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Numerical Miracles In The Quran, Real Evidence

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Astronomers have established that a natural 19-year cycle exists between the moon and the sun.  That is, they interact together in a cycle which takes about 19 years to complete.  Very interestingly, we find that the words “sun” and “moon” have been mentioned together exactly 19 times in the Holy Qur’an.  In other words, there are precisely 19 Qur’anic verses which contain the combined phrase “the sun and the moon”.

 

 

 

Needs checking 

 

 

Brother Andalusi   is this tru "Astronomers have established that a natural 19-year cycle exists between the moon and the sun. "

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Qur’anic and Universal Compatibility!

God Almighty is the Creator of this universe and the One who revealed the Holy Qur’an to mankind.  Therefore, it is necessary for consistency to be found between the Qur’an and the universe, and this was something that truly caught me by surprise when I came across the following profound numeric miracle.

We have already established that the moon reassumes the same form in exactly the same position every 19 years.  

 

The sun’s cycle, on the other hand, repeats itself every 11 years.  In other words, we can say that the universal cycles of the sun and moon repeat themselves every (19 x 11) years, or every 209 years.

Since the degrees of dark and light (or night and day) are determined by the sun’s solar cycle and the moon’s metonic cycle, which are represented by the numbers 11 and 19 respectively, we can also say that the cycles of night, day, the sun and the moon repeat themselves every (19 x 11) years, or every 209 years.

 

 

That being said, when we count the repetitions of the words “night”, “day”, “sun” and “moon” across the entire Qur’an, we find that they are repeated:

92 + 57 + 33 + 27 = 209 times!

 

 

And the number 209 is equal to 19 x 11.  In other words, the cycles of the night, the day, the sun and the moon take place every 209 years, and the repetition of those very four words in the Qur’an is also 209, resembling the exact number of those years!

 

this was intresting

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Astronomers have established that a natural 19-year cycle exists between the moon and the sun.  That is, they interact together in a cycle which takes about 19 years to complete.  Very interestingly, we find that the words “sun” and “moon” have been mentioned together exactly 19 times in the Holy Qur’an.  In other words, there are precisely 19 Qur’anic verses which contain the combined phrase “the sun and the moon”.

 

 

 

Needs checking 

 

 

Brother Andalusi   is this tru "Astronomers have established that a natural 19-year cycle exists between the moon and the sun. "

 

yes

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Meton of Athens is best known for calculations involving the eponymous 19-year Metonic cycle which he introduced in 432 BC into the lunisolar Attic calendar. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meton_of_Athens

 

Islam is not the first ideology to have exploited this system in an attempt to convince others of its truth.

 

You're feeding your brain nothing but confirmation bias.

Edited by Donald_M

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Meton of Athens is best known for calculations involving the eponymous 19-year Metonic cycle which he introduced in 432 BC into the lunisolar Attic calendar. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meton_of_Athens

 

Islam is not the first ideology to have exploited this system in an attempt to convince others of its truth.

 

You're feeding your brain nothing but confirmation bias.

 

 

Ok notice we are not saying the 19 yr metonic cycle is unique we r saying what are the chances sun and moon together r mentioned 19 times

 

like 365 days in yr we all know tht but whats the probability the word day is mentioned 365 times.

 

What about moon is mentioned 27 times it takes moon 2 orbit earth 27 days can u show me any1 who mentioned tht before the Quran ?

 

So u have no argument really

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It seems according to the disbelievers the author of the Quran had a library from where he got all the information from Babylonians to Sumerians to Egyptians to greeks to vikings  etc.

 

It seems according to the disbelievers the author of the Quran can speak many languages  .

 

 

lol u people are just confirming indirectly this is a  revelation.

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Yes. I am aware of what is happening, thanks... How do you know you will be a Muslim for life? The name alludes to your position of confirmation bias.

 

The Quran is not the only thing to have arrived after the discovery of the Metonic cycle, which used it's properties to produce a piece of 'magical/miracle' literature.

The Mystery of Numbers, of which I have already provided a link, has many a Quranic example inside, all of which are analysed and compared to that of other beliefs, both earlier and later than Islam.

Some belief systems use the exact same details (as you do) to scream about the fact that they are also correct... Using the same tools to arrive at an alternate truth = Inconsistency.

