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Lohavira

Islam In Switzerland

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Like I said I am not going to argue over a word.

 

I agree that many Muslims do come from a particular part of the world. However, an Egyptian Muslim will tell you their culture is very different from a Iranian Muslim just like an Iranian Muslim will tell you their culture is very different from a Turkish Muslim. They will tell you that simply because their cultures are different. I think they ought to know their own culture better than what you think their culture is unless of course you have lived in many middle eastern countries and experienced the cultures.

 

Muslims can live wherever they want. The main reason most immigrants went to Switzerland is because they could get a job there. Muslims in Switzerland are there because that is what they chose just like Swiss people chose to live in other countries too. It really is not complicated.

 

 

Muslims, so far as I know don't have any special rights regarding where they can live.

People generally cannot just live where they want. My daughter (who is from the UK) went to visit Australia, but she was only allowed to stay after she found a job. and even then she had to keep renewing her visa until she had been resident for more than 5 years. EU citizens have the right to work in any other EU country, but those coming from outside the EU do not have that right automatically. They are only allowed to work if they are offerred a job which an EU national cannot do. They are also only allowed to stay in the UK (for example) if they have close relatives living there.

 

You seem to live on another planet.

 

regards,

 

ron

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Muslims, so far as I know don't have any special rights regarding where they can live.

 

You seem to live on another planet.

 

regards,

 

ron

Did I say Muslims have special rights regarding where they live? No.

 

After Muslims (and non Muslims alike) have gone through the immigration process they can live anywhere they like after they receive permission from the government of that country. Most countries in Europe have a very strict immigration process, it is their job to analyse why a person would want to live/work in that country.

 

I don't need a lecture on visa regulations, I am quite well aware of visa issues as I have gotten visa's going on holiday to other parts of the world before.

 

And no, I live on planet earth.

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Did I say Muslims have special rights regarding where they live? No.

 

After Muslims (and non Muslims alike) have gone through the immigration process they can live anywhere they like after they receive permission from the government of that country. Most countries in Europe have a very strict immigration process, it is their job to analyse why a person would want to live/work in that country.

 

I don't need a lecture on visa regulations, I am quite well aware of visa issues as I have gotten visa's going on holiday to other parts of the world before.

 

And no, I live on planet earth.

 

 

"Muslims can live wherever they want" --- Your quote I believe. So .... ( a generalism, or simply a case of words not really meaning anything much?)

Ah, 'gone through the immigration process', so it's all so simple isn't it?

 

And yet: "Most countries in Europe have a very strict immigration process etc etc"

 

Who's lecturing? I was just pointing out, that's all!

 

Bye bye,

 

ron

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"Muslims can live wherever they want" --- Your quote I believe. So .... ( a generalism, or simply a case of words not really meaning anything much?)

Muslims can live wherever they want - I don't believe there is a country that has a law saying no muslims allowed. I presumed you knew people had to go through immigration procedures before entering the country which is why I didn't bring it up in the first place but since you got technical and picky I referred to it.

 

I have made plenty of examples in relation to why Muslims are living in Switzerland the main one being they had job opportunities but you just don't want to know.

 

You come across as always refusing to understand the Islamic way of life which makes one wonder why you are on an Islamic forum and why you claim to be a Muslim.

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Muslims can live wherever they want - I don't believe there is a country that has a law saying no muslims allowed. I presumed you knew people had to go through immigration procedures before entering the country which is why I didn't bring it up in the first place but since you got technical and picky I referred to it.

 

I have made plenty of examples in relation to why Muslims are living in Switzerland the main one being they had job opportunities but you just don't want to know.

 

You come across as always refusing to understand the Islamic way of life which makes one wonder why you are on an Islamic forum and why you claim to be a Muslim.

 

Nonsense. I just happen to not see eye to eye with a number of Muslims, that's all. I've absolutely no idea why you're saying : "You always come across as refusing to understand the Islamic way of life"

I understand it alright, in spite of the fact that we're all different.

 

r

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1. Reversion yes Muslims use it to say returning to being a muslim because we were all born muslims - you can use whatever word you like and twist it to your belief.

2. How am I talking about immigrants I quite clearly was talking about swiss natives

3. so basically you have a double standard - its ok for a swiss native to be a muslim but its not ok for a muslim from elsewhere to decide to live in switzerland.

Why would a muslim go somewhere where(justly or unjustly) they are not wanted?

