Jump to content
Islamic Forum
Sign in to follow this  
freedslave

Our Muslim Credibility Problem: It's A Conspiracy

Recommended Posts

Our Muslim Credibility Problem: It’s A Conspiracy

 

by Amir Butler

 

Matthew: It’s a conspiracy.

 

Jack Bellicec: What’s a conspiracy?

 

Matthew: Everything.

 

Invasion of the Body Snatchers, 1978

 

 

Muslims have a credibility problem. In the modern era, we have a tendency to believe and repeat wild theories, with our only criteria for accepting those theories being that they lend support to pre-existing attitudes. It takes an extremely sympathetic person to overlook such a deficiency, and sympathy for Muslims in a post 9/11 West is in short supply.

 

This is a deficiency that the clash-of-civilizations crowd has astutely begun to capitalize on. Pro-israel groups like the Middle East Media Research Institute (MEMRI) play a perpetual game of “gotcha,” scouring the Arab press for the most egregious conspiracy-peddling, then forwarding it to a network of like-minded opinion writers as grist for the Islamophobia mill. MEMRI’s job isn’t difficult.

 

It seems so elementary: don’t repeat everything you hear as fact if you don’t have evidence for it. Test theories with investigation, and modify theories in light of results. That’s the scientific method that we all learned in sixth grade.

 

The lack of a grip on this basic principle is yet another proof of the extent of the Muslims’ drift from their Islamic roots. The man who introduced the scientific method to the world was Abu Rayhan ibn Ahmad al-Biruni, an 8th century scholar who, by the age of 17, had calculated his hometown’s latitude from the sun’s altitude. “His bent was strongly towards the study of observable phenomena, in nature and in man,” writes a Western admirer.

 

Observable phenomena seem quite irrelevant in the Muslim world’s public discourse today.

 

When Princess Diana died in September 1997, a number of Arab columnists warned that she was murdered by British intelligence because she was going to marry an Arab Muslim. Other Muslims opined that she had in fact already converted to Islam and that she had died as a shaheed (martyr). Such ideas gained currency in Muslim communities in the West and East, with the basis for such claims being nothing more solid than the journalistic equivalent of reading tea leaves.

 

When the Monica Lewinsky scandal broke, some Arab commentators claimed it was all an elaborate “Jewish plot” to cause Clinton to be impeached and removed from office, in order to prevent him from eventually recognizing a Palestinian state.

 

The Egypt Air 990 crash in November 1999, was painted by some other columnists as having been the result of Mossad sabotage who, by destroying the plane along with its 271 passengers, hoped to destroy the Egyptian tourist industry.

 

Likewise, it was not long after September 11, before Arab columnists were pointing the fingers at the Jews. One such commentator, writing in Jordan’s ad-Dustour, pointed the finger at the “great Jewish Zionist mastermind that controls the world’s economy, media and politics.”

 

Other columnists blamed Bush, claiming he ordered the attacks to solidify his grip on America and unify the country after the Florida vote-counting controversy. Yet others blamed the Japanese who had supposedly carried out September 11 as revenge for the bombings of Nagasaki and Hiroshima. Some claimed that the Pentagon attacks never really happened. One journalist suggested that the World Trade Center was really blown up by a series of kerosene bombs deployed strategically around the building. Yet more suggested the planes may have been taken control over by NORAD and directed into the twin towers. And so on.

 

One of the most widely heard tales in the Muslim world is that 4,000 Jews, forewarned of the impending attacks, decided to all stay home on the morning of September 11. The tale began circulating shortly after the attacks, in the form of a report attributed to Hezbollah’s al-Manar TV and quoting unnamed “Arab diplomatic sources.” Thanks to the Internet, the report quickly circulated throughout the world, and continues to this day to form the underpinning for many Muslim’s belief that Jews were responsible for the attacks on September 11.

 

Of course, all of these theories, while of varying degrees of plausibility, are logically possible; sometimes, they have a grain of truth. Repeating theories without evidence is a sign of intellectual weakness, but it’s equally absurd to assert that any claim of behind-the-scenes influence is paranoid bigotry, or that conspiracies as a rule do not exist. Pro-israel groups mock Muslims for asserting that Jewish influence dominates US foreign policy, while AIPAC brags in its literature that it is the most influential lobby group affecting our nation’s Middle East policy.

 

Nor can one deny that the Reagan administration traded arms for hostages. The FBI tried to break up Martin Luther King’s marriage to derail his civil rights campaign. The US defense establishment developed a plan in the 1960s to kill innocent people and commit acts of terrorism in U.S. cities to create public support for a war against Cuba. But the people who exposed these conspiracies went beyond intuition; they dug up the hard evidence to back it up.

 

No, the problem is not necessarily the theories themselves, but the thought process that generates them or accepts them as true. If they were formed on the basis of evidence and rational analysis, then there would be no problem, however the methodology employed to reach such conclusions is often anything but rational. We are like the Hindus of the 8th century, of whom Al-Biruni wrote: “I can only compare their astronomical and mathematical literature ... to a mixture of pearl shells and sour dates, or of costly crystals and common pebbles. Both kinds of things are equal in their eyes, since they cannot rise themselves to the methods of strictly scientific deduction.”

 

When faced with an incident of massive scale like the Bali bombing or the September 11 attacks, many of us search for groups or individuals that we can charge with having acted secretly or deceptively. That's because the alternative explanation, that Muslims were capable of doing it, is too uncomfortable to accept. For many Muslims, the starting assumption is invariably the Jews. For Muslims of an earlier era, it was the Freemasons. So within hours of the Bali bombings, some Muslims were declaring quite confidently that it was the Jews behind it, or that America attacked Australia in order to solidify Australia's support for the war. Such an approach is fundamentally flawed, because it leads to conclusions being made in isolation of evidence and proper analysis of that evidence.

 

This type of thinking promises to offer a final, definitive interpretation of events, but never does because it seeks to reach such an end through complete disregard for evidence or concrete laws. Just as the X-Files tells us, the truth is always out there, but is never completely known and can never be proved conclusively.

 

The conspirators are almost always seen as being monolithic, unified in purpose, unshaken in their determination to fulfill their nefarious objectives and almost omnipresent. For example, recall the Jordanian journalist who warned against the "great Jewish Zionist mastermind that controls the world's economy, media and politics". The conspiracy theorist oversimplifies and personalizes every event, ignoring the complexities of the situation. Do Jews control the media, or do they influence it? There is a subtle difference. The conspiracy theorist will affirm the former, whereas the latter is demonstrably true. Jews, like other social and political forces, exert pressure on the media through advertising expenditure, participation in the media industry, and so forth.

 

Anything that occurs which seems in any way related to the aims of the conspirators is attributed to them. For instance, Bali, quite unrelated to Middle Eastern politics on the face of it, was linked to israel because it was argued that israel benefited from the attack because it discredited Muslims and therefore strengthened israeli arguments at the Palestinians.

 

Evidence or arguments that are actually contrary to the conspiracy theorists position get contorted to actually support the conspiracy. For example, one points out that the 4,000 Jews story is not credible because no reputable media source outside of the Hezbollah substantiated it. The conspiracy theorist may reply that the failure of the media to report the story confirms that it was indeed true. Jews, he will opine, own the media and so naturally they would cover up for their own.

 

As such, it is almost impossible to reason with a person who has adopted these thought processes. As Donna Kossy writing in Kooks: A Guide to the Outer Limits of Human Belief noted:

 

Conspiracy theories are like black holes--they suck in everything that comes their way, regardless of content or origin...Everything you've ever known or experienced, no matter how 'meaningless', once it contacts the conspiratorial universe, is enveloped by and cloaked in sinister significance. Once inside, the vortex gains in size and strength, sucking in everything you touch.

 

The attractiveness of such theories is that they simplify complex issues and make them more comprehensible and palatable to our desires. We can easily rationalize our present problems, by blaming them on an almost omnipotent and omnipresent 'other' that has manipulated the world around us, leaving us powerless to change or stop it. In doing so, it assuages our sense of helplessness by personifying the source of our problems down to a set of identifiable individuals; whether it be the Jews, freemasons, Bilderberg Group or the Illuminati. Being able to blame someone is an integral part of maintaining the faux-victimhood that many Muslims today thrive on.

 

However, such approaches do severe damage to the cause of Islam and the Muslims.

