna see israel plays nazi against palestinians.

 

Until ###### admits that both Hamas and israel break international laws I won't be happy.

 

i'm not happy hamas n israel break interntional laws. but simple commonsense should tell ME N YOU N THE US N EU N israel hamas couldnt wait like fatah for israel to come up with its own kind of 2 state peace solution to gain security n peace.

 

btw what do you think of washingtonpost's news item? :sl:

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###### believes one side is entirely just, right, pious: the side that claims Hamas and other "terrorist" groups are always justified.

 

for hamas supporters, hamas's suicide bombers, firing rockets etc into israel is fighting for freedom, justice, self identity for palestinias. for israel supporters like the us, israel's illegal settlements, illegal outposts, illegal idf posts, illegal apartheid socalled security walls zigzag deep inside occupied territories, illegal demolition of palestinian homes n orchards etc is fighting for security, peace n a viable 2 state solution.

 

what you n i should worry about is not about what posters posted here, it should be why israel n the us think israel's illegal activities in occupied territories could lead to everlasting security for israel n peace in the region n viable 2 state solution. what you n i should be concerned is how to tell israel its call for peace is mere hypocrisy. sure hamas' charter is to eliminate israel. but simple commonsense should tell u n i n the us/israel, this charter even hamas gonna become obsolete if a viable 2 state solution becomes a reality.

 

While the other side the United States, israel and other struggling governments, are wrong and evil.

 

nope, israel is not a struggling governemnt. the us despite its financial crisis, is adamant to continue donating billions worth of arms to israel to keep it afloat n continue plundering n murdering in occupied territories. dont think israel wanna keep its billions worth of arms under it bed for safekeeping. right? as such the us n israel terrorism against palestinians is wrong n evil. the birth of hamas (in 1980s) is the result of this terrorism.

 

The fact is, everyone is wrong a little, everyone is right a little. We need to focus on the part of the world that is right and promote it. That means not making excuses for Hamas and not making excuses for the United States and israel.

 

what is right that israel promotes towards palestinians that gonna lead to viable 2 state peace solution?

 

If we don't see any of this... If we don't understand... If we don't act. We are just as good as the people who keep this conflict going.

 

dont think the us is instilling peace in mideast when it donated billions worth of arms to israel, illegally invading iraq for bush's lie that saddam has wmd, invading afghanistan in bush's manhunt for socalled 911 mastermind osama bin laden. right?

 

what do you think israel n hamas n fatah should do to have a viable 2 state peace solution? :sl:

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salam.

 

the subject of hamas is a complecated one.

 

while hamas did come into power "leagaly"(accoding to democracy anyways) they are doing things which are against Islam.

 

as muslims, we cannot kill inoocent people. and yes, even though all isrealies are in the millitrty, they are not a combatnet untill the pick up the gun. also indescriminetly firing rockets into isreal is haram.

 

as muslims we are supposed to be a class above everyone else. now if isreal bombs muslims with f-16's, and hamas retaliates with rocket fire, what seperates us from them? nothing. as muslims, we HAVE to look at this through the Qur'an.

 

now this dosent mean they are terrorists though. they do alot of humanitarian aid to the people of gaza and west bank. they do their best to protect them against an enemy that is a milklion times stronger then them and against an enemy who has genocide as a human policy.

 

you also have to understand why hamas is firing these rockets. they dont got any other options.

 

 

now i am expecting muslims to start posting ayat's about "terrorizing the enemy" and things like that. well that is what non-muslims do to ACCUSE US OF BEING TERRORISTS you cannot expect non-muslims to think we are peacefull people when you contradict the holy qur'an and its teachings.

 

like what i say to the non muslims, look at the ayat before and after the ayat that you are using as evidence, and you will se it has nothing to do with terrorizim.

 

all in all i support hamas with my toung, with my wealth, and with my life if they stop firing rockets into residential areas and farmland. that land is ours, and the people are being oppressed in it. they have the right, not only by human standards, but by Allah to defend themself.

 

to the non-muslims in this thread, i want to explain one thing about muslims to you.

 

this ummah is like a spring. you can push the spring together untill there is no room left between the coil. but that spring is always resisting the push, even in this state. eventually you loose strength, and the spring starts to expand out, untill there is no more push.

 

whats my point? my point is that for every muslim that is marteyrd, another 3 say shahadah.

 

and that all currupt governments fall. that means that one day the Islamic states will be back. now if you guys dont pull out of afghanistan, iraq,dont stop supplying our enimies and things of that nature, in a few generations jihad ayn will be declared.

 

now i dont know about you, but to a muslim jihad ayn is just another struggle ontop of all the other stuff we gotta do. i hope that my children have the honour to fix this ummah, even it it means jihad ayn.

