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Ron Shirt

Bombings Of Christian Churches In Nigeria

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(you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetbbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-16328940"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetbbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-16328940[/url]

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I saw that, don't know much about Nigerian politics but it was disappointing to hear this.

 

 

Yes,

 

I can't see that that any sane Muslims could support this in any way.

 

Salaam,

 

ron

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Yes,

 

I can't see that that any sane Muslims could support this in any way.

 

Salaam,

 

ron

 

 

Actually 'Disapointing' would be a serious understatement, in retrospect.

I think disgusting would be nearer the mark, myself.

 

Salaam,

 

ron

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It is often the case that religion and ethnic tensions get mixed up. I am not sure religion was the sole motivating factor for these attacks. Unfortunately for Christians in that area, their religion also tends mixed with larger geo-political grievances with the West as well. I don't what motivated the group responsible for these attacks, as these three seem to all muddle together in conflicts like this.

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It is often the case that religion and ethnic tensions get mixed up. I am not sure religion was the sole motivating factor for these attacks. Unfortunately for Christians in that area, their religion also tends mixed with larger geo-political grievances with the West as well. I don't what motivated the group responsible for these attacks, as these three seem to all muddle together in conflicts like this.

 

I am unsure as to the ethnic portion of this issue. The group, Boko Haram, uses no ethnic differentiation in its warnings and goals. Here is a link to a blogspot account of Mohammad Yusuf, a prior leader of the group whom has since been arrested.

 

(you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetyusufislamicbrothers.blogspot(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetyusufislamicbrothers.blogspot(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/[/url]

 

Overall, this group cannot be good for any person, religious or non-religious, Muslim or not.

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They do seem very odd. (you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetyusufislamicbrothers.blogspot(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/2011/06/fatwa-is-hereby-placed-on-nyeri-debbie.html"]A fatwa for a facebook posting[/url]?

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It is often the case that religion and ethnic tensions get mixed up. I am not sure religion was the sole motivating factor for these attacks. Unfortunately for Christians in that area, their religion also tends mixed with larger geo-political grievances with the West as well. I don't what motivated the group responsible for these attacks, as these three seem to all muddle together in conflicts like this.

 

 

I don't think any 'motive' whatsoever could justify the bombing of a church, a Masjid or any place of worship, quite honestly.

 

Doesn't this just go to show how standards have fallen to below zero in this modern age we live in?

 

Perhaps the bombing of a supermarket would be more acceptable, although in another way of looking at it might be less 'effective'.

 

Salaam

 

ron

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It is sad and disgusting that this should happen at a time when Christians are celebrating one of their holiest days.

 

Sadly, those who have an agenda against Islam will just use this as another missile to use against the already tirade of abuse.

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None can create a book like this. It is the Book with ALLAAH( ELOHiym- God) on His Throne wherein is the Qur'aan (which is the book of the seven seals.)

 

 

It is sad and disgusting that this should happen at a time when Christians are celebrating one of their holiest days.

 

Sadly, those who have an agenda against Islam will just use this as another missile to use against the already tirade of abuse.

 

Shouldn't the Muslims who are against such acts make a stronger stand, attempt a peaceful jihad against those who will kill innocent people and those who preach such actions? Occasionally I personally see a Muslim on Western news trying to clarify, but the message is for non-Muslims, not for those who like to blow things up. I am probably just missing it, but does anyone have any example of Muslims with a direct stance against the killers? Any link would be nice.

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Doesn't this just go to show how standards have fallen to below zero in this modern age we live in?

Actually, I think it just shows how little standards have improved in this modern age we live in. I don't believe humans were much better in the past.

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but the message is for non-Muslims, not for those who like to blow things up. I am probably just missing it, but does anyone have any example of Muslims with a direct stance against the killers? Any link would be nice.

I have heard plenty of Muslims, here in this forum and on the news condemning such attacks as these. The problem isn't that peaceful Muslims are silent, but that the ones "who like to blow things up" don't care what these Muslims have to say, and invent a variety of reasons to both excuse their behavior and ignore these moderate voices.

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Then we also have the fact that what's more delicious for the media. Peaceful Muslims or Muslims the stir up terror and violence? The only news channel I have seen showing Muslims standing up against the violence is Al Jazeera.

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Then we also have the fact that what's more delicious for the media. Peaceful Muslims or Muslims the stir up terror and violence? The only news channel I have seen showing Muslims standing up against the violence is Al Jazeera.

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Teckni- there have been condemnations. There have been fatwas from scholars condemning all forms of terrorist acts.

 

As Sad Clown rightly says, condemnation happens and will continue to happen- be it on here or on a larger scale. However, FOX tv is not going to broadcast this and neither is CNN or any mainstream news agency. You're right on seeing some of this on Al JAzeerah which of course will try to show accurate news that sometimes also shows GOOD things done by Muslims.

 

Also, we also need to ask why is it expected that Muslims come out and apologise or condemn- there are others who commit terrorist acts but you don't get Muslims in general going around asking Christians to apologise (say, for the crimes of the recent Norway mass murderer Anders Behring Breivik).

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Teckni- there have been condemnations. There have been fatwas from scholars condemning all forms of terrorist acts.

 

As Sad Clown rightly says, condemnation happens and will continue to happen- be it on here or on a larger scale. However, FOX tv is not going to broadcast this and neither is CNN or any mainstream news agency. You're right on seeing some of this on Al JAzeerah which of course will try to show accurate news that sometimes also shows GOOD things done by Muslims.

 

Also, we also need to ask why is it expected that Muslims come out and apologise or condemn- there are others who commit terrorist acts but you don't get Muslims in general going around asking Christians to apologise (say, for the crimes of the recent Norway mass murderer Anders Behring Breivik).

