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Do You Believe In Magic?

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Good idea. Now explain again why you believe in magic?

 

Which magic are you referring to? Be specific..

 

 

Btw the default choice is not disbelief.. Its called "pursuit"... If you don't believe me, then be around kids and you will wonder about some of the questions they ask..

Each individual will have a different end, its based on when they call off their pursuit..

Edited by Mercyonmankind

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Which magic are you referring to? Be specific..

Btw the default choice is not disbelief.. Its called "pursuit"... If you don't believe me, then be around kids and you will wonder about some of the questions they ask..

Each individual will have a different end and call of his/her pursuit....

I am referring to the magic you believe in, as implied in the question.

As for the second part, did you not read my rant? Pursuit has nothing to do with that. You can consider pursuit of evidence for claims to be good, but like I said, unless that evidence is found, the default state is disbelief.

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I am referring to the magic you believe in, as implied in the question.

As for the second part, did you not read my rant? Pursuit has nothing to do with that. You can consider pursuit of evidence for claims to be good, but like I said, unless that evidence is found, the default state is disbelief.

 

 

I believe in not just magic, but beyond that.. So be specific about magic.. Example what do you call magic?

I don't want to give you wrong answer, so I need some clarification before i tell you what i believe in..

Your description of magic is not clear..

 

btw default state is not disbelief... Google what disbelief mean.. 5 years old with disbelief, hmm lol..Certainly default state is not disbelief..

Edited by Mercyonmankind

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I believe in not just magic, but beyond that.. So be specific about magic.. Example what do you call magic?

I don't want to give you wrong answer, so I need some clarification before i tell you what i believe in..

Your description of magic is not clear..

 

btw default state is not disbelief... Google what disbelief mean.. 5 years old with disbelief, hmm lol..Certainly default state is not disbelief..

 

I am referring to magic as referenced in the Quran and Hadith. For example, the prophet once had black magic done on him. I consider magic to be anything where people believe chanting or saying/doing something will cause improbable or impossible events to occur despite laws of nature. I do not think that is important. It doesn't matter what you consider magic, because I do not believe any of it. I would like to know why you believe in ANY magic.

 

As for the disbelief part, let's not try to avoid the question by using semantics. The default state should be refusing to believe extraordinary claims, unless extraordinary evidence is presented. Now that you cannot get out of it by using semantics, please actually answer the question.

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I am referring to magic as referenced in the Quran and Hadith. For example, the prophet once had black magic done on him. I consider magic to be anything where people believe chanting or saying/doing something will cause improbable or impossible events to occur despite laws of nature. I do not think that is important. It doesn't matter what you consider magic, because I do not believe any of it. I would like to know why you believe in ANY magic.

 

As for the disbelief part, let's not try to avoid the question by using semantics. The default state should be refusing to believe extraordinary claims, unless extraordinary evidence is presented. Now that you cannot get out of it by using semantics, please actually answer the question.

 

 

Well the reason I believe that black magic exist is because it was done on my mother and also it was done on prophet pbuh and also God confirms that it exist and we should seek refuge with Him from it..

A close relative of mine did a black magic on my mother and other family members, but my brother and my cousin found it and they opened it.. There it was written that such person should obey such person like a donkey obey his/her master, and such person daughter/son of such should suffer and die slowly.... During this time my mother was not feeling well and doctor told her that she has appendix.. Well i scanned the black magic script and send it off to Pakistan to my aunty to ask a scholar that what it is..

 

She took it to a person who does black magic and that guy told her that this is one of the worst black magic that can be done.. So my mother asked for it to be removed/undone.. So this person removed it... After a while my cousin and brother got depressed for few months and my mother condition got worst.. So we took her to an emergency department and doctor found that her appendix has turned into cancer, but thanks to God that it wasn't too late.. Surgery was carried out immediately to stop the cancer spreading.... Thanks to God my mother is fine now since the surgery was done 5 years go.

The surprising part is that the hard copy of script disappeared as well the digital copy of it, i checked it everywhere, but failed to find it.....

 

The black magic is done by an individual who becomes jealous of someone happiness, wealth, children etc.. Its just that they can't see someone being happy...