 

Firstly, the propagation, however earnest, of such ideas has led to Muslims now facing a crisis of credibility. The association of Muslims with extremist groups and discredited material like the Protocols of the Elders of Zion or The International Jew provides our enemies with easy fodder to attack us.

 

Secondly, the adoption of these theories leads us to enter into alliances, whether overt or tacit, with organizations and individuals that we should be opposed to. For example, in the aftermath of September 11, the Arab News was running articles by American neo-nazi, David Duke, and other Muslims were signing petitions for the right-wing Lyndon Larouche cult.

 

Thirdly, when we promote such baseless theories, we should know that such ideas are competing with reality for the attention and energies of the people. In many cases, the conspiracy will win over reality because conspiracies are often a lot more attractive to our desires than the truth. It leads to wasted time, wasted resources and a loss of focus for Muslims.

 

Fourthly, as Muslims we follow a religion whose Creator ordered us to rationalize our faith by observing the world around us and witnessing the miracle of God's creation. Ours is not a religion where reason and reality are pummeled into submission by blind faith. It therefore goes against everything we believe for our intellect to acquiesce to conspiracy theorizing and urban myths.

 

Lastly and most importantly, conspiracy theories have led Muslims to ignore the most fundamental cause of our problems, whilst focusing on the machinations of the Freemasons or the Zionists. Subscribing to many of the contemporary conspiracy theories can breed feelings of helplessness and despondency. We sit, drinking coffee, lamenting, in hushed tones, our powerlessness against a Masonic conspiracy hatched by the Knights Templar in Medieval Europe; a plan now being executed through backmasked Michael Jackson songs and Madonna videos. In doing so, we are distracting ourselves from our own failings as Muslims which have more genuinely contributed to our condition.

 

Source: (you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetas-sahwah(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/viewarticle.php?articleID"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetas-sahwah(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/viewarticle.php?articleID[/url]

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
PropellerAds

:sl:

 

Brother Freedslave I am totally shocked that you too would think that Satanism praticed by our leaders are all conspiracies.

 

How about you have a look at that thread and read the Quranic Ayaat I have included as well.

 

Its a shame how you know nothing on this subject and quick to say that its all a conspiracy without doing much research.

 

Actually I will post it all here - let me copy and paste

 

Surah Baqarah

 

102. They followed what the Shayatin (devils) gave out (falsely of the magic) in the lifetime of Sulaiman (Solomon). Sulaiman did not disbelieve, but the Shayatin (devils) disbelieved, teaching men magic and such things that came down at Babylon to the two angels, Harut and Marut, but neither of these two (angels) taught anyone (such things) till they had said, "We are only for trial, so disbelieve not (by learning this magic from us)." And from these (angels) people learn that by which they cause separation between man and his wife, but they could not thus harm anyone except by Allah's Leave. And they learn that which harms them and profits them not. And indeed they knew that the buyers of it (magic) would have no share in the Hereafter. And how bad indeed was that for which they sold their ownselves, if they but knew.

 

Have you not seen those who were forbidden to hold secret counsels, and afterwards returned to that which they had been forbidden, and conspired together for sin and wrong doing and disobedience to the Messenger (Muhammad ). And when they come to you, they greet you with a greeting wherewith Allah greets you not, and say within themselves: "Why should Allah punish us not for what we say?" Hell will be sufficient for them, they will burn therein, and worst indeed is that destination!

 

Surat Mujaddilah

 

9. O you who believe! When you hold secret counsel, do it not for sin and wrong-doing, and disobedience towards the Messenger (Muhammad ) but do it for Al-Birr (righteousness) and Taqwa (virtues and piety); and fear Allah unto Whom you shall be gathered.

 

10. Secret counsels (conspiracies) are only from Shaitan (Satan), in order that he may cause grief to the believers. But he cannot harm them in the least, except as Allah permits, and in Allah let the believers put their trust .

 

14. Have you (O Muhammad ) not seen those (hypocrites) who take for friends a people upon whom is the Wrath of Allah (i.e. Jews)? They are neither of you (Muslims) nor of them (Jews), and they swear to a lie while they know.

 

15. Allah has prepared for them a severe torment. Evil indeed is that which they used to do.

 

16. They have made their oaths a screen (for their evil actions). Thus they hinder (men) from the Path of Allah, so they shall have a humiliating torment.

 

17. Their children and their wealth will avail them nothing against Allah. They will be (the) dwellers of the Fire, to dwell therein forever.

 

18. On the Day when Allah will resurrect them all together (for their account), then they will swear to Him as they swear to you (O Muslims). And they think that they have something (to stand upon). Verily, they are liars!

 

19. Shaitan (Satan) has overtaken them. So he has made them forget the remembrance of Allah. They are the party of Shaitan (Satan). Verily, it is the party of Shaitan (Satan) that will be the losers!

 

Surah Al Harsh

 

14. They fight not against you even together, except in fortified townships, or from behind walls. Their enmity among themselves is very great. You would think they were united, but their hearts are divided, that is because they are a people who understand not.

 

15. They are like their immediate predecessors (the Jews of Bani Qainuqa', who suffered), they tasted the evil result of their conduct, and (in the Hereafter, there is) for them a painful torment;-

 

16. (Their allies deceived them) like Shaitan (Satan), when he says to man: "Disbelieve in Allah." But when (man) disbelieves in Allah, Shaitan (Satan) says: "I am free of you, I fear Allah, the Lord of the 'Alamin (mankind, jinns and all that exists)!"

 

Maybe you can explain what these verses mean, big scholar.

 

:sl:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

:sl:

 

I felt like he imposed this thread because of my thread..

 

Sister, my thread was not meant to impose on yours. While I do admit that the recent controversial and conspiracy theories put forth on Gawaher are found in threads started by you, and the timing of my thread seems convenient, I had wanted to post an article addressing conspiracy theories for some period of time.

 

I guess I could say, your thread gives me the oppurtunity to start what I had intended to post for some time. I certainly don't mean to impose on your views. And what the article above addresses is not about the worshipping of Satan by leaders alone, but about all conspiracies. The article above seeks to question all such theories.

 

To reply to what you've said, I'm not a scholar. You can find the interpretations of the meanings of the Quranic ayahs you have quoted in tafseer, which can be readily found online or in books.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
:sl:

Sister, my thread was not meant to impose on yours. While I do admit that the recent controversial and conspiracy theories put forth on Gawaher are found in threads started by you, and the timing of my thread seems convenient, I had wanted to post an article addressing conspiracy theories for some period of time.

 

I guess I could say, your thread gives me the oppurtunity to start what I had intended to post for some time. I certainly don't mean to impose on your views. And what the article above addresses is not about the worshipping of Satan by leaders alone, but about all conspiracies. The article above seeks to question all such theories.

 

To reply to what you've said, I'm not a scholar. You can find the interpretations of the meanings of the Quranic ayahs you have quoted in tafseer, which can be readily found online or in books.

 

But you see I am not making up conspiracies, thats the problem...unfortunately you won't see that and you are ready to degrade my posts without any proofs to prove that I am wrong in what I say.

 

I have just showed you some simple Quranic verses all relating to this topic yet you still say its conspiracy, no problem thats up to you brother. But I know what I am talking about whereas you don't and you haven't even made an attempt to try an understand what you call these 'conspiracies'.

 

:sl:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
:sl:

Sister, my thread was not meant to impose on yours. While I do admit that the recent controversial and conspiracy theories put forth on Gawaher are found in threads started by you, and the timing of my thread seems convenient, I had wanted to post an article addressing conspiracy theories for some period of time.

 

To reply to what you've said, I'm not a scholar.

 

Exactly so if you are not a scholar then don't claim that the things that I have been saying are all conspiracies without a proper research into it. Furthermore if you are so Islamic why don't you try and read the Quran in english or your preferred language and see for yourself the points that I have made. These points don't just come up one or two places in the Quran, it comes up numerous times, alright.

 

So based on your judgement, then you also believe that the minor signs of the last day are all conspiracies too right? And if you don't then obviously you are contradicting yourself.

 

This is age of Fitnah and Fasaad. Age of corruption. The re occurence of the same events in history proves that its not just by accident rather they have been pre planned long before. Is it no wonder that thes same zionists that have just made a recent attack on mumbai and then lying the blame on the muslims? Why would they do that and then blame it on some Pakistani lad? Are you being fooled by their justice for ther actions? Do you realize Pakistan also have nuclear weapons just like Iran? Do you realize that this is a threat towards America and israel? Is it no wonder that they would find a way to accuse Pakistan of terrorism in order to make the general public view Pakistan as a country posing a threat to all humanity just like they have done for Iran, Iraq, Afghanistan in history?