 

 

Salam.

 

I think you misunderstood me brother. I know that there have been fatwas and condemnations by Muslims. I was saying that the media selectively put whatever they want on the news just like you are saying.

Edited by Teckni

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Apologies- in my rush I probably did not pick up on your point.

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Teckni- there have been condemnations. There have been fatwas from scholars condemning all forms of terrorist acts.

 

As Sad Clown rightly says, condemnation happens and will continue to happen- be it on here or on a larger scale. However, FOX tv is not going to broadcast this and neither is CNN or any mainstream news agency. You're right on seeing some of this on Al JAzeerah which of course will try to show accurate news that sometimes also shows GOOD things done by Muslims.

 

Also, we also need to ask why is it expected that Muslims come out and apologise or condemn- there are others who commit terrorist acts but you don't get Muslims in general going around asking Christians to apologise (say, for the crimes of the recent Norway mass murderer Anders Behring Breivik).

 

 

I think that the mere fact that you think that these people are Muslims at all says a lot. Never mind Fox TV or CNN.

It is ridiculous for you to align the killings in Norway with with Christianity.

Let's be honest here.

 

ron

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I have heard plenty of Muslims, here in this forum and on the news condemning such attacks as these. The problem isn't that peaceful Muslims are silent, but that the ones "who like to blow things up" don't care what these Muslims have to say, and invent a variety of reasons to both excuse their behavior and ignore these moderate voices.

 

I think this is true. You also have to take into account that there are Muslims who blow up Muslims. This makes speaking out against the murder much harder in those countries because you might very reasonably end up dead as well. Even for people who are far removed from murderers it is hard to make a difference due to a lot of reasons. Firstly, it isn't even sure that if you protest peacefully that your protest will get media coverage. Secondly, the likelyhood that a person in a country such as Nigeria will hear it is quite low.

 

You have also have to take into account a lot of factors like the ongoing plight of the Muslims in Afghanistan, Palestine, Iraq and other countries. As long as this continues, I think you cannot eradicate radicalism. Why? Because some of this people, and arguably most of them at least to some degree, do these things because the Muslims are persecuted. They see Christians (for example, Americans) kill Muslims in another country so they will retaliate by killing Christians in their own country. I am not defending these people. I just want to point out the mentality.

 

I think you also have to take into account the current global economic situation. When the economy is not doing good, violence escalates. Thus what is clear is that the situation is quite complex. It isn't as simple as making a stand or attempting a peaceful jihad or something like that.

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Also, we also need to ask why is it expected that Muslims come out and apologise or condemn- there are others who commit terrorist acts but you don't get Muslims in general going around asking Christians to apologise (say, for the crimes of the recent Norway mass murderer Anders Behring Breivik).

I think its a necessity that Muslims condemn acts like this and not for the sake of non muslims but for the sake of the muslim community. Younger muslims should not be influenced by these things and it should not be seen as something part of Islam. Prophet Muhammad (pbuh)did not teach us to bomb churches so I don't see why we should not speak out against it since we speak out against other things that Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) did not encourage. Also I do not know who was killed but there may have been innocent children and this is just completely unacceptable and goes against Islam.

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Then we also have the fact that what's more delicious for the media. Peaceful Muslims or Muslims the stir up terror and violence? The only news channel I have seen showing Muslims standing up against the violence is Al Jazeera.

Violence, of any kind and from any perpetrator, always attracts more attention. It is simply not considered newsworthy to report on a family happily living with their neighbors, contributing to their community, and living a peaceful life.

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Salam.

 

I think you misunderstood me brother. I know that there have been fatwas and condemnations by Muslims. I was saying that the media selectively put whatever they want on the news just like you are saying.

 

This goes to every other religion.

 

Novus Ordo Seclorum---New Secular Order.....no god/s needed...

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This goes to every other religion.

 

Novus Ordo Seclorum---New Secular Order.....no god/s needed...

Seclorum doesn't mean secular, it means "a race, generation, age, the people of any time" and is genitive plural. See for yourself:

 

(you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetperseus.tufts.edu/hopper/morph?l=seclorum&la=la"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetperseus.tufts.edu/hopper/morph?...lorum&la=la[/url]

 

Secular is derived from it since it was used to mean the present age (as opposed to eternity). This meaning was further refined to anything of this world and worldly as opposed to things of eternity (like religion and god).

 

Here is the etymology from dictionary(contact admin if its a beneficial link):

Origin:

1250–1300; < Medieval Latin sēculāris, Late Latin saeculāris worldly, temporal (opposed to eternal), Latin: of an age, equivalent to Latin saecul ( um ) long period of time + -āris -ar

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The situation in Nigeria seems to have escalted since the bombings during Christmas:

 

(you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetreuters(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/article/2011/12/28/us-nigeria-school-bomb-idUSTRE7BR0CM20111228"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetreuters(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/article/2011/12/28/...E7BR0CM20111228[/url]

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The situation in Nigeria seems to have escalted since the bombings during Christmas:

 

(you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetreuters(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/article/2011/12/28/us-nigeria-school-bomb-idUSTRE7BR0CM20111228"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetreuters(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/article/2011/12/28/...E7BR0CM20111228[/url]

What is the goal of Boko Haram? Do they want an escalation of the conflict? Wikipedia says they want to impose Sharia law for the entire country. They also seem to oppose anything that is perceived as Western, although it isn't clear if a ban on Western clothing and ideas is also part of their goal. Why would they want to impose Sharia on areas of Nigeria that aren't primarily Muslim?

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