 

Anyway this is my experience....

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Well the reason I believe that black magic exist is because it was done on my mother and also it was done on prophet pbuh and also God confirms that it exist and we should seek refuge with Him from it..

A close relative of mine did a black magic on my mother and other family members, but my brother and my cousin found it and they opened it.. There it was written that such person should obey such person like a donkey obey his/her master, and such person daughter/son of such should suffer and die slowly.... During this time my mother was not feeling well and doctor told her that she has appendix.. Well i scanned the black magic script and send it off to Pakistan to my aunty to ask a scholar that what it is..

 

She took it to a person who does black magic and that guy told her that this is one of the worst black magic that can be done.. So my mother asked for it to be removed/undone.. So this person removed it... After a while my cousin and brother got depressed for few months and my mother condition got worst.. So we took her to an emergency department and doctor found that her appendix has turned into cancer, but thanks to God that it wasn't too late.. Surgery was carried out immediately to stop the cancer spreading.... Thanks to God my mother is fine now since the surgery was done 5 years go.

The surprising part is that the hard copy of script disappeared as well the digital copy of it, i checked it everywhere, but failed to find it.....

 

The black magic is done by an individual who becomes jealous of someone happiness, wealth, children etc.. Its just that they can't see someone being happy...

 

Anyway this is my experience....

"It was done on my mother" - a natural event that was exaggerated, like lizards being seen as Jinn. Of course, your account will include supernatural fabrications, which is always a problem with trying to make these types of claims. Tell me, when it was done on your mother, did you already believe in magic because of Islam, or did you at least know you were supposed to believe in it because of Islam?

 

The story is completely natural! Your mother developed a disease and that is sad. But because you already believed supernatural nonsense, you immediately started explaining it using unnecessarily supernatural claims.

 

Now let me try:

Your mother got sick. A bunch of people that believe in magic convinced you and your mother that it was magic!! And then the "magic" was removed. But since there really was no magic, this didn't make a difference. What was really happening was that your mother's disease was worsening. MONTHS later, your mother had to go to the doctor and the doctors (not God) stopped the cancer from spreading. Then, looking back, being superstitious people, you decided that it really was magic, just that it took a very long time plus real medical support to actually wear away.

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"It was done on my mother" - a natural event that was exaggerated, like lizards being seen as Jinn. Of course, your account will include supernatural fabrications, which is always a problem with trying to make these types of claims. Tell me, when it was done on your mother, did you already believe in magic because of Islam, or did you at least know you were supposed to believe in it because of Islam?

 

The story is completely natural! Your mother developed a disease and that is sad. But because you already believed supernatural nonsense, you immediately started explaining it using unnecessarily supernatural claims.

 

Now let me try:

Your mother got sick. A bunch of people that believe in magic convinced you and your mother that it was magic!! And then the "magic" was removed. But since there really was no magic, this didn't make a difference. What was really happening was that your mother's disease was worsening. MONTHS later, your mother had to go to the doctor and the doctors (not God) stopped the cancer from spreading. Then, looking back, being superstitious people, you decided that it really was magic, just that it took a very long time plus real medical support to actually wear away.

 

 

Well, you stick to your belief and I will stick to my belief.. . I can't make you believe in what I believe.. So asta la vista...

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Well, you stick to your belief and I will stick to my belief.. . I can't make you believe in what I believe.. So asta la vista...

 

Sure, but if Muslims are gonna tell me I'm going to Hell, they better back up all of their extraordinary claims, magic included.

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Sure, but if Muslims are gonna tell me I'm going to Hell, they better back up all of their extraordinary claims, magic included.

 

 

NOT MUSLIM IT IS GOD WHO TELLS YOU THAT IF YOU DIE AS ATHEIST FOR SURE, FOR SURE, YOU ARE GOING TO HELL, but remember God also says that every human soul can repent to God before death and God will accept your repetance if you are sincere then you have to follow his book and prophets.