 

Numerology was a very popular idea for a very long time and still has its following. Although today, it is mostly reserved for astrologers and/or people you like to spend their time finding faces in clouds or patterned wallpaper.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Numerology#History

 

It seems, according to the believers, the author of the Quran was provided with all of this information and circumstantial corollary from an all powerful being. And not a single piece of information was derived from elsewhere.

It seems, according to the believers, that the author of the Quran knew very little. And even then, Aisha may have had to remember the 'details' just in case Muhammed should forget.

 

No serious post has ever been accompanied by the abbreviation LOL.

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Yes. I am aware of what is happening, thanks... How do you know you will be a Muslim for life? The name alludes to your position of confirmation bias.

 

The Quran is not the only thing to have arrived after the discovery of the Metonic cycle, which used it's properties to produce a piece of 'magical/miracle' literature.

The Mystery of Numbers, of which I have already provided a link, has many a Quranic example inside, all of which are analysed and compared to that of other beliefs, both earlier and later than Islam.

Some belief systems use the exact same details (as you do) to scream about the fact that they are also correct... Using the same tools to arrive at an alternate truth = Inconsistency.

 

Numerology was a very popular idea for a very long time and still has its following. Although today, it is mostly reserved for astrologers and/or people you like to spend their time finding faces in clouds or patterned wallpaper.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Numerology#History

 

It seems, according to the believers, the author of the Quran was provided with all of this information and circumstantial corollary from an all powerful being. And not a single piece of information was derived from elsewhere.

It seems, according to the believers, that the author of the Quran knew very little. And even then, Aisha may have had to remember the 'details' just in case Muhammed should forget.

 

No serious post has ever been accompanied by the abbreviation LOL.

 

 

 

The Mystery of Numbers, of which I have already provided a link, has many a Quranic example inside, all of which are analysed and compared to that of other beliefs, both earlier and later than Islam.

 

Post it here and we will respond .  Numerology is different from what the brother Andalusi showed from the Quran . U are bringing something irrelevant.

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Really!? If it's not numerology, do you have another word to define it (besides 'miracle')?

 

Because, in effect, you have already applied importance to the object of your examination. Like thinking of red cars and as a result, seeing many red cars...

Every single piece of 'real evidence' in this thread is a product of this very same confirmation bias. It only works for those who are prepared to ignore other data.

 

If patterns are evidence of a deity… And deviations from this pattern (miracles) are also evidence for a deity, then you've pretty much covered everything, haven't you.

 

The meat and bone of the argument is still essentially this: I believe in God, therefore God exists. Not great is it?

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Really!? If it's not numerology, do you have another word to define it (besides 'miracle')?

 

Because, in effect, you have already applied importance to the object of your examination. Like thinking of red cars and as a result, seeing many red cars...

Every single piece of 'real evidence' in this thread is a product of this very same confirmation bias. It only works for those who are prepared to ignore other data.

 

If patterns are evidence of a deity… And deviations from this pattern (miracles) are also evidence for a deity, then you've pretty much covered everything, haven't you.

 

The meat and bone of the argument is still essentially this: I believe in God, therefore God exists. Not great is it?

 

not numerology, but numerical/mathematical programing

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Yes. I am aware of what is happening, thanks... How do you know you will be a Muslim for life? The name alludes to your position of confirmation bias.

 

The Quran is not the only thing to have arrived after the discovery of the Metonic cycle, which used it's properties to produce a piece of 'magical/miracle' literature.

The Mystery of Numbers, of which I have already provided a link, has many a Quranic example inside, all of which are analysed and compared to that of other beliefs, both earlier and later than Islam.

Some belief systems use the exact same details (as you do) to scream about the fact that they are also correct... Using the same tools to arrive at an alternate truth = Inconsistency.

 

Numerology was a very popular idea for a very long time and still has its following. Although today, it is mostly reserved for astrologers and/or people you like to spend their time finding faces in clouds or patterned wallpaper.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Numerology#History

 

It seems, according to the believers, the author of the Quran was provided with all of this information and circumstantial corollary from an all powerful being. And not a single piece of information was derived from elsewhere.

It seems, according to the believers, that the author of the Quran knew very little. And even then, Aisha may have had to remember the 'details' just in case Muhammed should forget.

 

No serious post has ever been accompanied by the abbreviation LOL.

 

nobody says, Qur'an inveted metonic cycle, we only say that metonic cycle is programed in the text of the Qur'an, and that is miraclous thing since we know that quran came in recitation form in the first place then it was written down on papper.