 

Do you not understand that all these strange events going on have everything to do with the Holy Land or more simply Jerusalem. Is it that hard for you to figure it out that Dajjal's mission is to have total control over the world from the State of israel or more precise from the Holy Land - Jerusalem. Do you still not get it? Do you not see that we are closing onto the end of times.

 

So why stop me from preaching the truth and making everyone aware of the difficult times coming up ahead. Why not let me make our muslim brothers and sisters understand and in this way If Allah willls change their heart towards him and become stronger muslims for the events coming up ahead. Don't you realize that what is happening in Palestine is only the beginning?

 

“And after that We said unto the people of israel: "You will dwell

(henceforth) on Earth (i.e. scattered all over the earth) - but (remember

that) when the final Divine prophecy (pertaining to the arrival of the Last

Hour) is to come to pass, We will bring you back (to this Holy Land)

(scattered as you will be) from all parts (of the Earth)!â€

(Qur’ān, al-Isrā, 17:104)

 

“And lo! Thy Lord-God made it known that He would most certainly

raise against them (i.e. the israelite people), up to the Day of Qiyāmah,

those who would afflict them with the worst possible punishment: verily,

your Lord-God is swift in punishment - yet verily He is (also) muchforgiving,

a dispenser of grace.â€

 

“And beware of tests, trials, temptations to evil which would not target

only those among you who commit acts of injustice and wickedness, to

the exclusion of others; and know that Allah is severe in punishment.â€

 

“And let not Satan bar you (from recognizing the truth of this matter) -

for, verily, he (the pronoun clearly refers to Satan) is your open enemy!

(Qur’ān, al-Zukhruf, 43:62)

 

The return of the israelite Jews (distinct from European Khazar

Jews who have no descent from Abraham) to the Holy Land to

reclaim it as their own. Two thousand years ago they were

expelled from that Land and were banned by divine decree from

ever returning to reclaim it as their own (until the advent of the

Last Age and the release of Gog and Magog). In the process of

reclaiming and repossessing the Holy Land however, they have

been trapped into inflicting the most heinous and barbarous

oppression upon the innocent non-Jewish Palestinian people

resident in that land;

 

Sheikh Imran Hosein.

 

Wake up!!! You are still sleeping brother!!!

 

:sl:

Edited by world_footy_Gunner_laDy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Exactly so if you are not a scholar then don't claim that the things that I have been saying are all conspiracies without a proper research into it.

 

And you have done research on what? Leaders being worshippers of Satan? Have you done any research on the subject? Have you written a thesis on it? I would be glad to read something of this nature, but so far all you have provided does not fall under category of research.

 

What you have posted are videos, which are based solely on conjecture.

 

What you have attempted to do is to link the text of Quranic ayahs, (that of which most of what you have quoted actually talking about the type of people living in the Prophet’s time, who were against him), and trying to link that to the leaders and the people of today without any basis other than loaded words.

 

What you have attempted to do is draw some relation between all of this and the current political events today, mixing truth and conjecture.

 

Are there people who work against any rising of power of Muslims today? Yes. Are there forces at work today aiming to subjugate Muslims and make our beautiful religion look bad? Yes. Are there people who bear hatred against Islam today, and who share certain characteristics to the Jews of Madina and the Quraysh, as described in the Quran? Yes. Does the Quran mention people who practise black forms of magic and the seeking of help from Satan? Most definitely, I’m not denying this.

 

But, IMHO, the people against Islam are politicians, members of organizations, and sometimes just normal citizens of countries. I don’t see them as one uniting force. While there is a motive against Islam, I believe there is no a central threat. That may change in the future, and probably so, but at present no. There are many threats, some big, some small. I don’t see obscure and fringe groups such as Illuminati, Knight-Templars, FreeMasons or Satan-worshippers (whether they’re participants are world leaders or ordinary people) to be big threats.

 

Murderous actions by Zionist ideology and its blind support it receives, US military occupation in Iraq and Afghanistan, and their military presence in the Middle East and Central Asia, a cultural and political attack on Islam, as well as constant infighting between our peoples; these are the main threats against Islam.

 

Can we at least spell out our problems in black and white, instead of going down long and winding roads of conspiracy that leads to nowhere?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
And you have done research on what? Leaders being worshippers of Satan? Have you done any research on the subject? Have you written a thesis on it? I would be glad to read something of this nature, but so far all you have provided does not fall under category of research.

 

Are there people who work against any rising of power of Muslims today? Yes. Are there forces at work today aiming to subjugate Muslims and make our beautiful religion look bad? Yes. Are there people who bear hatred against Islam today, and who share certain characteristics to the Jews of Madina and the Quraysh, as described in the Quran? Yes. Does the Quran mention people who practise black forms of magic and the seeking of help from Satan? Most definitely, I’m not denying this.

 

But, IMHO, the people against Islam are politicians, members of organizations, and sometimes just normal citizens of countries. I don’t see them as one uniting force. While there is a motive against Islam, I believe there is no a central threat. That may change in the future, and probably so, but at present no. There are many threats, some big, some small. I don’t see obscure and fringe groups such as Illuminati, Knight-Templars, FreeMasons or Satan-worshippers (whether they’re participants are world leaders or ordinary people) to be big threats.

 

Murderous actions by Zionist ideology and its blind support it receives, US military occupation in Iraq and Afghanistan, and their military presence in the Middle East and Central Asia, a cultural and political attack on Islam, as well as constant infighting between our peoples; these are the main threats against Islam.

 

Can we at least spell out our problems in black and white, instead of going down long and winding roads of conspiracy that leads to nowhere?

 

Yes I have done my research on it, and its not me who has written a thesis on it, its scholars.

 

I will leave the topic of satan worshippers as you obviously don't undesrtand that part.

 

Okay lets do so, lets spell our problems in black and white.

 

Alhamdoulillah you understand that each problem or strange event happening are all main threats against Islam. Now have you ever wondered why this is so?

 

You seem to have understood that there are US military occupation in Middle East and Central Asia, but why don't you understand that this leads to a bigger story? Why is that hard? Don't you see that there is something big about to happen?

 

Most of all, why is this land concerning Jerusalem so important and so sacred for the Zionists, that they are ready to commit the biggest human crime in the world just for this land? Doesn't that seem strange to you? Why all of a sudden was there WW2 in history? Do you not understand what all the nazis and killing the Jews were all about? After that where did Jews end up being placed. Am I wrong to say israel?

 

Isn't it mentioned in the Quran about this movement of the Jews. In the Quran do we not see that when Allah talks about the holy land he refers to Jerusalem not Makkah or Madina. Strange? No of course not.

 

Was it a coincidence that the twin towers were blown apart by some planes? And the blame was on us muslims and on Bin Laden mainly who they pretended was hiding in Afghanistan. And then they invaded Afghanistan by such a massive propaganda. This also happened to Iraq within a matter of a few years. Now they are doing the same on Iran and Pakistan. Recently there has just been a terrorist attack on Mumbai, and who did they blame it upon? Paskitani lad, no? Any idea why they did so?

 

Obviously to make the world believe that Pakistan is a threat to them just like they have done so with Iran, no? Where does this all lead to? Why so much confusion, so much darkness?

 

Let me ask you, do you know what the promised land is? If you know this answer then I think I am wasting my time proving something that you already know about yet hasn't clicked in your mind.

 

Do you know that we are about to experience, the collapse of the dollar which in turn will bring down all the paper money with it? Do you realize we about to experience a third world war? Do you understand why?

 

I will let you answer my questions then i shall answer my own questions to yourself so that you may understand.

 

:sl:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

salam sis.

 

youtube and google video are not the best source for information regarding anything.

 

when alex jones hold up a peaice of paper saying "LOOK I GOT EVIDENCE" that peice of paper could be an article from the joke section of the globe and mail.

 

now there is a reson why i am saying this. before i was a muslim i used to be a hardcore hippy. i used to listen to these guys.

 

now i realize they are unfortanatly misled.

 

now as for the dollar collapsing and world war 3; if it is Allah ta'ala's intention to do these things then no amount of conspearacy videos will stop it from happening.

 

sis you have to anderstand that, while these people have some very strong, and very convincing sercumstantial evidence, it is not somthing that you could bring into a court.