 

If you stay as atheists you are at great risk man, without realising it, angel of death can come to you every second, ARE YOU READY TO JEOPARDIZE YOURSELF ??? WHAT IF THIS IS THE TRUTH WHAT QURAN SAYS AND YOU DONT BELIEVE IN IT, I HAVE PROVIDED YOU EVIDENCE THAT QURAN IS FROM GOD, UP TO YOU KNOW TO SEE WHAT YOU SHALL BELIEVE.

 

 

We have all evidence we can get to start to believe in God, to is not a blind belief, we muslims allways have to see evidence before we believe in something, not like christians, "just believe, a dont ask, why and how, just dont ask"...

 

When it comes to magic, i know what magic is, and i will explain it to you, if you think magic like disney magic in cartoon, THEN NOOOOOO, BUT..

 

when it comes to magic , real magic is what we call SIHR (black magic, woodoo , and stuff like that), i have seen with my own eyes when people are hit by magic...then that magic really exists, but magic is evil, just to harm people.

 

You can test yourself if you are hit by magic, or if jinns are inside your body, just listen to Sura Baqarah in quran, Chapter Cow, then you will see if something happens, you can feel some stuff...

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NOT MUSLIM IT IS GOD WHO TELLS YOU THAT IF YOU DIE AS ATHEIST FOR SURE, FOR SURE, YOU ARE GOING TO HELL, but remember God also says that every human soul can repent to God before death and God will accept your repetance if you are sincere then you have to follow his book and prophets.

 

If you stay as atheists you are at great risk man, without realising it, angel of death can come to you every second, ARE YOU READY TO JEOPARDIZE YOURSELF ??? WHAT IF THIS IS THE TRUTH WHAT QURAN SAYS AND YOU DONT BELIEVE IN IT, I HAVE PROVIDED YOU EVIDENCE THAT QURAN IS FROM GOD, UP TO YOU KNOW TO SEE WHAT YOU SHALL BELIEVE.

We have all evidence we can get to start to believe in God, to is not a blind belief, we muslims allways have to see evidence before we believe in something, not like christians, "just believe, a dont ask, why and how, just dont ask"...

 

When it comes to magic, i know what magic is, and i will explain it to you, if you think magic like disney magic in cartoon, THEN NOOOOOO, BUT..

 

when it comes to magic , real magic is what we call SIHR (black magic, woodoo , and stuff like that), i have seen with my own eyes when people are hit by magic...then that magic really exists, but magic is evil, just to harm people.

 

You can test yourself if you are hit by magic, or if jinns are inside your body, just listen to Sura Baqarah in quran, Chapter Cow, then you will see if something happens, you can feel some stuff...

 

YOU are a MUSLIM, and YOU are telling me that I am going to Hell. I don't believe in a God, so obviously you saying God is telling me makes as much sense as me telling you Mario is telling you to go to sleep.

 

"not like christians" ...rubbish. Christians say "not like muslims". These are words. The question is simple. WHAT is your evidence? The claim of a supernatural God is so extraordinary that the evidence must be equally extraordinary. I am an ex-muslim. I am familiar with the Quran and Hadith and Sunnahs. They are not to any degree sufficient to justify the extraordinary claims.

 

Your description of magic is shockingly vague. It allows for any unusual but NATURAL event to be classified as magic, with supernatural twists like Jinn. What is your EVIDENCE that magic is real? Do you know some people that can do magic? Or is everyone in the world that believes in magic just assuming that someone else does it?

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Magic? Do you mean "miracle" instead? :sl: Or "magick"?

 

Okay, first of all, magic(k) really exists. God created the Universe and everything in it in as a part of energy. So magic is simply, a form of energy. I live in Java and it's very common to see people especially in primitive villages, including muslim mysticists doing stuff like magic(k), clairvoyance, and astral travel. Just think of it, even supernatural creatures like jinn or angel has their own energy dimension. And so as magick. the reason magick is haraam in Islam is (in my humble opinion) because it's done through the assistance of jinns or other supernatural entities and they usually would demand you to worship them alongside Allah (which is called "shirk") or telling you to commit sins to perfecting the magic, i.e. sacrificing human, drinking blood, worshipping the jinns, etc.

