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Mudahedin

Looking At Women

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Is it haram for me to look at an female teacher when she talks to me, or women on tv(dressed properly) and when i talk to girls from my school?

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????????? no it is not, lowering your gaze does not only mean to look at the ground every time a woman speaks to you! This is talking about your modesty bro, if you look at your teacher or any other woman with lustful eyes then you need to lower your gaze meanning stop looking at women like that. Otherwise than that if your having a conversation i dont see why you should not look at them, but if you cannot help having sexual thoughts then you should lower your gaze,, but then again that would be to obvious, because everytime a woman speaks to you you would you would look right down or away from her.

 

To look at a woman should be like looking at a flower, flowers are very beautiful and you must handel them with care, thats what our sisters are like very beautiful, and we should not shy away from looking at their beauty but we should also not be perverted and stare like a sex craved maniac at them either. So appreciate the beauty and not the booty and youll be alright

 

 

 

What you have said here

we should not shy away from looking at their beauty
is contradicting with the hadith and you are encouraging to look at women.

 

Vishah

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Assalamu alaikum, below is a question regarding the issue of looking at members of the opposite gender and the reply given by a Scholar. I hope it will answer your question inshaAllah.

 

Question: My problem is that I cannot stop looking at women. Please give me some advice because I want to overcome this problem.

 

Answer: Dear questioner! Thank you for your question and the confidence you place in our service and we pray to Allah to enable us render this service purely for His Sake.

 

Lowering one’s gaze is one of the most important things that a Muslim should do to protect himself from the punishment of Allah. Every sincere Muslim should spare no pains in this regard and should take practical steps to guard his gaze and overcome his weakness.

 

Focusing on the question at hand, the prominent Muslim scholar Sheikh Muhammad Saleh Al-Munajjid, a prominent Saudi Muslim scholar and lecturer, states:

 

Shari`ah came to forbid the ways that lead to immorality, one of which is looking at non-mahram (a mahram is a non-marriageable relative) women. Almighty Allah says: “Tell the believing men to lower their gaze (from looking at forbidden things), and protect their private parts (from illegal sexual acts)” (An-Nur:30) In his commentary on this verse, Imam Ibn Kathir wrote: "This is a command from Allah to His believing slaves to lower their gaze and refrain from looking at that which is forbidden to them. So they should not look at anything except that which they are permitted to look at, and they should lower their gaze and refrain from looking at forbidden things. If it so happens that a person’s gaze accidentally falls upon something forbidden, he should quickly avert his gaze."

 

It was narrated that Jarir ibn `Abdullah said: “I asked the Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings be upon him) about an accidental glance, and he commanded me to avert my gaze.” (Muslim) Imam An-Nawawi said: "What is meant by an “accidental glance” is when a person’s glance unintentionally falls upon a non-mahram woman. There is no sin on him for the first glance, but he must avert his gaze immediately. If he averts his gaze immediately there is no sin on him, but if he continues looking, then he will be a sinner, because of this hadith, for the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) commanded him to avert his gaze, and Allah says: “Tell the believing men to lower their gaze (from looking at forbidden things), and protect their private parts (from illegal sexual acts)” (An-Nur: 30)

 

Men must lower their gaze and refrain from looking at forbidden things in all circumstances, unless there is a valid reason, such as giving testimony, medical treatment, proposing marriage, buying a slave woman, engaging in financial transactions such as buying and selling, etc. In all these cases it is permissible to look as much as is required, and no more.

 

There are means which help a person to lower his gaze, and we ask Allah to help you to do them:

 

1 – Bearing in mind the fact that Allah is watching you, that He sees you and is with you (by His knowledge) wherever you go. It may be a secretive glance of which your closest neighbor is unaware, but Allah knows of it: “Allah knows the fraud of the eyes, and all that the hearts conceal.” (Ghafir:19)

 

2 – Seeking the help of Allah, beseeching Him and calling upon Him. Almighty Allah says: “And your Lord said: Invoke Me [i.e. believe in My Oneness (Islamic Monotheism) and ask Me for anything] I will respond to your (invocation).” (Ghafir: 60)

 

3 – You should know that every blessing you enjoy comes from Allah, and requires that you should give thanks for it. Part of being grateful for the blessing of sight means that you should protect it from looking at that which Allah has forbidden. Is there any reward for a good deed, other than good? “And whatever of blessings and good things you have, it is from Allah.” (An-Nahl: 53)

 