 

all these people are really good speakers and are able to tap into your emotions through their speech. Hitler was also able to do this, if you ever hear him speak, he spoke with emotion. he was able to convince the people to do what he wanted no matter what he wanted, just through powerfull speech.

 

the only way you could possibly know exactly what is going on in the world, and understand it, is if you are god, or getting inseration from god. the situation is to complex for even a team of scholers to put together, let alone one person.

 

now, eah there are alot of people who hate muslims and Islam. but alot of people hate christians too. churches get burned too. "christian" land is war-torn too.

 

as for zionizim, im not even going to go there cause thats just a topic that leads to some crazy stuff.

 

if we as muslims, just follow the Qur-an, and the sunnah, we wouldent have to worry about bush or zionists or whatever. we cant blame them for OUR LACK OF EEMAN. if you dont do what the prophet(sallaho alahis wa-salam) or the shahaba did, then you lack the eeman they had. do you run SCARED FOR YOUR LIFE to the masjid when a strong wind blows, becasue it reminds you od the tahmud people? casue if you dont, then you are not following the prophets (sallaho alahis wa salam) sunnah 100%.

 

 

if we make a collective effort on ourself first, Allah will reward us.

 

one last thing i want to mention is that these video's are made by non-muslims. i belive Allah Ta'ala says somthing to the effect of :"do not take them as your protectors."

 

salam sis.

Edited by André

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
salam sis.

 

one last thing i want to mention is that these video's are made by non-muslims. i belive Allah Ta'ala says somthing to the effect of :"do not take them as your protectors."

 

salam sis.

 

Correction, the Arrivals is a documentary series made by a group of muslim brothers.

 

You know what is happening right now is exactly as was told in this hadith that has come to my mind, this is what I rememeber -

 

People will believe a liar and disbelieve one who tells the truth. People will distrust one who is trustworthy and trust one who is treacherous.

 

You know the present time we are in and going through is actually the age of corruption.

 

So Andre you seem to want to join this discussion. Okay why dno't you answer my questions that I have imposed on brother Freedslave. Do you have any idea what this holy land or promised land is all about?

 

Do you realize that the upcoming events and the events we are going through has been already mentioned in the Quran and hadith. So if you really adhere to the Quran and Sunnah why don't you answer my questions based on the Quran and Hadith. Is it because you don't have any clue what I am talking about? Then how about you study a bit more and then come back to me alright. Why don't you study the signs of the end times before you speak. Or if you have studied then answer my questions before telling me what is right and what is wrong.

 

:sl:

Edited by world_footy_Gunner_laDy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
salam sis.

 

now as for the dollar collapsing and world war 3; if it is Allah ta'ala's intention to do these things then no amount of conspearacy videos will stop it from happening.

 

if we as muslims, just follow the Qur-an, and the sunnah, we wouldent have to worry about bush or zionists or whatever. we cant blame them for OUR LACK OF EEMAN. if you dont do what the prophet(sallaho alahis wa-salam) or the shahaba did, then you lack the eeman they had. do you run SCARED FOR YOUR LIFE to the masjid when a strong wind blows, becasue it reminds you od the tahmud people? casue if you dont, then you are not following the prophets (sallaho alahis wa salam) sunnah 100%.

if we make a collective effort on ourself first, Allah will reward us.

 

salam sis.

 

:sl:

 

Brother Andre as yuo are new to Islam, I will suggest that you have a look up on the scholar named Sheikh Imran N Hosein and if yuo have the thirst for knowledge you would definitely be amazed on the delicate subjects that he talks about in his lectures as well as his books.

 

Now on the basis of the dollar collapsing and the world war three, we as muslims need to understand our position during such a critical time and it would be absolutely useless in saying if its Allah Taala's intention then who cares we just sit at home in front of a cube called the television and pretend nothing is happening.

 

 

Here is just a little bit of the dollar collapsing that he has written about just after the invasion or Iraq. The name of the book is Jerusalem in the Quran -

 

It is of great benefit, therefore, that Sheikh Imran Hosein’s scholarship has made it

possible for the message of this age to be witnessed. Muslims and enlightened non-

Muslims can only wonder, over-awed by the veracity of the Qur’an and the ahaadith

in foretelling these events. Thus it is with gratitude that we turn to Sheikh Imran for

his penetrating analysis of these sources and their application to present-day

happenings.

 

Thinkers can no longer be accused of falsely believing conspiracy theories of a

Zionist or Jewish plot for domination of the Middle East and the world. These plans

are acknowledged by US and British journalists and the Conspirators themselves (e.g.

the so-called ‘neo-Cons’) in published documents (e.g. their “Plan for the New

American Centuryâ€). ‘Con’ is an apt term for these ‘plotters’ since they weave their

web with lies and deceit.

 

Sheikh Imran points out in masterful fashion, that israel is just using the US and

may eventually bring about its downfall, most probably by a strike on the international

standing of the US paper dollar, which will shatter confidence in the national currency

reserves of countries, and in international share markets. The international banking

system will then come more and more under control of the International Financiers

and their cohorts.

 

Now then people thought he was mad then at the time and now look we are already experience a massive downfall in the US dollar. I really recommend muslim brothers and sisters to try and read his books or listen to his lectures. Most of the scholars today are sleeping. This man has made such an effort in trying to make us sleeping muslims understand the reality today but alas, there are only a few out there who are even bothered to read what he has to say and search for the truth rather they are ready to criticize him without understanding anything at all whatsoever.

 

(you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetimranhosein(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/media/books/j_in_q.pdf"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetimranhosein(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/media/books/j_in_q.pdf[/url]

 

You might want to try this also - An Islamic View of Gog and Magog in the Modern Age

 

These are the things we should be reading at the present time -

 

(you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_imranhosein(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/media/books/ivgmmw.pdf"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_imranhosein(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/media/books/ivgmmw.pdf[/url]

 

May Allah bless you if you do decide to give them a chance. Ameen.

 

:sl:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Most of all, why is this land concerning Jerusalem so important and so sacred for the Zionists, that they are ready to commit the biggest human crime in the world just for this land? Doesn't that seem strange to you?

 

Surely it needs no conspiracy theory to explain why Jews consider Jerusalem important. Muslims and Christians consider Jerusalem important too - is that suspicious? And the Jews actually founded the city. Is it suspicious that Meccah is "so important and sacred" for Muslims?

 

(I'll pass on the nonsense of "the biggest human crime in the world".)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

salam sis.

 

you totaly misunderstood me. compleatly.

 

first off, i would rather learn my deen frist, and then practice on it, then get to the political aspect afterwards.

 

you assume i sit infront of the T.V. and get brainwashed by it.....i havent watched t.v. in almost half a year, maybe even a lil more then half a year. im to busy either reading up on Islam or on these fourms(lol).

 

but when i did watch the "news" i knew that i was getting fed some grade-A-government crap. actually, everyone knows this, people are not stupid. everyone knows about the document for a new american century and the paitriot act. everyone.

 

as for the hadieth, it is credible indeed. like people who belive that isreals attack on gaza was legit. when muslims think that the taliban are terrorists. muslims belive that unfortanatly. and it hurts that i have to give more da'wah to my brothers then to non-belivers.

 

which is why you put your trust in Allah. casue you dont know if that person is really a hipicrite or not.

 

and ys we all do know, and realize, and see and understand the hadieth and sunnah that mention what is going on right now. we leared these through the prophet(sallaho alahis wa salam) and he learned them from Allah subhannallah wata'ala. no matter what, this is going to happen unfortanatly.

 

now this is not an excuse to do nothing about it. no, this is a warning that if you dont do anything your going to be in a bad spot on the day of judgment.

 

just like the hadieth that states "put your trust in Allah for your sustenence" well ofcourse, the food i eat is due to Allah. but it dose ot magicly fall into my belly, no i go out and seek Allah's bounty throgh work which Allah has bestowed uppon me so that i may spend of that bounty on his sustenance nd then be gratfull for it becasue he can take away or restrict any one of those phases in the chain.

 

now, saying harsh stuff, is not going to earn my repect. i might not be an expert on hadieth or quran, and i only voice a scholers oppinion of an ayat or hadieth, but i do know the basic principle of eeman.

 

for example i can say with 100% certinty that "Do you realize that the upcoming events and the events we are going through has been already mentioned in the Quran and hadith. So if you really adhere to the Quran and Sunnah why don't you answer my questions based on the Quran and Hadith. Is it because you don't have any clue what I am talking about? Then how about you study a bit more and then come back to me alright. Why don't you study the signs of the end times before you speak. Or if you have studied then answer my questions before telling me what is right and what is wrong."