 

not vice versa

Edited by andalusi
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'not numerology, but numerical/mathematical programing'

 

So... that's regular numerology with the help of a PC?

 

'nobody says, Qur'an inveted metonic cycle, we only say that metonic
cycle is programed in the text of the Qur'an, and that is miraclous
thing since we know that quran came in recitation form in the first
place then it was written down on papper'.

 

But it only looks like a 'miracle' because you have already decided the book to be special...

To everyone else, this is a coincidence or an attempt to add credence to an idea.

Not to mention that the most recent examples I have seen, are calendar and language specific.

 

Additionally, I have spoken to several Muslims who consider this behaviour Haram.

The act of attributing 'future truths' to the details within the Quran, is tantamount to fortune-telling (they say).

They also say that activities such as this, are a product of a Muslim not finding enough reason or cause in the texts, to wholly believe.

That is to say, the message of the Quran should be enough to convince you of the faith, and your attempts to search for additional connections, is an admittance of your uncertainty or crumbling belief.

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'not numerology, but numerical/mathematical programing'

 

So... that's regular numerology with the help of a PC?

 

'nobody says, Qur'an inveted metonic cycle, we only say that metonic

cycle is programed in the text of the Qur'an, and that is miraclous

thing since we know that quran came in recitation form in the first

place then it was written down on papper'.

 

But it only looks like a 'miracle' because you have already decided the book to be special...

To everyone else, this is a coincidence or an attempt to add credence to an idea.

Not to mention that the most recent examples I have seen, are calendar and language specific.

 

Additionally, I have spoken to several Muslims who consider this behaviour Haram.

The act of attributing 'future truths' to the details within the Quran, is tantamount to fortune-telling (they say).

They also say that activities such as this, are a product of a Muslim not finding enough reason or cause in the texts, to wholly believe.

That is to say, the message of the Quran should be enough to convince you of the faith, and your attempts to search for additional connections, is an admittance of your uncertainty or crumbling belief.

 

 

But it only looks like a 'miracle' because you have already decided the book to be special...

 

what do you mean i decide that it is special

 

is it not special by itself that word singular pure form of word Day (yewm) is metnioned 365 times , and word month in singular 12 times, just like in a year

 

how do i decide it is special , no i dont, beacuse it is special by itself, we are only seeking numerical logical patterns

 

 

 

The act of attributing 'future truths' to the details within the Quran, is tantamount to fortune-telling (they say).

 

not true, we dont use that or say that, we dont predict with the quran stuff wich will happen, we are only detecting programmed stuff wich already occured. that is huge difference.

 

 

 

That is to say, the message of the Quran should be enough to convince you of the faith, and your attempts to search for additional connections, is an admittance of your uncertainty or crumbling belief.

 

you dont know actually what we are talking about nor do you know what more proofs do we have tha tquran is from God and not from anyone else.

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The Quran is your holy book. You consider it special in this regard.

 

I have several Muslim friends who are against the idea of searching for 'proofs' within the world or the Quran,

as they consider Islam to be all about faith and not something that can be proven.

 

Your attempts to find and prove such things (they say) is evidence of your inability to be satisfied by faith alone.

 

we are only detecting programmed stuff wich already occured

 

Okay. So... You wait for something to happen and then prove the Quran knew all about it by pointing to the number 19 or 42 or whatever the case?

...But in no circumstance (you say) do you feel that the Quran contains information that reflects future events. Is this your position?

 

Is this numerology with the help of a PC?

 

Thanks.

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The Quran is your holy book. You consider it special in this regard.

 

I have several Muslim friends who are against the idea of searching for 'proofs' within the world or the Quran,

as they consider Islam to be all about faith and not something that can be proven.

 

Your attempts to find and prove such things (they say) is evidence of your inability to be satisfied by faith alone.

 

we are only detecting programmed stuff wich already occured

 

Okay. So... You wait for something to happen and then prove the Quran knew all about it by pointing to the number 19 or 42 or whatever the case?

...But in no circumstance (you say) do you feel that the Quran contains information that reflects future events. Is this your position?

 

Is this numerology with the help of a PC?

 

Thanks.

 

 

 

The Quran is your holy book. You consider it special in this regard.

 

no, for me it is special ebacuse i see evidence that it is special, not blind beleif that it is special

 

 

I have several Muslim friends who are against the idea of searching for 'proofs' within the world or the Quran,

as they consider Islam to be all about faith and not something that can be proven.