4 – Striving with your self and training yourself to lower your gaze and be patient in doing so, and never giving up. Allah says: “As for those who strive hard in Us (Our Cause), We will surely guide them to Our paths.” (Al-`Ankabut: 69) The Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) said: “Whoever seeks to be chaste, Allah will make him chaste, and whoever seeks to be independent of means, Allah will make him independent of means, and whoever strives to be patient, Allah will make him patient…” (Al-Bukhari)

 

5 – Avoiding places where a person feels he will be exposed to the temptation of looking, if he can manage to avoid them, such as going to marketplaces or malls, and sitting idle in the street. The Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) said: “Beware of sitting in the street.” They said, “We have no alternative; that is where we sit and talk.” He said, “If you insist on sitting there, then give the street its rights.” They said, “What are the rights of the street?” He said, “Lowering the gaze and refraining from causing offence…” (Al-Bukhari and Muslim).

 

6 – You should realize that you have no choice in this matter, regardless of what the circumstances are and no matter how great is the temptation or motive to do evil, and no matter what emotions and overwhelming desires stir within your heart. You must lower your gaze and refrain from looking at forbidden things in all places and at all times. You cannot use excuses such as the environment being corrupt, or justify your mistakes by saying that you are surrounded by temptation.

 

7 – Doing a lot of voluntary acts of worship, because doing a lot of them whilst also regularly doing the obligatory acts of worship is a means of protecting one's physical faculties. According to a hadith qudsi (Divine), Allah said: “… and My slave continues to draw close to Me with supererogatory works so that I shall love him. And when I love him, I am his hearing with which he hears, his seeing with which he sees, his hand with which he strikes and his foot with which he walks. Were he to ask (something) of Me, I would surely give it to him, and were he to ask Me for refuge, I would surely grant him it.” (Al-Bukhari)

 

8 – Remembering that the earth on which sin is committed will bear witness for or against us. Allah says: “That Day it will declare its information (about all that happened over it of good or evil).” (Az-Zalzalah: 4)

 

9 – Bearing in mind some of the texts which forbid one from letting the gaze wander freely, such as the verse in which Allah says: “Tell the believing men to lower their gaze (from looking at forbidden things).” (An-Nur: 30)

 

10 – Avoiding unnecessary looks, so that you only look at what is needed to look at, and you do not allow your gaze to wander right and left so that it falls upon something the effects and temptation of which cannot be got rid of quickly.

 

11 – Marriage is one of the most effective remedies. The Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) said: “Whoever can afford it, let him get married, for it is more effective in lowering the gaze and in guarding one’s chastity. And whoever cannot afford it, let him fast, for it will be a shield for him.” (Al-Bukhari and Muslim).

 

11 – Remembering al-hur al-`een (maidens in Paradise), which will motivate you to be patient in avoiding that which Allah has forbidden, hoping to obtain this blessing. Allah said: “Companions of equal age.” (An-Naba': 33) And the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) said: "If a woman of the people of Paradise were to look out over the people of this earth, it would light up everything in between and fill it with fragrance, and the veil of her head is better than this world and everything in it.” (Al-Bukhari)

 

12 – Bearing in mind the shortcomings of the one who attracts you...

 

13 – Checking yourself from time to time and striving to make yourself lower your gaze whilst being patient, realizing that everyone makes mistakes.

 

14 – Thinking of the pain and regret that will result from this looking, and the negative effects of allowing one’s gaze to wander.

 

15 – Understanding the benefits of lowering one's gaze, as mentioned above.

 

16 – Bringing up this topic during meetings and gatherings, and explaining its dangers to others.

 

17 – Advising your relatives, telling them not to wear clothes that attract attention and show their beauty, such as how they dress, wearing bright colors, how they walk, speaking too softly, etc.

 

18 – Warding off passing thoughts and the whispers of Satan before they take hold and are acted upon. Whoever lowers his gaze after the first glance will be saved from innumerable problems, but if he continues to look he cannot be certain that seeds that will be difficult to remove, will not be planted in his heart.

 

19 – Being afraid of an evil end, and of a feeling of great regret at the point of death.

 

20 – Keeping the company of good people, because you are naturally affected by the characteristics of the people you mix with, and a person will follow the way of his close friend, and a friend will pull you to follow his way."

 

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VishahWhat you have said here is contradicting with the hadith and you are encouraging to look at women.