 

is 100% not how a muslims speaks to another person, let alone another muslim.

 

 

worse off you assume i am against you. i am not. you want a united ummah, i want a united ummah. you want the corruption to end, well so do i. you want to fight the enimies of Islam, well now we are definetly on the same page casue so do i.

 

the thing i am pointing out is this:

 

1)be carefull of who you get your information from. alex jones could be right, or could be wrong. i dunno.

 

2)if you really want to change things for the better, start with yourself, and just act Islamicly. im not saying your a bad person, and im not saying your not Islamic in your actions, but we can always be more Islamic and we can always be better.

 

3)gaining knowledge is only one step in many to do what Allah wants us to do. we have to put that knowledge into practical use, and back up everything with practical evidence cause if nobody is going to belive you then whatever you know dosent matter.

 

4)Salah is the best jihad. then it goes down from there. the jihad of fighting with an actual weapon is one of the lowst jihads(from what ive read) and muslims should always strive to achove a peacefull resoloution before resorting to war.

 

 

and last but not least, it is a major sin to throw ayat from the Qur'an into any situaltion. i am not kidding. look up the ayat that you mentioned in your first post, any one of them and look up the tasfeer. if that oppinion dosent match yours, then you are the wrong one becasue they are well versed in the 15 sciences in being able to make an oppinion on any given ayat.

 

nobody on this fourm has that knowledge. nobody can make an oppinion based on an ayat unless it is directly from a scholer. and i only mention this becasue i do not want anyone to be held accountable for this before Allah.

 

ok now for the real last but not least. you want everyone else to take action against these people. well we need a leader, sol lead the way, and i will follow.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
salam sis.

 

you totaly misunderstood me. compleatly.

 

first off, i would rather learn my deen frist, and then practice on it, then get to the political aspect afterwards.

 

you assume i sit infront of the T.V. and get brainwashed by it.....i havent watched t.v. in almost half a year, maybe even a lil more then half a year. im to busy either reading up on Islam or on these fourms(lol).

 

but when i did watch the "news" i knew that i was getting fed some grade-A-government crap. actually, everyone knows this, people are not stupid. everyone knows about the document for a new american century and the paitriot act. everyone.

 

Wow you take things so deep, I never meant that you watch tv the whole day, this is just you interpretating what I have said in your words. So I don't think you really undesrtand my point anyway

 

which is why you put your trust in Allah. casue you dont know if that person is really a hipicrite or not.

 

Why do you take things so deep? You need to stop interprretating everything that I say and stop making it so personal.

 

 

and ys we all do know, and realize, and see and understand the hadieth and sunnah that mention what is going on right now. we leared these through the prophet(sallaho alahis wa salam) and he learned them from Allah subhannallah wata'ala. no matter what, this is going to happen unfortanatly.

 

No you haven't realized because you keep thinking i am coming up with conspiracies everytime.

 

now, saying harsh stuff, is not going to earn my repect. i might not be an expert on hadieth or quran, and i only voice a scholers oppinion of an ayat or hadieth, but i do know the basic principle of eeman.

 

Yeah well it goes the same for you too, you don't accuse someone of lying and coming up with conspiracies when obviously you have no idea what this is all about, and furthermore if you really know the principle of imaan you would question me first for my proof before starting to accuse me of spreading conspiracies around. It becomes tiring and fustrating after a while when people just come straight down to conclusions withiout a further looking up into it and maybe ask directly from myself where I am getting these information from which would show that yuo care about your muslim sister from being misguided. Maybe we need to learn how to communicate even in our very first conversation that we have, which you failed in doing so and that is why I kinda lost it.

 

And I will admit I am not the best of muslims and certainly not as good are you are but I am trying to change myself Alhamdoulilah.

 

worse off you assume i am against you. i am not. you want a united ummah, i want a united ummah. you want the corruption to end, well so do i. you want to fight the enimies of Islam, well now we are definetly on the same page casue so do i.

 

Why shouldn't I assume that you are against me when you don't even ask for my proof from where I get this conspiracies from. Hmm.

 

 

1)be carefull of who you get your information from. alex jones could be right, or could be wrong. i dunno.

 

You see just because I have posted up some youtube videos doesn't mean that that is my only source of information. If you were willing to understand you would have done a bit more effort in your first post in understanding where I am coming from rather than accuse me straight away.

 

I now can see that maybe posting up some youtube videos was a very a big mistake instead I should have come up directly with information from scholars, I didn't really expect everyone to be accusing me of falling into conspiracies rather I thought it would attract a large audience and in this way I could provde them links to better materials and source of information.

 

2)if you really want to change things for the better, start with yourself, and just act Islamicly. im not saying your a bad person, and im not saying your not Islamic in your actions, but we can always be more Islamic and we can always be better.

 

Sure but that also doesn't stop me from being concerned for my muslim brothers and sisters and having an urge to make them aware of the current situation.

 

 

4)Salah is the best jihad. then it goes down from there. the jihad of fighting with an actual weapon is one of the lowst jihads(from what ive read) and muslims should always strive to achove a peacefull resoloution before resorting to war.

and last but not least, it is a major sin to throw ayat from the Qur'an into any situaltion. i am not kidding. look up the ayat that you mentioned in your first post, any one of them and look up the tasfeer. if that oppinion dosent match yours, then you are the wrong one becasue they are well versed in the 15 sciences in being able to make an oppinion on any given ayat.

 

nobody on this fourm has that knowledge. nobody can make an oppinion based on an ayat unless it is directly from a scholer. and i only mention this becasue i do not want anyone to be held accountable for this before Allah.

 

ok now for the real last but not least. you want everyone else to take action against these people. well we need a leader, sol lead the way, and i will follow.

 

You see why are you interpretating me in this way, taking this so far deep. How am I mentioning that we should be getting ready for Jihad? This is a sin also to judge someone without knowing their real intentions. Bring me some evidence from my own words where I am persuading people to get ready for Jihad. This is completely wrong of you to say such lies on behalf of me (i have put it in bold, your lie against me). Where have I claimed to be a leader or trying to be a leader.

 

Now then let me make you understand what I have been trying to say all this time.

 

The reality of the modern age is that Dajjāl the false Messiah or Anti-Christ is now close to the culmination of his mission on

earth of impersonation of the true Mesiah. Jews have already returned to Jerusalem to reclaim it as their own. An impostor State

of israel has already been successfully installed in that Holy Land and it has already grown from strength to strength (protected by

countless US vetoes in the Gog and Magog-controlled UN Security Council) to the extent that it will soon replace USA as the rulingstate

in the world. A “young”, “well-built”, “curly-haired” ruler of israel will soon declare that he is the Messiah.

 

An Islamic View of Gog and Magog in the Modern Age

Imran N Hosein

 

The Jews have been waiting to get back this land for a long time since 2000 years ago when they got kicked out by Allah. They believe that their ‘return’ to the Holy Land is part of God’s favour on them. They call it their 'The Promised Land'. Both in the Quran and in the bible we hear about this land. Why are they so dedicated for this land? Because they know that their Lord (Dajjal/ Antichrist) will come back to this land and will rule the world from the State of israel or more precisely to rule from the the 'holy land' Jerusalem. The Jews or zionist whatever you want to call them already know this and this is why they are so dedicated to exterminate all the people living in this land and would go so far in even doing the worst human crime ever just for this 'sacred' land.

 

Do you think it was an accident when the Nazis decided to exterminate the Jews back in the second world war? Of course not, they knew exactly what they were doing, by causing such a dilema this in turn speeded up the migration of European Jews into israel a lot faster.

 

Dajjal's mission is to impersonate Isa/ Jesus AS which is why he is called the one eye deceiver. His mission is to rule the world from Jerusalem just like Isa AS will rule the world from Jerusalem.

 

Just like the collapse of the sterling pound back in history when Great Britain was once the ruling state of the world and then that moved on to the dollar and then America became the next ruling state of the world and now the dollar is about to collapse and all the paper-money will come down with it which in turn israel will become the ruling state of the world next. Once this has happened Dajjal can finally say his mission of impersonating Isa AS is over and from here we can understand Isa AS will descend on earth and will kill Dajjal. Right now what we are experience is about to be a third world war.