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Why would a muslim go somewhere where(justly or unjustly) they are not wanted?

The Muslim doesn't necessarily have to 'go' to Switzerland when there are native Swiss people born there who decided to be Muslim.

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Assalam o Alaikum wa Rahmatullah wa Barakatuhu,

 

 

I would feel happier if this Topic "Islam in Switzerland" would emphasize on WHAT is happening regarding Islam in Switzerland!

 

As I wasnt here,I will write One Post regarding this whole Issue,hoping to clear Confusions as far as possible.Inshaa Allah!

 

As a little comparison I would love to tell Ron and any other who cant comprehend how Muslims reached Switzerland, that there are European Non-Muslims,American Non-Muslims (Non Muslims around the World in General) living in Muslim Countries in PEACE and HARMONY!I know a woman myself whoz Swiss but she lives in a Village in Pakistan has 2 sons who speak Punjabi -pure native language of Pakistan- and she is a Revert (and yes its a Belief that all human beings are Muslim when born).

People are crossing Borders since Centuries!Difficulties are there (Immigration issues) but these are NOT related to Religion in general (it might be influenced maybe a tiny bit after 9/11 but under normal circumstances it is not the Main Factor for Visa Approval/Rejection!) A further Info is that on a Swiss Passboard there is no place where your Religion is mentioned,nor is your Native Homeland mentioned!

 

This list basically applies to any country having foreigners (Muslims in this case) and how they reached there,here talkin about Switzerland:

 

1.The Reverts (of any Nationality)

2.Those who came during early Days when immigration issues where Non-existent and are now settled

3.Students/Enterpreneurs/Job seekers

4.Those who marry a Swiss National (native/foreign) and then settle there too.

5.Immigrants in General

 

Obviously there must be cases peeking out of these 5 but those are exceptional cases!

 

Switzerland is an amazing land to live!The people are soo friendly!Yes its true that the Minarett-Initiative made switzerland notorious and people see it as Anti-Islamic but these are only some people and some specific areas.The bigger Cities had People even apologizing on you are not allowed to post links yetIslam.ch as they were ashamed of the Result!Swiss People are very tolerant,open and friendly!Alhamdolillah!

 

Sister Lost in Paradies,Jazakallah for answering in my Absence and Ron I hope all confusions are cleared.If there are some persisting,please try to solve them at some other Place, where Immigration questions and the questions why Muslims are in Countries where there are least expected ( by some) might be answered as a General Topic!

.Jazakallah Khair for the Understanding in Advance!

 

 

Btw Alhamdolillah Islam is the fastest growing Religion despite of the Islamophobia hype that is unjustly created! Truth is always accepted,sooner or later!:sl: Islam is so perfect and righteous!SubhanAllah! those who dont believe my words should start looking into it,go to a Masjid,read the Quran....just to experience the miraculous Journey themselves,without bumping into fruitless Discussions!:no:

 

Jazak Allah Khair!

 

Wassalam ,

 

A muslim sister living happily in Switzerland!:sl:

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Assalam o Alaikum wa Rahmatullah wa Barakatuhu,

I would feel happier if this Topic "Islam in Switzerland" would emphasize on WHAT is happening regarding Islam in Switzerland!

 

As I wasnt here,I will write One Post regarding this whole Issue,hoping to clear Confusions as far as possible.Inshaa Allah!

 

As a little comparison I would love to tell Ron and any other who cant comprehend how Muslims reached Switzerland, that there are European Non-Muslims,American Non-Muslims (Non Muslims around the World in General) living in Muslim Countries in PEACE and HARMONY!A muslim sister living happily in Switzerland!:sl:

 

I think you are confused, regarding this statement. Talk to the coptic Christians in Egypt, or most Christians in pakistan. Christians can't put their religion on their drivers licenses in Turkey(which is mandatory), because they'll have trouble finding work. In indonesia, a group of Christian schoolgirls were beheaded by a gang of muslims. In Saudi Arabia, where swine rule, it is illegal to wear a cross. Muslims are treated like gods in the west compared to the dispicable treatment of other religions in muslim lands. Is this at all fair? You get to have your religion protected in our lands and we are treated as dogs in your lands. I sometimes sound harsh in some of my critisisms of your muslim theocracies, but the truth has to be told. You can't turn a blind eye to it.