Vishah

Brother Vishah you are wrong i am not contradicting the Hadith at all Look at what the sister umahmad posted and look at what i said

 

what I said

bro, if you look at your teacher or any other woman with lustful eyes then you need to lower your gaze meanning stop looking at women like that.

 

 

The hadith says as well

Shari`ah came to forbid the ways that lead to immorality, one of which is looking at non-mahram (a mahram is a non-marriageable relative) women. Almighty Allah says: “Tell the believing men to lower their gaze (from looking at forbidden things), and protect their private parts (from illegal sexual acts)â€

 

Tell me brother is our women forbidden things????? Im not enccouraging looking at women i said that women are like a flower beautiful, do you or anybody else look at a flower with nasty sexual thoughts?? If you had to speak to a flower would any sex thoughts enter your mind??? Or would you see the flower for what it is?? Isn't this how we should be when looking at our women, for crying out loud we call them sisters!! how does one speak to their sister?? If im speaking to a muslim sister and she happens to be beautiful i can converse with her without drooling over her i can converse with her as a human being. Now if what you say is true then tell me how in the world do we as muslims KNOW THAT THE PROPHETS WIFE AISHA WAS BEAUTIFUL?????

According to what you have tried to correct me on then those who saw Aiaha should have lowered their gaze and not have looked at her. Yet she was the one who men went to for advice on hadith of Muhammad (pbuh).

I support the hadith 100% and i did not encourage staring at women, you are to lower your gaze now how are you to lower your gaze??? By looking down when a women speaks to you????? This is stupid because you would still have evil thoughts inside of you, so you look down but your still thinking sexually about the woman, does this make sense?? Lowering your gaze means lowering that evil gaze of sex and lust in your eyes and becomming more human, thats why the hadith after it mentions to lower your gaze it mentions to protect your private parts, why?? because this gaze is in connection with sex!!

Ive been on IF for a while now why would you accuse me of such a thing!! Im a muslim just like you.

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Assalamu Alaikum, Please read the post that I made before, below in quotes is a part of it. Brother twoswordali, what you are saying and what I posted is not the same, in fact they contradict each other.

 

It was narrated that Jarir ibn `Abdullah said: “I asked the Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings be upon him) about an accidental glance, and he commanded me to avert my gaze.” (Muslim) Imam An-Nawawi said: "What is meant by an “accidental glance” is when a person’s glance unintentionally falls upon a non-mahram woman. There is no sin on him for the first glance, but he must avert his gaze immediately. If he averts his gaze immediately there is no sin on him, but if he continues looking, then he will be a sinner, because of this hadith, for the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) commanded him to avert his gaze, and Allah says: “Tell the believing men to lower their gaze (from looking at forbidden things), and protect their private parts (from illegal sexual acts)” (An-Nur: 30)

 

We are not any more pious than the Companions of RasoolAllah Sallallahu alaihi Wa Sallam, if these were the rules for them, then how can they be any less for us in these times.

 

You can look at your wife as many times as you want and appreciate and praise her beauty, you can appreciate your mother, daughter and the other mahram women that have been mentioned in the Qur'aan, the limitations are for women who ar not your Mahrams.

 

Assalamu alaikum.

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Assalamu Alaikum, Please read the post that I made before, below in quotes is a part of it. Brother twoswordali, what you are saying and what I posted is not the same, in fact they contradict each other.

We are not any more pious than the Companions of RasoolAllah Sallallahu alaihi Wa Sallam, if these were the rules for them, then how can they be any less for us in these times.

 

You can look at your wife as many times as you want and appreciate and praise her beauty, you can appreciate your mother, daughter and the other mahram women that have been mentioned in the Qur'aan, the limitations are for women who ar not your Mahrams.

 

Assalamu alaikum.

 

Sister look at the what you posted

 

It was narrated that Jarir ibn `Abdullah said: “I asked the Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings be upon him) about an accidental glance, and he commanded me to avert my gaze.†(Muslim) Imam An-Nawawi said: "What is meant by an “accidental glance†is when a person’s glance unintentionally falls upon a non-mahram woman. There is no sin on him for the first glance, but he must avert his gaze immediately. If he averts his gaze immediately there is no sin on him, but if he continues looking, then he will be a sinner, because of this hadith, for the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) commanded him to avert his gaze, and Allah says: “Tell the believing men to lower their gaze (from looking at forbidden things), and protect their private parts (from illegal sexual acts)†(An-Nur: 30)

 

What is an accidental glaze?? its not I repeat it is not when someone JUST ACCIDENTLY looks at a woman, it is when you lustfully look at a woman BY ACCIDENT then you catch yourself. Picture this , when a woman walks into a room and lets say that she is beautiful and big chested(forgive me if this sounds silly) Now if a brother looks when she walks into a room hes like WOW LOOK HER!! and then he lowers his gaze as to not be a sinner, meaning that he doesent let his urges get the better of him hes had his one look and thats it,another brother looks and says wow and then looks away but the sisters figure is still in his mind and hes thinking about her ,now the third brother just stares and stares and is drifting off into extasy while looking at her. What im saying is this, that what makes one brother different from another??