 

But God himself said in the Quran he will show proofs in universe and nature taht Quran is his book and your "muslim" friends say opposite to what their holy book say,

 

so who shall we believe, your "muslim" friends or Quran?

 

 

 

Your attempts to find and prove such things (they say) is evidence of your inability to be satisfied by faith alone.

 

you actually want to impose blind faith on me, that i believe in quran, without any proofs , that is just to stupid, who can have logical mind and just believe blindly?????

 

we believe in whole quran beacuse we see proof for it, we dont believe in it blindly without proof.

 

 

 

Okay. So... You wait for something to happen and then prove the Quran knew all about it by pointing to the number 19 or 42 or whatever the case?

...But in no circumstance (you say) do you feel that the Quran contains information that reflects future events. Is this your position?

 

of course it contains some future events

 

 

 

Is this numerology with the help of a PC?

 

no, i would say, PC helps us to find mathematical programing in the Quran

 

God created universe in mathematics so did he programmed his book Qur'an with mathematics

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no, for me it is special ebacuse i see evidence that it is special, not blind beleif that it is special

 

This 'evidence' has the same power of persuasion as the 'evidence' proposed by any religious denomination.

It is 'proof' for you, but to anyone else looking in, they can see that what you have is an invested faith.

 

But God himself said in the Quran he will show proofs in universe and
nature taht Quran is his book and your "muslim" friends say opposite to
what their holy book say, so who shall we believe, your "muslim" friends or Quran?

 

Hmmm. Maybe my friends aren't 'real Muslims'... They don't exhibit the urge to stone homosexuals either.

 

you actually want to impose blind faith on me, that i believe in
quran, without any proofs , that is just to stupid, who can have logical
mind and just believe blindly?????
we believe in whole quran beacuse we see proof for it, we dont believe in it blindly without proof.
 

What you refer to as 'proof' is not something that everyone else can accept as a model of 'proof'.

It is the sort of proof that the Christian or Jew may point at in an attempt to 'prove' the existence of his beliefs.

 

of course it contains some future events

 

Yes. So... You wait for something to happen and then prove the Quran knew all
about it by pointing to the number 19 or 42 or whatever the case? Thanks.

 

no, i would say, PC helps us to find mathematical programing in the Quran

God created universe in mathematics so did he programmed his book Qur'an with mathematics

 

I don't think you're fooling anyone... This is numerology with the help of a PC.

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no, for me it is special ebacuse i see evidence that it is special, not blind beleif that it is special

 

This 'evidence' has the same power of persuasion as the 'evidence' proposed by any religious denomination.

It is 'proof' for you, but to anyone else looking in, they can see that what you have is an invested faith.

 

But God himself said in the Quran he will show proofs in universe and

nature taht Quran is his book and your "muslim" friends say opposite to

what their holy book say, so who shall we believe, your "muslim" friends or Quran?

 

Hmmm. Maybe my friends aren't 'real Muslims'... They don't exhibit the urge to stone homosexuals either.

 

you actually want to impose blind faith on me, that i believe in

quran, without any proofs , that is just to stupid, who can have logical

mind and just believe blindly????? we believe in whole quran beacuse we see proof for it, we dont believe in it blindly without proof.

 

What you refer to as 'proof' is not something that everyone else can accept as a model of 'proof'.

It is the sort of proof that the Christian or Jew may point at in an attempt to 'prove' the existence of his beliefs.

 

of course it contains some future events

 

Yes. So... You wait for something to happen and then prove the Quran knew all

about it by pointing to the number 19 or 42 or whatever the case? Thanks.

 

no, i would say, PC helps us to find mathematical programing in the Quran

God created universe in mathematics so did he programmed his book Qur'an with mathematics

 

I don't think you're fooling anyone... This is numerology with the help of a PC.

 

 

This 'evidence' has the same power of persuasion as the 'evidence' proposed by any religious denomination.

It is 'proof' for you, but to anyone else looking in, they can see that what you have is an invested faith.

 

no, these are actually evidence wich can bee tested and verified

 

 

What you refer to as 'proof' is not something that everyone else can accept as a model of 'proof'.

It is the sort of proof that the Christian or Jew may point at in an attempt to 'prove' the existence of his beliefs.

 

we have several gruops of proof that Qur'an is work of God and not humans,

 

and each group may contains hundreds and even thousands of proofs

 

if i would continues to give what i know about Quran i would not finish in a month to post everything wich i consider as proof.