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I think you are confused, regarding this statement. Talk to the coptic Christians in Egypt, or most Christians in pakistan. Christians can't put their religion on their drivers licenses in Turkey(which is mandatory), because they'll have trouble finding work. In indonesia, a group of Christian schoolgirls were beheaded by a gang of muslims. In Saudi Arabia, where swine rule, it is illegal to wear a cross. Muslims are treated like gods in the west compared to the dispicable treatment of other religions in muslim lands. Is this at all fair? You get to have your religion protected in our lands and we are treated as dogs in your lands. I sometimes sound harsh in some of my critisisms of your muslim theocracies, but the truth has to be told. You can't turn a blind eye to it.

 

Firstly, who's "we"? You listed your religion as 'Non-religion'. So you are no christian.

 

Secondly, the governments in Egypt, Indonesia and Saudi Arabia are supported by your leaders. Turkey is today what your people made it post WW1. You people criticize these countries yet at the same time prop them up.

 

Thirdly, for 1400 years Christians and Jews enjoyed peace and security under the Islamic Caliphate. From the rule of Umar bin Khattab to the Ottoman Empire. During the reconquista Jews from Spain moved to turkey where the seat of power of the Ottoman Caliphate was. If any thing wrong happens these days its because we are in a very low point in our history. Not that I'm admitting we do much wrong. Why don't you tell us about what happened in AMBON, Indonesia on 9/11/2011? Where Christians rioted destroying and killing. Why don't you tell us about the Christian church in Egypt where they held two Muslim women hostage(and are probably still holding them hostage) just because they left Christianity and became Muslim. There are so many more such example I can bring you from across the Muslim world. You people watch CNN, BBC, Fox news and then lecture us about intolerance when you have no idea what is actually happening in the Muslim World.

 

Now I'm not playing 'your people, my people' because if there was an Islamic state, any non-Muslim under our protection would be a citizen and "one of us" but you and everyone need to realize there is a another side to everything and this is something you wont see in the media. Just like the above mentioned crimes. How many tv channels showed it on the news?

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Firstly, who's "we"? You listed your religion as 'Non-religion'. So you are no christian.

 

Secondly, the governments in Egypt, Indonesia and Saudi Arabia are supported by your leaders. Turkey is today what your people made it post WW1. You people criticize these countries yet at the same time prop them up.

 

Thirdly, for 1400 years Christians and Jews enjoyed peace and security under the Islamic Caliphate. From the rule of Umar bin Khattab to the Ottoman Empire. During the reconquista Jews from Spain moved to turkey where the seat of power of the Ottoman Caliphate was. If any thing wrong happens these days its because we are in a very low point in our history. Not that I'm admitting we do much wrong. Why don't you tell us about what happened in AMBON, Indonesia on 9/11/2011? Where Christians rioted destroying and killing. Why don't you tell us about the Christian church in Egypt where they held two Muslim women hostage(and are probably still holding them hostage) just because they left Christianity and became Muslim. There are so many more such example I can bring you from across the Muslim world. You people watch CNN, BBC, Fox news and then lecture us about intolerance when you have no idea what is actually happening in the Muslim World.

 

Now I'm not playing 'your people, my people' because if there was an Islamic state, any non-Muslim under our protection would be a citizen and "one of us" but you and everyone need to realize there is a another side to everything and this is something you wont see in the media. Just like the above mentioned crimes. How many tv channels showed it on the news?

Yes, I say I am of no religion, but I am of the west and the vast, vast majority of us were brought up in Christianity. By we, I mean the western nations who built such great societies compared to the rest of the world, that millions of muslims flock here. We don't flock to muslim lands. You continually play the victim. You and your people should take responsibility for your own mess. Don't preach about past muslim greatness. It's long gone. There are many good and successful muslims in the world, but your muslim theocracies are all failures. You can't run a country on fundamentalist religious beliefs. How many times have we seen Christians murdered in Islamic states? How many times have we seen muslims murdered in Islamic states because they converted or pissed off the masters?Coptic Christians in Egypt are treated like garbage. The hostage incident is a one-off. You can.t even compare. Maybe they feel desperate from their plight in Egypt and a few went off a bit. You like to use this same excuse for Islamic terrorists. Christianity has moved past its datrk ages. Islam has not. Stop blaming every one else for your failures. It's your own fault, not ours. you blame israel too, for all the problems in the middle east. Yeah, right.

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Asalaamu Alaykum,

 

You can't run a country on fundamentalist religious beliefs

 

If you are reffering here to Shariah Law, then you are wrong. I believe that when implemented correctly by people who are qualified to do so, it is the best system.