 

If you want the EVIDENCE, come yourself to Indonesia. Come to popular places where people literally asked to jinns for wealth, and see them yourself what they do, the wealth they truly acquired that way, and what tragic death they experienced. I know, because I've seen it myself.

 

The Universe is much more vast than what human's senses could ever perceived.

 

Sorry for being off-topic. But to atheism101 : I respect every choice of your faith. Muslims or Christians might say your place is hell because you "dis-believe", but

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Magic? Do you mean "miracle" instead? :sl: Or "magick"?

 

Okay, first of all, magic(k) really exists. God created the Universe and everything in it in as a part of energy. So magic is simply, a form of energy. I live in Java and it's very common to see people especially in primitive villages, including muslim mysticists doing stuff like magic(k), clairvoyance, and astral travel. Just think of it, even supernatural creatures like jinn or angel has their own energy dimension. And so as magick. the reason magick is haraam in Islam is (in my humble opinion) because it's done through the assistance of jinns or other supernatural entities and they usually would demand you to worship them alongside Allah (which is called "shirk") or telling you to commit sins to perfecting the magic, i.e. sacrificing human, drinking blood, worshipping the jinns, etc.

 

If you want the EVIDENCE, come yourself to Indonesia. Come to popular places where people literally asked to jinns for wealth, and see them yourself what they do, the wealth they truly acquired that way, and what tragic death they experienced. I know, because I've seen it myself.

 

The Universe is much more vast than what human's senses could ever perceived.

 

Sorry for being off-topic. But to atheism101 : I respect every choice of your faith. Muslims or Christians might say your place is hell because you "dis-believe", but

 

Someone already tried "come to Pakistan" until I told them I'm from Pakistan. I'm not gonna travel the world, one example is sufficient to support my point. And why is magic less common where there is more video recording, for example?

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YOU are a MUSLIM, and YOU are telling me that I am going to Hell. I don't believe in a God, so obviously you saying God is telling me makes as much sense as me telling you Mario is telling you to go to sleep.

 

"not like christians" ...rubbish. Christians say "not like muslims". These are words. The question is simple. WHAT is your evidence? The claim of a supernatural God is so extraordinary that the evidence must be equally extraordinary. I am an ex-muslim. I am familiar with the Quran and Hadith and Sunnahs. They are not to any degree sufficient to justify the extraordinary claims.

 

Your description of magic is shockingly vague. It allows for any unusual but NATURAL event to be classified as magic, with supernatural twists like Jinn. What is your EVIDENCE that magic is real? Do you know some people that can do magic? Or is everyone in the world that believes in magic just assuming that someone else does it?

 

 

 

 

YOU are a MUSLIM, and YOU are telling me that I am going to Hell. I don't believe in a God, so obviously you saying God is telling me makes as much sense as me telling you Mario is telling you to go to sleep.

 

maybe in future you become a great muslim, and you enter paradise, and maybe i do something wrong, wich puts me in hell after i die, you never know, God only knows these stuff

 

But tell me something, if you stay in front of God after your death, what do you expect to enter, paradise or hell, after you know that you neglected God whole life and died as atheist? what should you expect?

 

 

 

WHAT is your evidence? The claim of a supernatural God is so extraordinary that the evidence must be equally extraordinary

 

reasons au puted from nature, and scientific information in quran is evidence of existence of God.

 

 

 

Your description of magic is shockingly vague. It allows for any unusual but NATURAL event to be classified as magic, with supernatural twists like Jinn. What is your EVIDENCE that magic is real? Do you know some people that can do magic? Or is everyone in the world that believes in magic just assuming that someone else does it?

 

do you know what the exorcism is man, i can do exorcism both to myself and other people, i have seen and feel stuff wich you only can see in TV, hollywood movies, i know what i am talkning about....

 

so magic does exists, but black magic, like woodoo and stuff like that, yes, of course.

 

do you want to test yourself? if you are doubtful what i am saying, if you have jinns, or are hited by black magic (sihr)

 

you should listen shut your eyes, calm down, relax and concetrate you on the recitation of surah baqarah

 

 

and tell me if you feeled anything in yourbody..