 

 

 

Yes. So... You wait for something to happen and then prove the Quran knew all

about it by pointing to the number 19 or 42 or whatever the case? Thanks.

 

what 19 and 42,  i dont understand that?

 

 

 

This is numerology with the help of a PC

 

ithink i have been very clear what i think it is, it is mathematyical programming of the text, and we are detecting logical numerical patterns with the help of a PC programs

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TWELVE (12) FOUNTAINS SPRINGING FROM STONE

And when Moses was looking for water for his people, We said, 'Strike the rock with your staff.' Then twelve fountains gushed out from it and all the people knew their drinking place. 'Eat and drink of Allah's provision and do not go about the earth corrupting it.' (Surat al-Baqara, 60)
 

  • Number of words in the verse until the expression "ithnata AAashrata" meaning "twelve" is 12.

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no, these are actually evidence wich can bee tested and verified

 

Yeah, I know. Tested & verified like every other example of number-play or religious 'proof'.

 

we have several gruops of proof that Qur'an is work of God and not humans,

and each group may contains hundreds and even thousands of proofs
if i would continues to give what i know about Quran i would not finish in a month to post everything wich i consider as proof.

 

If your very best example can't convince us of the miracle of the Quran, then I definitely don't want to hear you blabber on for a month about it.

Offer your most convincing 'proof' (singular), and everyone here can go through it and show you the sorts of tricks that you're playing on yourself.

 

what 19 and 42,  i dont understand that?

 

These are just examples... Hence the words 'or whatever the case'.

 

ithink i have been very clear what i think it is, it is mathematyical
programming of the text, and we are detecting logical numerical patterns
with the help of a PC programs

 

Others I have spoken to, say it is numerology, no matter how you slice it, finding proof of God in the numbers of a book is numerology...

Do you have a single word/term to describe what you are doing?

 

Thanks.

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no, these are actually evidence wich can bee tested and verified

 

Yeah, I know. Tested & verified like every other example of number-play or religious 'proof'.

 

we have several gruops of proof that Qur'an is work of God and not humans,

and each group may contains hundreds and even thousands of proofs

if i would continues to give what i know about Quran i would not finish in a month to post everything wich i consider as proof.

 

If your very best example can't convince us of the miracle of the Quran, then I definitely don't want to hear you blabber on for a month about it.

Offer your most convincing 'proof' (singular), and everyone here can go through it and show you the sorts of tricks that you're playing on yourself.

 

what 19 and 42,  i dont understand that?

 

These are just examples... Hence the words 'or whatever the case'.

 

ithink i have been very clear what i think it is, it is mathematyical

programming of the text, and we are detecting logical numerical patterns

with the help of a PC programs

 

Others I have spoken to, say it is numerology, no matter how you slice it, finding proof of God in the numbers of a book is numerology...

Do you have a single word/term to describe what you are doing?

 

Thanks.

 

 

 

 

If your very best example can't convince us of the miracle of the Quran, then I definitely don't want to hear you blabber on for a month about it.

Offer your most convincing 'proof' (singular), and everyone here can go through it and show you the sorts of tricks that you're playing on yourself.

 

we can start with this example, you dont even need to read a word from quran to see the miracle in it

 

 

look for yourself, this one is so beautiful and massive.

 

 

Golden ratio in Quran

 

 

In this example we see clearly nummerical miracle, between odd and even

numbers and how the correspond to sum of chapters and verses

25jjnmo.jpg

15gb8e8.jpg

24ys6rr.jpg

 

Here, we have repetetive

nummerical values from the table above

for example chapters 85 and 99 have

same nummerical value 107, we summerize all repetitive nummerical values

 

1z1wpyp.jpg

 

Here,

we have non-repetitive nummerical values, and we summerize them also

259j3pj.jpg

 

We can clearly

see golden ratio between Reptitive and non-repetitive nummerical values from

this table

166k5z6.jpg

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Others I have spoken to, say it is numerology, no matter how you slice it, finding proof of God in the numbers of a book is numerology...

Do you have a single word/term to describe what you are doing?

 

no it is not numerology

 

it is like numerical and numerological

 

numerical is like astronomical, while numerological is like astrological

 

is astronomy and astrology the same?, NO

 

There is a huge different with Numerologie and Numeric (Or mathematic) of the Quran.

Its like the difference between Astronomy and Astrology.