 

People have a profound misunderstanding of the Shariah, because the people who recently claim to have implemented it have done it incorrectly and have used it as a tool to get elected.

 

I have just recently graduated from university in London and am now working (Alhumdullilah) and the fear the people have about muslims is so displaced. Its like I spend 30% of my time addressing issues regarding misconceptions about Islam!

 

that millions of muslims flock here. We don't flock to muslim lands.

 

The main reason as to why there are millions of muslims in the west is because of the colonization that took place when the "west" effectlively ruled 2/3 of the world. Taking at will the riches of the land maximising their profits and destroying the lands of others (muslims and non muslims) with debts and intrest that they could never repay, so that their homelands could prosper. THIS WAS THE CASE FOR BOTH MUSLIMS AND NON MUSLIM COUNTRIES.

 

Millions of Muslims and non Muslims who are not "originally" from the west now live there because of this reason. You also need to remember that after the world wars the west brought over a lot of people to help rebuild their war torn countries.

 

Your claim that you have come out of the dark ages and into the light, was by occupation, theft, murder and many other crimes that enabled the "west" to aquire the wealth and influence that it has today.

It is a fact. I will give you a non muslim example- in Africa where some of the most precious stones have been found, namely diamonds the west while occupying the land took full control of the excavation and aquiring diamonds, just look at the case of "kimberly diamonds" where a company owned by british and american citizens took ownership profited hugely at the expense of locals.

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Yes, I say I am of no religion, but I am of the west and the vast, vast majority of us were brought up in Christianity. By we, I mean the western nations who built such great societies compared to the rest of the world, that millions of muslims flock here. We don't flock to muslim lands. You continually play the victim. You and your people should take responsibility for your own mess. Don't preach about past muslim greatness. It's long gone. There are many good and successful muslims in the world, but your muslim theocracies are all failures. You can't run a country on fundamentalist religious beliefs. How many times have we seen Christians murdered in Islamic states? How many times have we seen muslims murdered in Islamic states because they converted or pissed off the masters?Coptic Christians in Egypt are treated like garbage. The hostage incident is a one-off. You can.t even compare. Maybe they feel desperate from their plight in Egypt and a few went off a bit. You like to use this same excuse for Islamic terrorists. Christianity has moved past its datrk ages. Islam has not. Stop blaming every one else for your failures. It's your own fault, not ours. you blame israel too, for all the problems in the middle east. Yeah, right.

 

Well you are short sighted. For centuries your people flocked to or lands. These times are temporary. See this is the difference between the other civilizations of the world and Islam. Islam was sent by Allah and it WILL be victorious. Our 'golden age' will return inshAllah. It's a promise from Allah. I just hope you and I are alive to see it. For you to say "..in Islamic States" just shows how ignorant you are. I'm not trying to be rude or anything and I have repeated this on this forum a million times that there is no Islamic State in the World today. Who are you talking about? What Islamic State? The last 'Islamic State' was the Ottoman Empire. Even if today some Christians, etc are treated like garbage that doesn't mean we Muslims think its ok. And you cant blame us. If we had an Islamic State(something the West is hell bent on preventing) we would protect the rights of minorities, etc. But the people in power in our countries are YOUR allies and people your leaders are keeping in power. Like Mubarak was and now in Yemen and Saudi, etc. And then you come and blame us for them?

 

And it's quiet disgusting how you just brush so many crimes with one statement like "You continually play the victim. You and your people should take responsibility for your own mess", etc. Imagine if Muslims rioted in one of the Western countries? Killing and burning churches? We'd be locked up for life or executed or something. You had no idea what is happening in Indonesia, the Phillipines, the things that happened in Iraq and other places. The hostage thing is not a one-off.

 

Check this: (you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetgawaher(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/index.php?showtopic=734553.html&"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetgawaher(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/index.php?showtopic=734553.html&[/url]

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Assalam o Alaikum,

 

Again we are talkin about a general topic rather than what the real topic is.

 

But yeah,I feel the urge to answer because the comparison I was talking about was based on first hand experience.I KNOW Non-Muslims living happily in Pakistan.There is not even a tiny bit of confusion coz I know how peacefully everyone s living.

I could show you a whole Gallery of beautiful and huge churches there.No one is bothered by them,they are a part of the society.Now if the Media is brain washing the whole world you should watch out for that.I dont really want an answer but I urge Non-Muslims to look around And observe Muslims....Do they act unfriendly?Is there something about them that can be named terroristic?Now if there are some bad ones...arent bad people everywhere?Why picking on a Religion?Why not simply neutrally on the Person?