 

The first brother slipped but he caught his self the second brother although he got a good look he looks away( i wont even mention the third brother), Now Brothers please answer this and be truthful if you've seen a beautiful sister when she walks in a room does looking away from her help you to not l picture her in your mind??? No it doesent and this is not lowering your gaze, the 2 brothers(2 and 3) in this analogy is doing the same thing. Because they are still gazing at this women one in the present and the other in his mind.Now this is for sisters as well how many of us has had a crush on a woman or a man when we were younger?? Be it a singer movie actor man or woman in your country?? Now how many of us still have those crushes???

 

If you do then you have not learned to lower your gaze! A gaze is how it all starts then sex comes next( look how wise the Prophet was) If we lower our gaze we are also to protect our private parts, because that gaze can lead to fornication. Now if a woman with a big chest and beautiful comes to a 5 year old bot and talks to him is that 5 year old boy looking at her with lust in his eyes?? No!! He can look at her and talk to her as a human being innocently his gaze is lowered for sure!! And didn't the prophet(pbuh) have this same type of innocence, and here he is in this hadith trying to teach it to us. But were thinking that it means to just look down or look away and thats lowering your gaze.

 

Sister umAhamd do you love chocolate cookies, or how about chocolates?? What if your doctor told you to not eat any chocolate that it is bad for you and to not even THINK about chocolate because it will be bad for you( hard right :sl: ) Now you go into a store and see chocolate you and you immediatly look away, but whats on your mind?? That delicious chocolate right?? MM MMM how good it taste :sl: You are still gazing at the chocalate!!! But if you go in the store and look at the chocolate and not even be affected by how good it taste then you are nolonger gazing at the chocalate. And what i said is not contradicting the hadith at all,

the Prophet(pbuh) wants us to be good humans like him, having that innocence and protect our private parts. He wants us to not be all about sex the TV today B.E.T. , M.T.V., and TV in general wants us to be gazing at women like their sex objects, this is disrespectful to good women and the Prophet laid out for us how to treat women. I am not advocating to be staring at women and if I have a conversation with a woman and i cannot control myself then lowering my eyes to the ground will not help me if the inside of me is filled with poisoness thoughts

Edited by twoswordali

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:sl:

 

Read this article:

 

(I copied and pasted the most relevant part here)

 

2. Guarding your gaze is a good practice that fosters modest interaction between the sexes. The Quran commands both believing men and women to guard their gaze. Unfortunately, many Muslims have lost this practice. What guarding the gaze means is that you should refrain from staring at a woman's face (if she's not a member of your unmarriageable kin or your wife). It does not mean keeping one's eyes glued to the ground. In Western societies, guarding one's gaze can sometimes be interpreted as a lack of assertiveness or respect for the other person. However, with Muslims, guarding one's gaze indicates respect for the other person's space and modesty of intention. Our scholars have said that looking at a woman's face is permitted in certain occasions. For example, if you are seeking a woman in marriage, it is permitted to look at her face. If you work in any type of job that requires you to look at people and interact with them, looking is permitted as long as you don't look with desire. If you are a teacher, looking at your female students is permitted as long as you don't look more than necessary or with desire. In short, be modest and respectful.

 

(you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_qa.sunnipath(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/issue_view.asp?HD=1&ID=4771&CATE=143"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_qa.sunnipath(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/issue_view.asp?HD=...71&CATE=143[/url]

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it is not when someone JUST ACCIDENTLY looks at a woman, it is when you lustfully look at a woman BY ACCIDENT then you catch yourself.

 

:sl:

 

Brother twoswordali, please do not give other members your own interpretation of Hadiths. That is not the meaning given to that Hadith by the scholars and I would ask you to refrain from spreading it to other members on the forum.

 

Either support your words with scholarly writings or please leave the issue alone.

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There are "weak" hadiths

 

and strong hadiths.