 

Maybe we should check how many countries already have nuclear power. This is not for show, this in fact will be used as military power. We understand that we muslims are facing a big threat from these evil people on earth yet we still fail to understand the bigger picture. Afghanistan has already been invaded, so has Iraq, both countries faced massive propaganda before they were terrorized by these evil oppression. When 911 happened who got the blame and who did they pretend was hiding in some caves in Afghanistan? This allowed them to invade Afghanistan. Then Iraq was next on the list and ended up being terrorized also by these masterminds of evil. Then Lebanon ended up being attacked later on. They have succesfully managed to have their base in most of these Middle East countries. Is this all by accident?

 

Can't you see that in order for them (israel) to gain power over the whole world they would need to have all the oil resources or at least majority of the oil resources in their hands? Once this is completed and achieved through the third world war, we can expect israel as the next state which will rule the world. Do you not see this is all for the purpose of Dajjal's emergence?

 

I have said it very briefly so forgive me if you are still confused. I can only suggest you some links which you will find below at the end of this post.

 

Now that we can finally start to see the whole jigsaw puzzle of why so much oppression just for a peice of land, who in this forum is going around spreading this information may I ask? We are so concerned about our muslim countries facing so much prosecution yet we are still so narrow minded. All we think is that there is no conspiracy giong on and that history just seems to happen by itself and then we say Allah knows best and we end it there without further investigation and in trying our best to understand why so much oppression is going on today.

 

The reason I am here and I wanted to spread this information is so that we can unite together and come to terms of what can be done, I really wanted to see each other's ideas and suggestions on what muslims should really be preparing for. But I can say that I have failed in doing what I intended from the beginning by the use of my own approach to this topic and at the same time I didn't at least get a second chance to bring some light to my confusing threads rather I have been accused right from the beginning by the use of words like 'conspiracies' and 'you can't trust all the information you get'.

 

You want to read what scholars say not what I say, well here it is, suite yourself but don't ignore this and end up being accountable for not having knowledge on these criterias in your future as well as on the Day of Judgement.

 

(you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetimranhosein(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetimranhosein(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/[/url]

 

(you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_imranhosein(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/media/books/ivgmmw.pdf"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_imranhosein(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/media/books/ivgmmw.pdf[/url]

 

(you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetimranhosein(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/media/books/j_in_q.pdf"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetimranhosein(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/media/books/j_in_q.pdf[/url]

 

:sl:

Edited by world_footy_Gunner_laDy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

salam.

 

alright, fine them. i am against you.

 

conspearacy exposed.

 

salam

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
we can expect israel as the next state which will rule the world.

 

That is insane. China is well-placed to be the most powerful nation after the US, Russia is still very powerfull, India will be right up there in a few decades. Then there are the other nuclear powers, and the other enormous econimies, such as the EU, Brazil, Japan and so on. israel has about as much chance of ruling the world as Mexico does.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
salam.

 

alright, fine them. i am against you.

 

conspearacy exposed.

 

salam

 

You are very open minded brother. :sl:

 

I bet you if I was to say that all the paper-money in this world is haraam, you would be quick to attack with the word 'conspiracy', lol.

 

Its amazing to see that we are living at the end of times and we fail to grasp the signs happening all around us proving to us and confirming the hadith from our beloved prophet SAW and Ayaats in the Quran. We say we have read Quran and Hadith yet we do not recgnize that we are so close to such a disaster.

 

Do we realize that we have gone past most or nearly all the minor signs stated in hadiths?

 

:sl:

Edited by world_footy_Gunner_laDy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

:sl:

 

Maybe you consider this a conspiracy too brother Freedslave and brother Andre?

 

Has anyone checked out the current situation or the current level of water in the lake of Tiberias or the Sea of Galilee? Just look up on google, this is just one proof...

 

A dwindling water supply in the Sea of Galilee is pushing israel to increase its use of desalination plants, with plans to expand two facilities and build two more by 2010. The biblical body of water is 16.2 feet below its lower "red line," which marks the point at which it is ecologically inadvisable to draw water, according to the israeli Water Authority.

 

Yet israel continues to draw water from Galilee, to drink and to irrigate crops, said Uri Shor, a Water Authority official.

 

"We have no choice," he said.

 

(you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetwashingtontimes(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/news/2008/nov/12/sea-of-galilee-drying-up/"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetwashingtontimes(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/news/2008/n...ilee-drying-up/[/url]

 

Now lets look at what the hadith says regarding the Sea of Galilee or Lake of Tiberias -

 

“….It will be at this very time that Allah will send Christ, son of Mary. He will descend at the

white minaret on the eastern side of Damascus, wearing two garments lightly dyed with saffron

and placing his hands on the wings of two Angels. When he lowers his head, there will fall

beads of perspiration from his head, and when he raises it up, beads like pearls will scatter from

it. Every non-believer who smells the odor of his body will die and his breath will reach as far

as he is able to see. He will then search for him (Dajjal) until he catches hold of him at the gate

of Ludd and kills him. Then a people whom Allah had protected will come to Jesus, son of

Mary, and he will wipe their faces and inform them of their ranks in Paradise. It will be under

such conditions that Allah will reveal to Jesus these words: I have brought forth from among

My servants such people against whom none will be able to fight; you take these people safely

to Tur, and then Allah will send Gog and Magog and they will swarm down from every slope.

The first of them will pass the lake of Tiberias and drink out of it. And when the last of them

passes, he will say: There was once water here….”

(Sahih Muslim)

 

Of course its just a consiracy I believe that the Sea of Galilee in israel is nearly dried up and this in turn would lead to the emergence of Dajjal and Jesus to return once again. I think I am turning crazy...

 

:sl:

Edited by world_footy_Gunner_laDy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

salaam.

 

yes, we know this stuff. we know the end is comming. you dont need to look at at hadieth to see that, most surahs mention the day of judgement one way or another.

 

what can we do about it? nothing unfortanatly. not in the long term anyways. everything has a decreed time and ours is comming very shortly. this life is but a blink in our existance.

 

in the short term however you cn build a masjid, or become a scholer, propagate Islam, take part in jihad, or just represtent Islam in a good light through your daily actions and deeds.

 

everything you are saying, we generally know. we are not as inferior as you think we are. we do grasp the signs, and we do not reject them either.

 

ill tell you what the whole issue in this thread really is.

 

its not the evidence that is being brought fourth that is the problem, but the way it is being used is. actions speak louder then words. join a da'wah group if you want to make change. or somthing. every muslim should do somthing to try to cure the qorld. after all that is one of the reasons why muslims were created by Allah. abiscly our duties are to 1)worship Allah and 2)fight evil.

 

you know less then 5% of the ummah dosent pray 5 times a day. how can we(note:not you, we i.e the entire ummah) expect any of these things that you mentioned to change if most of the ummah dosent even pray.

 

this knoeledge is only good if you can do somthing positive with it, not nutral or negative.

 

when you start blasing sarcastic remarks at us, doubting OUR intelligence and OUR understanding of the deen, being judgemental and irrational, while at the same time contradicting yourself in those exact issues then how can you expect us to recive your message in a good light.

 

you basicly matting an attack against us. we, of all people, are your brothers and sisters in Islam and you are treating us like we are the enemy.

 

like this line here"I bet you if I was to say that all the paper-money in this world is haraam, you would be quick to attack with the word 'conspiracy', lol."

 

i bet you that i would not cause i gave up alot of things for this deen. i gave up sex, smokeing, sleeping, pork,drinking,fighting and a host of other things becasue i accepted this deen to be the truth, and if money was haram then i would get rid of that too.

 

so please continue to do your thing. but please, for the love of Allah, watch your approach. nobody is perfect, i am far from it, and i am not accusing you of anything but it is my hemble request that you may watch how you try to convey your message.

 

salam sis.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
salaam.

 

yes, we know this stuff. we know the end is comming. you dont need to look at at hadieth to see that, most surahs mention the day of judgement one way or another.

 

what can we do about it? nothing unfortanatly. not in the long term anyways. everything has a decreed time and ours is comming very shortly. this life is but a blink in our existance.

 

Of course we can, so its alright if my country shall be attacked by a load of nuclear bombs on my head and I just do nothing? How silly does that sound. And on top of that you say do nothing! Well guess what, there are many things we can do and that is why I am here, you see not everyone has recognized the signs happening today and we must make them aware of the present situation and make them understand reality and falsehood. This is exactly what I meant earlier on when I said 'don't just sit back in front of a cube we call television and pretend nothing is happening'. And this is exactly what you are stating we as muslims should do! Allah hu Ackbar!