Look,The story from the last days in which two planes crashed coz of the fault of a Person not having evaluated the whole situation properly and his Murder by a Man who lost his Child and Wife.He was wrong but if he would be Muslim his Name would be Terrorist.Now the worst name given to him might be lunatic,isnt it?Or the Day of Terror in Norway....he wasnt named a Terrorist.Although what he did was worse than that!

If all Non-Muslims would hold on for a while.Put down the Anti-islamic Cap they would see the difference.Islam is a Religion,a way of Life.Its not the Name of an Organisation or a Person.

 

As I said before....read the Quran.Look at the Life of our Prophet (PBUH).While doing so be neutral,give Prejudice and clichees no Chance.You ll see....Islam will show its beauty,Inshaa Allah!

 

Islam even the word in its own context means Peace and Submission.Our one and only goal in life is (or basically should be) Allahs Submission and His Happiness.May Allah guide everyone to the Real and Only Path,May He bless us with strenght and Patience!Ameen!

 

And adding to the real Topic:

Alhamdolillah I have seen manyyyy women in Hijab here.I love when we greet each other by saying Salam.Its such an incredible nice feeling.

There is also a planned Ummah Day here.Im eagerly waiting for it....!=)

Edited by Lohavira

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Well you are short sighted. For centuries your people flocked to or lands. These times are temporary. See this is the difference between the other civilizations of the world and Islam. Islam was sent by Allah and it WILL be victorious. Our 'golden age' will return inshAllah. It's a promise from Allah. I just hope you and I are alive to see it. For you to say "..in Islamic States" just shows how ignorant you are. I'm not trying to be rude or anything and I have repeated this on this forum a million times that there is no Islamic State in the World today. Who are you talking about? What Islamic State? The last 'Islamic State' was the Ottoman Empire. Even if today some Christians, etc are treated like garbage that doesn't mean we Muslims think its ok. And you cant blame us. If we had an Islamic State(something the West is hell bent on preventing) we would protect the rights of minorities, etc. But the people in power in our countries are YOUR allies and people your leaders are keeping in power. Like Mubarak was and now in Yemen and Saudi, etc. And then you come and blame us for them?

 

And it's quiet disgusting how you just brush so many crimes with one statement like "You continually play the victim. You and your people should take responsibility for your own mess", etc. Imagine if Muslims rioted in one of the Western countries? Killing and burning churches? We'd be locked up for life or executed or something. You had no idea what is happening in Indonesia, the Phillipines, the things that happened in Iraq and other places. The hostage thing is not a one-off.

 

Check this: you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetgawaher(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/index.php?showtopic=734553.html&

Muslims as a group must ultimately take resposibility for what happens in their lands. Stop blaming the west for everything. Yes, you haven't been treated fairly at times in the past, and the Iraq invasion was a crime, but hopefully you can get rid of the despots. Free yourselves, but be wary of its replacement. Iran is a perfect example of this. If the muslim brotherhood or hammas comes in, there will never be peace. You can count on that. I remember when the government minister in Pakistan was murdered for saying that blasphemy laws should be repealed. Thousands cheered his death. These are the things that push us away from muslims. We just shake our heads.

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Assalam o Alaikum,

 

Again we are talkin about a general topic rather than what the real topic is.

 

But yeah,I feel the urge to answer because the comparison I was talking about was based on first hand experience.I KNOW Non-Muslims living happily in Pakistan.There is not even a tiny bit of confusion coz I know how peacefully everyone s living.

I could show you a whole Gallery of beautiful and huge churches there.No one is bothered by them,they are a part of the society.Now if the Media is brain washing the whole world you should watch out for that.I dont really want an answer but I urge Non-Muslims to look around And observe Muslims....Do they act unfriendly?Is there something about them that can be named terroristic?Now if there are some bad ones...arent bad people everywhere?Why picking on a Religion?Why not simply neutrally on the Person?

Look,The story from the last days in which two planes crashed coz of the fault of a Person not having evaluated the whole situation properly and his Murder by a Man who lost his Child and Wife.He was wrong but if he would be Muslim his Name would be Terrorist.Now the worst name given to him might be lunatic,isnt it?Or the Day of Terror in Norway....he wasnt named a Terrorist.Although what he did was worse than that!