 

I don't trust hadiths AT ALL.

 

Let me make clear that I am not a Muslims and I do not submit, but I look at things logically.

 

The Koran should never bow to something that may be weaker than it. Such as hadiths. Don't cite interpretations other than your own.

 

Or am I wrong?

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There are "weak" hadiths

 

and strong hadiths.

 

I don't trust hadiths AT ALL.

 

Let me make clear that I am not a Muslims and I do not submit, but I look at things logically.

 

The Koran should never bow to something that may be weaker than it. Such as hadiths. Don't cite interpretations other than your own.

 

Or am I wrong?

 

The interpretation of Hadiths is based on the Qur'an and on other Hadiths. If a Hadith tells us that prophet Muhammad used to pray 5 times a day, we look to the Qur'an. Does the Qur'an command us to conduct prayer? Yes. Does it explain in detail the steps to perform prayer? No. Does it tell us that prophet Muhammad was sent as an example and guidance to mankind? Yes. Therefore, the example of prophet Muhammad is the one we follow in regards to performing prayer, and that example is in the Hadiths.

 

What I'm saying above doesn't even begin to scratch at the surface when it comes to the process of classifying and interpreting Hadiths. It's a complex and indepth system, and I can suggest a few articles if you are curious enough.

 

This particular Hadith does not make the Qur'an "bow" to it. It reflects the words of prophet Muhammad in regard to the commandment in the Qur'an that tells both men and women to "lower their gaze". The Qur'an is easy to read, the language is simple enough that you can understand the sentences and follow along. It's not written in a complex language. But every chapter has a rich history, and that history is recorded in the Hadiths.

 

Here is an example that I like to use. It's one of the shortest chapters in the Qur'an, but carries a world of meaning. It was revealed shortly after the Muslims had conquered Makkah and established Islam in the city.

 

Surah An-Nasr (Divine Support)

1. When there comes the help of Allah and the Conquest.

2. And you see that the people enter Allah's religion in crowds.

3. So, glorify the praises of your Lord, and ask His forgiveness. Verily, He is the One Who accepts the repentance and Who forgives.

 

According to Hadiths, this chapter was indicating the approaching death of prophet Muhammad. Can anyone who reads the chapter understand it? Of course, but they certainly can't pick up on more than is on the pages.

 

If you question the authenticity of a Sahih (authentic) Hadith, you might as well question the authenticity of the Qur'an. Because the same people who have preserved these Hadiths are the same ones that have preserved the Qur'an. You might argue, "well, the Qur'an doesn't have strong/weak verses". I would answer that by saying that Sahih Hadiths are not categorized as strong/weak either. All Muslims should rely on them after the Qur'an.

 

A Muslim person NEVER, and I mean, NEVER gives their personal interpretation on ANYTHING. Do you know what the difference between a scholar and a simple Muslim is? The scholars have knowledge. They have researched many subjects extensively to the point where they will be able to quote to you Hadith numbers and periods of verse/chapter revelations without even looking them up. When someone lacks knowledge on an issue, it is ignorant of them to arrive at any sort of conclusion.

 

Let me give you an example of people who thought they knew the answers, but ended up making a fatal mistake. This is a narration from a Sahih Hadith.

 

A man at the time of prophet Muhammad had a wet dream. Usually, a person in such a case cannot perform prayer until they make ghusl (washing one's body in a specific manner). However, he had a head injury as a result of a battle. He asked a couple of companions on what he should do and they told him that he has to make ghusl. As a result of water entering the wound, he died. When prophet Muhammad found out, he said that water was not a requirement for such a situation and that these two men were responsible for his death (because they did not ask, they merely "interpreted" on their own).

 

The knowledge that scholars have has been passed down since the companions of prophet Muhammad. That is the knowledge that we rely on, not personal interpretations. People who make their own judgements are deviating from the path, and they WILL end up falling into error. And most often, they will be responsible for misguiding others as well.

 

Also, what we Muslims follow is the consensus. It's what the majority of scholars agree upon, based on their own thorough research into the Qur'an and Hadiths. The scholars do not disagree with one another on major issues such as the performing of the 5 daily prayers, which direction to face during prayer, or the worship of Allah alone. Or even on what the meaning of the above Hadith is.

 

I'd like to add that if you want to discuss the issue in more detail, it would be more appropriate to make a new topic for it. For one, we have strayed off the subject and another thing is that this is the "Islamic Discussions" section where Muslims discuss things with one another and it's not appropriate for the topic starter to become confused by a discussion between a Muslim and a non-Muslim.