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Someone already tried "come to Pakistan" until I told them I'm from Pakistan. I'm not gonna travel the world, one example is sufficient to support my point. And why is magic less common where there is more video recording, for example?

 

wow, I'm curious about the part of Pakistan that person mentioned LOL :sl:. I haven't checked Youtube yet to find the video you meant. But how about going to some Wiccan or neopagan forum where magick is their common practice? Just a tip :sl: I never insist you to travel to INA, lol. Were I'm in your shoes, I won't waste my time to travel too only to see magick. :no:

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maybe in future you become a great muslim, and you enter paradise, and maybe i do something wrong, wich puts me in hell after i die, you never know, God only knows these stuff

 

But tell me something, if you stay in front of God after your death, what do you expect to enter, paradise or hell, after you know that you neglected God whole life and died as atheist? what should you expect?

reasons au puted from nature, and scientific information in quran is evidence of existence of God.

do you know what the exorcism is man, i can do exorcism both to myself and other people, i have seen and feel stuff wich you only can see in TV, hollywood movies, i know what i am talkning about....

 

so magic does exists, but black magic, like woodoo and stuff like that, yes, of course.

 

do you want to test yourself? if you are doubtful what i am saying, if you have jinns, or are hited by black magic (sihr)

 

you should listen shut your eyes, calm down, relax and concetrate you on the recitation of surah baqarah

 

 

and tell me if you feeled anything in yourbody..

 

This is about the tenth time on this website that someone has tried presenting two options, subtly suggesting that they are equally likely. It is very unlikely that I will die Muslim, and it is very unlikely that you will die non-Muslim. "Possible" does not equate to "equally likely" or even slightly likely.

 

"If you stay in front of God after your death..." so you are trying to SCARE me into believing? I'm not a two year old.

I would surely expect that a God that fully understands me and had full knowledge of my thought processes would not put me in Hell. YOU might think I'm destined for Hell, but if God exists, I highly doubt that any Hell would exist, and even if it did, I would seriously question the character of this "God" if He threw me into Hell for eternity. How could a God that loves me more than 70 mothers throw me in hell? That's insane. If he still threw me in Hell, I would consider him nothing less of a tyrant, and I would prefer pain to eternally worshiping him like a coward.

 

 

Feeling something is not a way to rational conclusion. Mingling with the opposite gender "feels" good, if not better. So according to your reasoning method that MUST be a good thing, right?

 

So do you know how to do magic? I challenge you to get a Jinn to possess a famous person - really no problem for a Jinn, and the publicity of this event will destroy atheism for good! Yeh right, your claims about magic are just as credible as me saying I jumped off the Sears Tower twice and lived both times. Unless you have any evidence to back up your supernatural claims, I won't buy them. Will you buy my story if I say I flew to Disney Land on a dragon?

 

do you know what the exorcism is man, i can do exorcism both to myself and other people, i have seen and feel stuff wich you only can see in TV, hollywood movies, i know what i am talkning about....

 

Do you know what the dragon is man? I can fly dragons by myself and with other people, I have seen and felt stuff which you can only see on TV and movies! I know what I am talking about...

 

 

wow, I'm curious about the part of Pakistan that person mentioned LOL :sl:. I haven't checked Youtube yet to find the video you meant. But how about going to some Wiccan or neopagan forum where magick is their common practice? Just a tip :sl: I never insist you to travel to INA, lol. Were I'm in your shoes, I won't waste my time to travel too only to see magick. :no:

 

You should be able to find it in an earlier post - it was a poster saying something very similar to what you said, except "Pakistan" instead of Indonesia. You should read my reply to that post seeing as it pretty much addresses you as well.

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do what you want, and believe what you want...and we will see what will happen after when we all die...but it will be to late to change yourself....

 

if Quran can not change your mind , nothing can :sl:

 

here is quran in english, read it again with open heart and mind...

 

(you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetislam101(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/quran/yusufAli/index.htm"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetislam101(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/quran/yusufAli/index.htm[/url]

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do what you want, and believe what you want...and we will see what will happen after when we all die...but it will be to late to change yourself....

 

if Quran can not change your mind , nothing can :sl:

 

here is quran in english, read it again with open heart and mind...