If all Non-Muslims would hold on for a while.Put down the Anti-islamic Cap they would see the difference.Islam is a Religion,a way of Life.Its not the Name of an Organisation or a Person.

 

As I said before....read the Quran.Look at the Life of our Prophet (PBUH).While doing so be neutral,give Prejudice and clichees no Chance.You ll see....Islam will show its beauty,Inshaa Allah!

 

Islam even the word in its own context means Peace and Submission.Our one and only goal in life is (or basically should be) Allahs Submission and His Happiness.May Allah guide everyone to the Real and Only Path,May He bless us with strenght and Patience!Ameen!

 

And adding to the real Topic:

Alhamdolillah I have seen manyyyy women in Hijab here.I love when we greet each other by saying Salam.Its such an incredible nice feeling.

There is also a planned Ummah Day here.Im eagerly waiting for it....!=)

.

You must be living in OZ. Its a well known fact that christians are treated poorly in pakistan and egypt and saudia arabia and iran . We all know there are Islamist fascists out there recruiting muslim youth to fight the infidel. You have a lot of foolish westerners fooled beause they are so afraid of their own thoughts that they feel if they say anything negative about Islam, they'll offend. To them, this is the worst possible crime. If this silly political correctness is not stopped now, you will get your wish, and the west wil become Islamified 100 years from now. Freedom and free speech will die.

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what do you mean by "Islamified"???

 

you seem to forget the number of fascists groups on the other side, no one supports these groups but how can one not see a problem that exists on both sides.

 

We are a nation of over 1 Billion, yet we are constantly judged based on a very very very small percentage. why cannot the west judge us based on our majority.

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what do you mean by "Islamified"???

 

you seem to forget the number of fascists groups on the other side, no one supports these groups but how can one not see a problem that exists on both sides.

 

We are a nation of over 1 Billion, yet we are constantly judged based on a very very very small percentage. why cannot the west judge us based on our majority.

 

The majority of you don't speak up enough against the Islamofacists. They are the public face of your religion. It makes us not trust Islam. We are waiting for you to join us in denouncing them. In the west there are brave muslims who speak out against these people and they receive death threats all the time. . There is a very large group of people calling themselves muslims. They say they speak for your religion. They are funded by the saudis and their form of Islam. They threaten peoples lives when Islam is critisized. They call for the destruction of israel and the west. We are infidels to them and they are definitely a political movement. They want the world to fall under Islam. We see and hear them because they yell the loudest This is just common knowledge. Optics are eveything.

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what do you mean by "Islamified"???

 

you seem to forget the number of fascists groups on the other side, no one supports these groups but how can one not see a problem that exists on both sides.

 

We are a nation of over 1 Billion, yet we are constantly judged based on a very very very small percentage. why cannot the west judge us based on our majority.

 

The majority of you don't speak up enough against the Islamofacists. They are the public face of your religion. It makes us not trust Islam. We are waiting for you to join us in denouncing them. In the west there are brave muslims who speak out against these people and they receive death threats all the time. . There is a very large group of people calling themselves muslims. They say they speak for your religion. They are funded by the saudis and their form of Islam. They threaten peoples lives when Islam is critisized. They call for the destruction of israel and the west. We are infidels to them and they are definitely a political movement. They want the world to fall under Islam. We see and hear them because they yell the loudest This is just common knowledge. Optics are eveything.

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Your reply does not actually answer the question i put to you, instead you have replied with the rhetoric of a person who goes off on what the dail mail writes about.

 

1) Muslims have gone BLUE IN THE FACE denouncing acts of terrorism, but guess what that does not sell stories and so it blocked out from the mainstream. here is something you can ask any muslim about their views on terrorism and see what they say and take that as your answer.

 

2)

There is a very large group of people calling themselves muslims. They say they speak for your religion. They are funded by the saudis and their form of Islam. They threaten peoples lives when Islam is critisized.

 

Who is this large group that you talk about, how big is their number compared to the whole muslim nation, where did you get that they get funding from the Saudi?

 

Answer these questions, you should not just go on what someone says actually investigate yourself and dont be afraid to look at the other side for answers too remember we cant be biased when forming an opinion.

 

My concern is that you have become blinded by fear, you see Islam as your enemy when it is not!!! Maybe what you need to do is stop listening to the people "Shouting loudest" and listen out to what the others have to say, just to be fair...

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what do you mean by "Islamified"???