 

This is why there are scholars and alims who we go to at this current time and ask them for suggestions and advice. This is why I was here at the first place, first to make people understand the current situation we are in and then to ask for their suggestions and ideas. This is also a part of Mushwera.

 

And this is why I am going on about this scholar named Sheikh Imran Hosein because he has come up with some advice at least and so far probable the best advice anyone can give 'the muslim village'.

 

Also if you know this stuff is coming then why do I keep facing the word 'conspiracy' everytime being flung in my face. Why are you contradicting yourself now? Certainly I am not the one contradicting myself here, you are wrong.

 

everything you are saying, we generally know. we are not as inferior as you think we are. we do grasp the signs, and we do not reject them either.

 

Lmao!! You have been rejecting me since you have come into this discussion brother, what a huge contradiction there.

 

you know less then 5% of the ummah dosent pray 5 times a day. how can we(note:not you, we i.e the entire ummah) expect any of these things that you mentioned to change if most of the ummah dosent even pray.

 

Subhanallah, this is why I am here brother Andre, this is an Islamic forum afterall where there are numerous muslims from all over the world and many of them may not even pray once a day, so thats why this forum is a good cause because we have the chance to make them aware and understand their deen more properly.

 

when you start blasing sarcastic remarks at us, doubting OUR intelligence and OUR understanding of the deen, being judgemental and irrational, while at the same time contradicting yourself in those exact issues then how can you expect us to recive your message in a good light.

 

I think you like to interpret my words. :j:

 

Anyway as for contradictions, please provide me with my faults so I can change myself Inshallah.

 

you basicly matting an attack against us. we, of all people, are your brothers and sisters in Islam and you are treating us like we are the enemy.

 

Oh no what are we going to do??? WORLD FOOTY GUNNER is about to wage a big against her own mulim brothers and sisters!!! Run or your life!!! :sl:

 

Attack is it now? :sl:

 

Astaghfirullah brother if I were you, I would stop right there.

 

 

like this line here"I bet you if I was to say that all the paper-money in this world is haraam, you would be quick to attack with the word 'conspiracy', lol."

 

i bet you that i would not cause i gave up alot of things for this deen. i gave up sex, smokeing, sleeping, pork,drinking,fighting and a host of other things becasue i accepted this deen to be the truth, and if money was haram then i would get rid of that too.

 

Unfortunately you still haven't given up your grudge against me, because if the above line was true then you would never have attacked me with the word like 'conspiracy' at the first place.

 

so please continue to do your thing. but please, for the love of Allah, watch your approach. nobody is perfect, i am far from it, and i am not accusing you of anything but it is my hemble request that you may watch how you try to convey your message.

 

Are you half reading my replies or something? I already mentioned my lack of skill to way I have approached this topic, I already mentioned at the beginning that maybe I did a big mistake in posting up youtube videos, are you still accusing me of still doing the same thing?

 

I think you need to read my posts again to understand what I am saying more clearly. Just a little note, please try not to interpret my words, its quite annoying whenever you are doing that.

 

Ws Brother.

 

:no:

Edited by world_footy_Gunner_laDy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
You seem to have understood that there are US military occupation in Middle East and Central Asia, but why don't you understand that this leads to a bigger story? Why is that hard? Don't you see that there is something big about to happen?

 

The bigger story in the future I can only predict limitedly is the continuation of the weakening of the political power of the Muslims unless there are changes, and more competition for the world's resources by an increasing number of countries coming up on the global stage, which could mean increased capitalism and more political manipulation. It's possible that there can be regional conflicts.

 

If there is more to this bigger plan, this is Allah's plan, for He is the best of planners. I would prefer leaving it to Him alone, and preparing in whatever way I can for things that we can foresee only to a limited extent, rather than speculating what could happen based on half-truths.

 

I don't see anyone resembling the Gog and Magog at present time, and I don't see their existence, in any form, today. This severely goes against the traditional teachings of Islam and what it says about Gog and Magog.

 

Zionists want to establish the State of israel to establish the rule of the Dajjal? Again, nowhere is this mentioned in the Quran or Sunnah. This is all pure make belief. Zionists aren't even religious, why should they believe in Dajjal? The way they are acting now, let me tell you the Last Hour and Qiyamah are the last things on their minds. They are secular in their outlook. At best, the relationship between Zionism and Judaism, is that the former is a distorted view of the latter. Many of them have abandoned the teachings of Moses, and have adopted the new racist ideology, just for their own materialistic gains.

 

While there is a lot to be said about the exploitations of paper money, Islam is a practical religion and many scholars today recognise that it has a calculated intrinsic value, and like all other things made by Man, it can be used in a way that is halal or haram.

 

Please take a moment to know more about who you're quoting. While I respect Shaykh Imran Hosein and his efforts in Islam, he is not a scholar in Islamic jurisprudence. Check his qualifications and you'll find out that he has studied philosophy and other social sciences. He probably has a very good understanding of world affairs, but I can't say the same for interpretation and knowledge of the religous texts. This explains why his opinions do not follow the ulama, and he does not fall back on ijtihad in his commentary of the Quran and Sunnah.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
If there is more to this bigger plan, this is Allah's plan, for He is the best of planners. I would prefer leaving it to Him alone, and preparing in whatever way I can for things that we can foresee only to a limited extent, rather than speculating what could happen based on half-truths.

 

No you mean rather based on the quotes of the blessed scholar, who has indeed backed up every point he mentions through the Quran and Sunnat, Alhamdoulillah.

 

 

I don't see anyone resembling the Gog and Magog at present time, and I don't see their existence, in any form, today. This severely goes against the traditional teachings of Islam and what it says about Gog and Magog.

 

Maybe if you would have bothered to give the book some time to reflect upon his words and points then you could say such a false statement. This does not go against the teachings of Islam as he has clearly backed up each and every point mostly with Quranic Ayaats as well as hadiths. He has even written a whole bit on how he has interpretated it and this bit is mainly for the scholars to view themselves.

 

The reason the traditional Islamic teachings on Gog and Magog differs from this Sheikh's view is because there haven't been many scholars in the past who have taken their time dedicated to understand the reality of Gog and Magog and again please don't criticize me on what I have said untill you read the book.

 

This scholar himself has brought this book out in order to challenge those scholars that still holds the view that Gog and Magog haven't been released yet. Untill the scholars give out a verdict on this book you hold no strong statement in saying that this scholar is wrong and worse is you probably haven't even read it thoroughly.

 

Zionists want to establish the State of israel to establish the rule of the Dajjal? Again, nowhere is this mentioned in the Quran or Sunnah.

 

I would be careful when you say such a statement, when you obviously don't have any proof to say such a lie. It is by the grace of Allah Taala that he has finally brought a scholar who has dedicated nearly his whole life on this crucial topic. Why don't you check out the book of his 'Jerusalem in the Quran'. Hopefully it may shed some light upon your judgements.

 

This is all pure make belief. Zionists aren't even religious, why should they believe in Dajjal? The way they are acting now, let me tell you the Last Hour and Qiyamah are the last things on their minds. They are secular in their outlook. At best, the relationship between Zionism and Judaism, is that the former is a distorted view of the latter. Many of them have abandoned the teachings of Moses, and have adopted the new racist ideology, just for their own materialistic gains.

 

Nowhere have I said that the zionist are awaiting the Last Hour. Nowhere have I said that the zionist are real followers of Judaism, I only mentioned the fact that they believe its God's favour on them to return to the holy land.

 

While there is a lot to be said about the exploitations of paper money, Islam is a practical religion and many scholars today recognise that it has a calculated intrinsic value, and like all other things made by Man, it can be used in a way that is halal or haram.

 

I won't argue on this, the Shekh has also done a really deep study on this matter too, so if you would like to give a just a little chance you are free to do so. (you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetyoutube(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/watch?v=JhYPneQrNJ4&feature=PlayList&p=F911DA0B24A0E359&index=0&playnext=1"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetyoutube(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/watch?v=JhYPneQrNJ4...&playnext=1[/url]

 

 

Please take a moment to know more about who you're quoting. While I respect Shaykh Imran Hosein and his efforts in Islam, he is not a scholar in Islamic jurisprudence. Check his qualifications and you'll find out that he has studied philosophy and other social sciences. He probably has a very good understanding of world affairs, but I can't say the same for interpretation and knowledge of the religous texts. This explains why his opinions do not follow the ulama, and he does not fall back on ijtihad in his commentary of the Quran and Sunnah.