 

(you are not allowed to post links yet)"you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetislam101(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/quran/yusufAli/index.htm"]you can't post links until you reach 50 posts_you are not allowed to post links yetislam101(contact admin if its a beneficial link)/quran/yusufAli/index.htm[/url]

 

Heh, except we WON'T see what will happen after we die, because we will cease to exist. Don't try to scare me into believing. I'm not a 2 year old. I've read a good portion of the Quran. Nothing in particular has stood out. I may end up reading the whole thing, but it is not up to me to read every religious book ever written to make sure there isn't a hint of miracle in there. The extraordinary claims of the Quran simply have no extraordinary evidence, and surely in my study of the Quran I would have encountered the strongest points. Seeing as I am yet to be convinced, I am certain there is really not much more the Quran can offer as an argument.

 

So the Quran hasn't given me a good argument. Guess that means nothing can.

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Heh, except we WON'T see what will happen after we die, because we will cease to exist. Don't try to scare me into believing. I'm not a 2 year old. I've read a good portion of the Quran. Nothing in particular has stood out. I may end up reading the whole thing, but it is not up to me to read every religious book ever written to make sure there isn't a hint of miracle in there. The extraordinary claims of the Quran simply have no extraordinary evidence, and surely in my study of the Quran I would have encountered the strongest points. Seeing as I am yet to be convinced, I am certain there is really not much more the Quran can offer as an argument.

 

So the Quran hasn't given me a good argument. Guess that means nothing can.

 

 

Heh, except we WON'T see what will happen after we die, because we will cease to exist. Don't try to scare me into believing.

 

God answers to this in Quran:

 

45:26-27 They(atheists, unbelievers) say, ‘There is only our life in this world: we die, we live, nothing but time destroys us.’ They have no knowledge of this; they only follow guesswork. They only speculate.

When Our clear revelations are recited to them, their only argument is to say: "Bring our ancestors back, if what you say is true."

Say(to them muhammed): ‘Allah gives you life, then causes you to die, and then will gather you together for the Day of Resurrection about which there is no doubt. But most people do not know it.’

 

16:38-They have sworn by God with their strongest oaths that He will not raise the dead to life. Yes indeed, it is a promise binding upon Him, but most people do not know,

in order to make clear for them what they have differed about and so that the disbelievers may realize that what they said was false.

When We will something to happen, all that We say is, ‘Be,’ and it is.

 

6:29-30 They(atheists) say, ‘There is nothing beyond our life in this world: we shall not be raised from the dead.’

If you could only see, when they are made to stand before their Lord, how He(God) will say, ‘Is this not real?’

They(atheists) will say, ‘Yes indeed, by our Lord.’ He will say, ‘Then taste the punishment for having disbelieved.’

Edited by andalusi

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God answers to this in Quran:

 

45:26-27 They(atheists, unbelievers) say, ‘There is only our life in this world: we die, we live, nothing but time destroys us.’ They have no knowledge of this; they only follow guesswork. They only speculate.

When Our clear revelations are recited to them, their only argument is to say: "Bring our ancestors back, if what you say is true."

Say(to them muhammed): ‘Allah gives you life, then causes you to die, and then will gather you together for the Day of Resurrection about which there is no doubt. But most people do not know it.’

 

16:38-They have sworn by God with their strongest oaths that He will not raise the dead to life. Yes indeed, it is a promise binding upon Him, but most people do not know,

in order to make clear for them what they have differed about and so that the disbelievers may realize that what they said was false.

When We will something to happen, all that We say is, ‘Be,’ and it is.

 

6:29-30 They(atheists) say, ‘There is nothing beyond our life in this world: we shall not be raised from the dead.’

If you could only see, when they are made to stand before their Lord, how He(God) will say, ‘Is this not real?’

They(atheists) will say, ‘Yes indeed, by our Lord.’ He will say, ‘Then taste the punishment for having disbelieved.’

 

A good, well thought out argument you just made there. Oh wait, just kidding, I don't see an argument. I see a statement of the others' position, and an exclamation that they are wrong!

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Another question for magic believers: how can you prove that the prophet was a true prophet and not a magician?

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