 

you seem to forget the number of fascists groups on the other side, no one supports these groups but how can one not see a problem that exists on both sides.

 

We are a nation of over 1 Billion, yet we are constantly judged based on a very very very small percentage. why cannot the west judge us based on our majority.

 

Who are the facist groups, and exactly what is the other side?

 

Yuo are not a nation. You are a religion, a fractured one, just like Christianity. There are different Muslim sects, some moderate and some living in the dark ages. It's the harshness of your religion on certain subjects that we judge you by. We all know there are many wonderful Muslim, but we see the dark side too often. Just telling you how I and many others see it.

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By the other side, i mean the side of the spectrum. So with every right winged person you have a left winged person on the other side.

 

We are a nation, a nation is defined by people who share a common language (Arabic), belief and culture, In this definition, a nation has no physical borders.

 

It's the harshness of your religion on certain subjects that we judge you by

 

I may be incorrect in this but im guessing that you have not actually studied Islam and understood first hand from a RELIABLE Islamic teacher the rulings in Islam and how they have come about. so how then could you understand that which you do not know about? except going off the back of what sells stories in the newspapers so how can you judge based on something you do not really understand?

 

We all know there are many wonderful Muslim, but we see the dark side too often.

 

Im glad to see you write this, but do you really think that this is entirely the fault of muslims, or do you think its because it makes a good story?

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By the other side, i mean the side of the spectrum. So with every right winged person you have a left winged person on the other side.

So, are you admitting that there is a war going on between the west(christianity) and Islam?

 

 

We are a nation, a nation is defined by people who share a common language (Arabic), belief and culture, In this definition, a nation has no physical borders.

I may be incorrect in this but im guessing that you have not actually studied Islam and understood first hand from a RELIABLE Islamic teacher the rulings in Islam and how they have come about. so how then could you understand that which you do not know about? except going off the back of what sells stories in the newspapers so how can you judge based on something you do not really understand?

Im glad to see you write this, but do you really think that this is entirely the fault of muslims, or do you think its because it makes a good story?

 

The Indonesians, Iranians(Persians),Turks, Bosnians, Pakistanis, Chadians, Somalis,Bangladeshians, Malaysians,Uzbekistanians,Ugandans, Somalians. These are some of the non-arab peoples. They have nothing in common with arabs, linguistically and curturally. No you are not a nation.. There are numerous credible sources in the west. We have no illusions of the Islamist agenda. Islamo facists are our enemy. They should be your enemy too. They kill many innocent muslims.

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I am not saying there is a war, What I am saying there is now quite clearly a divide which people see when talking about Islam and the west, that is what i was reffering to.

 

You mistook my use of the word Arabic to mean that we all have an arabic culture, no, the language we all share is arabic. Muslims all over the world when they pray, they recite in arabic the verses of the Quran. They all share the celebration of EID, Hajj and Ramadan together, greet each other the same way,follow the same calender... We are quite clearly a nation.

 

Again you speak of an Islamist Agenda, please do inform me what this is?

 

There are numerous credible sources in the west.

 

who are they? Let not forget that we also had credible sources that said there were WMD's In IRAQ

 

They should be your enemy too. They kill many innocent muslims.

 

Again I will repeat, that you will find the 99.9% of muslims who will say that yes we agree with you that killing of innocent civilians is unlawful and we will stand with you united against them, regardless if the people killed are muslim or non muslim.

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Assalam o Alaikum,

 

(you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetted(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/talks/lesley_hazelton_on_reading_the_koran.html"]A Non-Muslim about reading the Quran[/url]

She just said it quite appropriately.Extremists and Islamophobes BOTH are taking quotes out of nowhere for their own Purposes!

 

Unbeliever why dont you go and study Islam!Stop listening to the manipulated Media.There are people supressed in any Part of the World in any Religion.Its just that the Media is Hyping everything against Islam.

Muslims suffer alot on the Hands of the west,there is not even ONE such Place in the west which is supressed or taken over by Muslims!Why the Uproar then??

And yes what Aladdin is calling as a Nation is actually what is called Ummah!we are one Ummah and we are tied together by our faith!:sl:

 

 

Islam in Switzerland--->On 29th of October the Anti Islamophobia and Anti Rascism Day is celebrated in Bern!On the "Bundesplatz" for all those who are interested!Come and join!=)

(you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetyoutube(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/watch?v=h62F-qvYqp8"]Invitation =)[/url]

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