 

Salam.

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Ok, this subject is getting AWAY from where the asker intended! Let's calm things and bring them back to where they were.

 

Dear Mudahedin, it is specifically told by sunna that the woman's modesty is all her body except for her face and hands. It has also been established in sunna that when a man wants to marry a woman from a home, he has the right to meet her and at least see her face. It is also been obviously presented in many hadiths and sunna stories that the prophet and companions - after the hijab rules of modesty has been established - were still talking to women if they know them and some of the companions would even describe how some of the prophet's women dressed when they saw them and recognized them around the Kaaba. Not only that but the prophet has met and sat with women in many situations and looked straight at their faces, including the great Women Bayaa after the Fath (taking back Mecca) {Saheeh Al-Bokhary}. Furthermore, handshaking was not specifically forbidden, however it was noticed very clearly that the prophet never did. Abu Baker however shook the hands of old women and children (women outside the age of sexual desire), and Abdullah Ebn El-Zubair had an old lady as a nurse who used to support him when sitting and clean his head of fleas.

 

As per Professor Gamal El-Masry and other scholars who teach at Islamic Universities, students of different sexes meeting in that college and standing and talking to each other, and looking at male and female teachers, is acceptable in sharea as far as the situation is purely concerned, and the haram forbidden area begins as the looks turn into contemplating gazes and thinking about unacceptable things.

 

It is therefore firmly established that if you are conversing or learning from someone and you are looking at her face, you are not commiting a sin just for that, most particularly in a learning situation like a school or college or while conducting buying and selling like in shops, as long as you are maintaining Islamic behaviour of not looking at her body or conjuring up thoughts in your mind, or taking the conversation out of its subjective nature and moving towards useless banter.

 

UmAhmed, with all due respect, the hadith did NOT say to avert looking at a person when she's veiled. The glance of this hadith has been established by most scholars to be a glance at the body making out its features, and yes it is meant as a glance of interest towards her "womanly features". It was established by most moderate scholars that "looking at a woman while speaking and while she is wearing a dress that abides by the Islamic hijab rules is not forbidden." The look that is meant in the hadith and the quran they have established that it is when you look unnecessarily at a woman as a whole and naturally see her body and start receiving thoughts of how her body looks, that is what men must avert their eyes quickly. But looking at a woman while she is teaching or being taught, or while she is buying your goods at your store or handing you the money, is not haram.

 

Further to this UmAhmed, I have ALL the respect for Saudi scholars and have learned from many, but I need to always review what is said by people from there which we don't know, and that is because some of them are influenced by the eighteenth century movement that has made many acceptable things to authentic Islam as unacceptable, a movement which was actually demeaning of women in a lot of ways.

 

Sam

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Assalamu Alaikum, I don't think I mentioned anywhere that about looking or not looking at a woman who is veiled, I mean if someone is veiled and covered in the Islamic way and a man stares at her, WHAT WILL HE BE ABLE TO SEE? Nothing, still if he was staring with bad intentions he will get his share of sin even though he could not see anything. I hope I the readers understand what I am saying.

 

Brother Sam, I have respect for scholars Saudi or otherwise, and you cannot say that the Saudi Scholars are stuck in the Era that demeaned women. There are Saudi and Non Saudi scholars present now in the 21 Century who demean women as well as those who put the women above the pulpits, not only that but they demean men and women who try to follow the Sunnah of RasoolAllah Salallahu alaihi Wa Sallam very closely in their lives.

 

I would also like to mention that the ruling is to lower your gaze in the presence of a Non Mahram, The face is the most significant part of the body, and the face is what a person gets attracted to most, so looking at the face of a Non Mahram should be avoided unless it is for reasons mentioned in my previous posts. I am sure there might be instances where the men don't care about how the woman's face looks as long as er body looks attractive, that would really be rare though.

 

The article I posted in my previous posts is not my view but the SOURCE is there and whoever interested can check it out and benefit from it, and as far as I know the Scholar is well respected here in Canada.

 

Brother twoswordali, Sorry, but No I don't like Chocolate Cookies nor Chocolate, but I would like to say that if a doctor tells someone not to eat chocolate for health reasons, it means that chocolate is not good for that particular person not the entire Muslim Ummah, whereas the ahkam/order of lowering the gaze is for the the whole Ummah, your example does not fit the discussion.

 

Assalamu Alaikum.

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