 

im going to go out on a limb and say that you dont want your kids, or grandkids to fight in a war like that.

 

 

 

in all reality, we just want to live our way of life. Islam gives us a way of life. we dont want to intergrate into your society. we will interact i.e. be friends and all that, but we have our way of life, and you have yours. we dont want to change you guys through jihad. really, the sunnah ay is to give dah'wa, or to preach the message. if somone dosent want to hear it, we move on. simple enough.

 

incase you dont know, jihad ayn is global jihad. 1.3 billion muslims strong will instantly jihad, and we are not going to catch a flight to iraq or isreal and jihad there. we will jihad right here in the west, or in the u.k., or in austrailia.

 

and it will be really unfortanate if it comes to that, casue this ummah has enough problems as it is. it is hard to fix this ummah when you guys keep trying to change us to be worse people, or keep forcing us to fight jihad. we are people just like you. we just want to live by our standards, by the way Allah gave us. leave us be, and we will leave you be.

 

but i doubt non-muslims care.

 

salam.

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The United States was established illegally, so was Mexico, Canada and almost half the countries across this sad world. But that's how it is. Injustice or not. The best thing we can do is organize around the world we live in and make things better for everyone else.

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incase you dont know, jihad ayn is global jihad. 1.3 billion muslims strong will instantly jihad, and we are not going to catch a flight to iraq or isreal and jihad there. we will jihad right here in the west, or in the u.k., or in austrailia.

 

If all the Muslims in Australia or the US start a war, it will take about a week before there are no more Muslims in Australia or the US. It might take a bit longer in the UK, I agree.

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If all the Muslims in Australia or the US start a war, it will take about a week before there are no more Muslims in Australia or the US. It might take a bit longer in the UK, I agree.

 

if all muslims throughout the world start a war, it's gonna take a minute for mother earth to go boom with a nuclear bomb. comes doomsday, some of us gonna go to hell, some heaven while others (who believe in reincarnation) gonna turn into dogs, donkeys, ducks etc :sl:

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The United States was established illegally, so was Mexico, Canada and almost half the countries across this sad world. But that's how it is. Injustice or not. The best thing we can do is organize around the world we live in and make things better for everyone else.

 

how do you think we can make things better between israelis and palestinians?

 

since as you've said - almost half the world is governed illegally, then you've no ground to 'whine' over hamas. right?

 

nonetheless it looks like haaretz has made the same conclusion like you. :sl:

 

from haaretz

 

Islamist Hamas, which won a parliamentary election three years ago, controls the Gaza Strip which it seized in a brief, bloody civil war in 2007 from Abbas's Palestinian Authority that holds sway in the West Bank.

 

israel, the United States and Western countries have refused to recognize Hamas's control of Gaza. israel, which has imposed a blockade on the coastal territory, has demanded an end to Hamas rule before it considers easing its restrictions.

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as muslims, we cannot kill inoocent people. and yes, even though all isrealies are in the millitrty, they are not a combatnet untill the pick up the gun. also indescriminetly firing rockets into isreal is haram.

 

judaism followers, christians and muslims uphold the 10 commandments, one of which is - THOU SHALT NOT KILL. but we did kill. we've been at each others throats for centuries for one reason or another mainly for power.

 

like what i say to the non muslims, look at the ayat before and after the ayat that you are using as evidence, and you will se it has nothing to do with terrorizim.

 

what do you mean? dont understand.

 

all in all i support hamas with my toung, with my wealth, and with my life if they stop firing rockets into residential areas and farmland. that land is ours, and the people are being oppressed in it. they have the right, not only by human standards, but by Allah to defend themself.

 

how do you think can palestinians defend themselves?

 

whats my point? my point is that for every muslim that is marteyrd, another 3 say shahadah.

 

dont understand this either. please explain. thank you. :sl:

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if all muslims throughout the world start a war, it's gonna take a minute for mother earth to go boom with a nuclear bomb. comes doomsday, some of us gonna go to hell, some heaven while others (who believe in reincarnation) gonna turn into dogs, donkeys, ducks etc :sl:

 

One or two Pakistani bombs (and without a long-range delivery system) doth not a Doomsday make.

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One or two Pakistani bombs (and without a long-range delivery system) doth not a Doomsday make.

 

you think when pakistan tosses a nuclear bomb, super duper usa gonna bow reverently in awe? :sl:

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No, of course not. But it won't be anything like Doomsday (except for the reisdents of Islamabad). And given Pakistan's limited missile capability, it will be India doing the responding, not the US.

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it dont matter which non muslim country gonna respond. the chain reaction gonna lead to doomsday. :sl:

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