 

And how about you give some time to make an effort and be open minded and read the things he has to say to all of us. This is no joke. You should be careful when you say he may not be part of Islamic Jurisprudence. Don't forget the time we are leaving now is the time of ignorance. Where not me but our beloved prophet SAW has already warned us of a time where our own ulama would themselves be ignorant.

 

Because he is the odd one out, that doesn't mean you rule him our of your list and say he is not recognized as part of the Islamic Jurisprudence. Everyone have the choice to believe what they want and to search for the truth but by declaring that we cannot really trust him in all his efforts he has done to make such a crucial time so simple to understand for us muslims and non muslims is really the last thing you should have as a judgment towards him. While at the same time you haven't even managed to thoroughly give his work some time.

 

I will always support him because I have listened to his lectures and read his books and I can tell you that everything he talks about makes it so plain and simple for me to understand and I pray that Allah Taala bless him and grant him Jannat ul Firdous for all his hard work.

 

The same man who has been constantly reminding us about the collapse of the dollar since the year 2003 and proving to us how important of a time it is right now both for us muslims and non muslims. The same man who has understood the value of the holy land, Jerusalem.

 

:sl:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Zionists want to establish the State of israel to establish the rule of the Dajjal?

 

Maybe you might want to answer me, why are they about to destroy Masjid Al Aqsa? And why they are about to rebuild over it their own temple? And for whom (You already said they aren't Judaism...)?

 

:sl:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Please take a moment to know more about who you're quoting. While I respect Shaykh Imran Hosein and his efforts in Islam, he is not a scholar in Islamic jurisprudence. Check his qualifications and you'll find out that he has studied philosophy and other social sciences. He probably has a very good understanding of world affairs, but I can't say the same for interpretation and knowledge of the religous texts. This explains why his opinions do not follow the ulama, and he does not fall back on ijtihad in his commentary of the Quran and Sunnah.

 

About Imran N Hosein:

Imran Nazar Hosein is a leading International Islamic Philosopher, Scholar and author, specialising in world politics, economy, eschatology , modern socio-economic/political issues and expert on international affairs. He is best-selling author of ' Jerusalem in the Qur'an..

Imran Nazar Hosein was born in the Caribbean island of Trinidad in 1942 to parents whose ancestors had migrated from India as indentured labourers. He studied Islam, Philosophy and International Relations at several universities and institutions of higher learning. Among them are al-Azhar University in Cairo , Egypt , the Institute of International Relations of the University of the West Indies in Trinidad, the University of Karachi in Pakistan , the Aleemiyah Institute of Islamic Studies in Karachi , Pakistan , and the Graduate Institute of International Studies in Geneva , Switzerland .

 

He worked for several years as a Foreign Service Officer in the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the Government of Trinidad and Tobago .

He lived in New York for ten years during which time he served as the Director of Islamic Studies for the Joint Committee of Muslim Organizations of Greater New York. He lectured on Islam in several American and Canadian universities, colleges, churches, synagogues, prisons, community halls, etc. He also participated in many inter-faith dialogues with Christian and Jewish scholars while representing Islam in USA . He was the Imam, for sometime, at Masjid Dar al-Qur'an in Long Island , New York . He also led the weekly Jumu'ah prayers and delivered the sermon at the headquarters of the United Nations Organization in Manhattan , New York , once monthly for ten years continuously.

 

He is a former Principal of the Aleemiyah Institute of Islamic Studies in Karachi , Pakistan , Director of Research of the World Muslim Congress in Karachi , Pakistan , Director of the Islamic Institute for Education and Research in Miami , Florida , and Director of D'awah for Tanzeem-e-Islami of North America .

He has traveled continuously and extensively around the world on Islamic lecture-tours since graduating from the Aleemiyah Institute of Islamic Studies in 1971 at age 29. And he has also written more than a dozen books on Islam that have invariably been received with public respect. Indeed, Jerusalem in the Qur'an - An Islamic View of the Destiny of Jerusalem has become a best seller and has been translated and published in several languages.

 

Prof. Dr. Malik Badri, Dean of the International Institute for Islamic Thought and Civilization in Kuala Lumpur , Malaysia , wrote the Foreword to the book.

Imran's first book, entitled Islam and Buddhism in the Modern World was written when he was just 29 and still remains the only book on the subject by a Muslim scholar. That book won high praise from such eminent scholars as Vice Chancellor of University of Karachi and renowned historian, Dr. Ishtiaq Husain Quraishi, eminent Pakistani jurist and philosopher, A. K. Brohi, and eminent Muslim sociologist, Dr. Basharat Ali.

Maulana Dr. Fazlur Rahman Ansari, an outstanding scholar of Islam of the modern age, wrote the Foreword to that book.

 

Imran Hosein's three new books, published in 2007, on 'Surah al-Kahf' of the Qur'an and on the subject of 'Signs of the Last Day in the Modern Age', offer rare insights into interpretation of the Qur'an and the Hadith of Prophet Muhammad insofar as they explain the modern age.

 

:sl:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Is a ‘cut and paste’ job on his background, which can be read online, supposed to mean something?

While there is a part that says he was a student of Islam in many institutions throughout the world, was it mentioned that he had been given ijaazah by a higher religious authority in any one of those countries? Or does he have only secular degree qualifications? If it is the latter, then his efforts in interpretating the Quran cannot be taken seriously by Muslims, for only with an ijaazah, you are then allowed to comment on Quranic ayahs and Sunnah and pass opinions on contemporary issues. Only with an ijaazah can someone be qualified as an Islamic scholar. A graduate with secular education on Islamic studies is not the same as a scholar.

 

Imam Hoseini claims he is a scholar on his website, but in reality we do not know, for he makes no mention on whether he is recognized as an Islamic scholar by any religious authority.

 

The reason the traditional Islamic teachings on Gog and Magog differs from this Sheikh's view is because there haven't been many scholars in the past who have taken their time dedicated to understand the reality of Gog and Magog and again please don't criticize me on what I have said untill you read the book.

 

Don’t take it personally, I criticize his opinions, not you.

I will reply about Gog and Magog on the other thread you’ve created.

 

I would be careful when you say such a statement, when you obviously don't have any proof to say such a lie. It is by the grace of Allah Taala that he has finally brought a scholar who has dedicated nearly his whole life on this crucial topic. Why don't you check out the book of his 'Jerusalem in the Quran'. Hopefully it may shed some light upon your judgements.

 

A quote from ‘Jerusalem in the Quran’, pg 15

 

We have sometimes interpreted a text (of the Qur’an) ourselves when such a text was not directly explained, either by Allah, Most Wise, or by His Messenger (sallalahu ‘alaihi wa sallam). We did so in order to locate the Quranic explanation for our subject. When we did so, we exposed ourselves to the summary rejection of those who admit to no interpretation whatsoever of sacred texts other than its direct and literal meaning…

We invite those who reject our interpretations to themselves present that ‘explanation’ with which the Qu’ran explains the return of the Jews to the Holy Land.

 

Secondly, when we interpreted a Qu’ranic text we always did so with the provision that Allah knows best! (Allahu Alam).

 

The 1st paragraph for me, lies the crux of the issue of disagreement between us.

He disregards many aspects of tafsir the other scholars use, such as knowledge of occasion of revelation (sabab al nuzuul).

 

Were the verses about the Jews talking about the Jews in the past, or were they supposedly prophesising about the Jews at present and in the future?

When he comments about a verse, does he mention what actually they were in reference to when they were revealed in the Prophet’s time?

When he quotes a Quranic ayah and then makes a comment, does he take into account what the preceeding and following ayahs say?

Is this important to you in the first place? Or does suiting the words of the Quran to your own beliefs and opinions and totally disregard the sciences of tafsir have no effect on you?

 

Maybe you might want to answer me, why are they about to destroy Masjid Al Aqsa? And why they are about to rebuild over it their own temple? And for whom (You already said they aren't Judaism...)?

 

There is a distinction between the people and the leaders of israel. The leaders of israel don’t follow Judaism. The people in israel, a number who are Jewish in faith, do support this idea of rebuilding the temple. This latter group, together with continuous digging carried out by the israeli government around the Masjid, do represent a threat to Masjid Al-Aqsa.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

Sign in to follow this  

×