 

Numerology is giving Number meanings outside the Mathematical Meaning.

Its more Symbolic. For Example: The Word Abraham consits (English) of 7 Letters and 7 Heavens God has Created.

So thats arbrtarily meaning given to the Number without Justification.So there is a Number and a Meaning which is subjective to the own reader. (Number + Meaning) But in the Case of the Quran we have for Example Antonyms or Verses which imply similarity (Jesus and Adam).

For Example the Quran mentions Yawm (without speacial) in the Singular 365 times. The meaning is derived from the Word itself!  

Numeric : (Number) + (Meaning) = (365) + (Day)  ----> so there is no room for arbitrarily Meanings.

Numerology would be (if we stay by the Abraham example)  (Number) + (Meaning) = (7) + (Open to the Reader)  ----> Subjective

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and this example also with chapter and verse numbers

 

 
You dont even need to read anything from Quran to be convinced that this book is from God, all you need is to see how symmetrical Quran is.

What is symmetri?

Symmetri, Yes

15--16--I--16--15 or 17--17--I--14--14

Symmetri, NO

15--16--I--17--15 or this 16--14--I--7--9


Quran is symmetrical book


Odd and Even numbers
Odd and Even numbers

(Sequence number of Chapter)-(Verses)

4 combination:

odd-odd
odd-even
even-even
even
odd


example first chapter Fatiha has sequence number 1 and 7 verses,
then it is in ODD-ODD section

Look how Quran is constructed
symmetrically, Amazing
efnl0p.jpg

Homogenus are ODD-ODD, EVEN-EVEN

Non-homogenus are odd-even, even-odd

It is also
constructed simmetrically
9q90mc.jpg

Now we divide Quran in half,
first part of quran 57 chapters, and second part quran 57 chapters

even
this is also symetrical between homogenus and non-homogenus
21ajl7r.jpg


Surahs of which the number of ayats are greater than sequence number

orp640.jpg
24lokue.jpg

2vb0sgk.jpg



Surahs of which the number of ayats are smaller than sequence number

2gt9t3d.jpg

296cfir.jpg



Sequence Numbers Set and Number of Ayats Set
example: Chapter/Surah with sequence nr 3, nr of ayats/verses 3 can be found at seequence nr 108 and 110

300whtv.jpg

fnr4i8.jpg



The numbers which are divided by two and not divided by three

2r3yyk3.jpg


rbm73t.jpg


The numbers which are divided by three and not divided by two

14av4nl.jpg

359hizb.jpg


The numbers which are neither divisible by two nor by three

2d0gei0.jpg

16a2szm.jpg
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Sorry, Andalusi. I've already seen these examples.

 

But how is this proof of a god or a miracle?

How have you moved from a detail that you cannot properly explain, to arguing that 'God must have done it'?

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Sorry, Andalusi. I've already seen these examples.

 

But how is this proof of a god or a miracle?

How have you moved from a detail that you cannot properly explain, to arguing that 'God must have done it'?

 

 

 

But how is this proof of a god or a miracle?

 

 

evidence that Qur'an is from God is based upon 6 points

 

1. Scientific stuff in the Qur'an wich was discovered in our times

2. Numerical programing of the Qur'an

3. Future predictions in the Qur'an

4.Lingustic miracles of the Qur'an, linguistic structure and simmetry

5.Historical scientific proofs that Qur'an must come from God

6. Healing properties of the Qur'an, used in Islamic exorcism

 

No errors nor contradictions in the Qur'an is also a good point 

 

I used one out of many example from point 2, Numerical programming of the Qur'an

 

Quran came trough prophet Muhammed wich was illitarate, could not read nor write, and then we see all these stuff in the Qur'an, for us these stuffs are evidence that Qur'an from God and not from humans.

 

Who could organise Quran like this only in his mind without any editing process, here is an example so you can understand why it is a miracle

 

Let say you need to do this:

 

You have to create such nummerical system only in your head, wihtout using, paper pen, computers or calculus, just only in your head

 

and your scribers write everything you say and if you say it once, you cant take it back, so there is no editing process.

Can you create such nummerical programing system in your book only in your mind? is it possible for any human to do something like this in his mind only? That is why this is a miracle, beacuse prophet Muhammed could not read or write, he did not have computers or calculus, when he recited quran verses his scribers wrote it down on different materials and there was no editing process except if scribers write and error and prophet corrects it when a scriber recite back to prphet to check that everything is written correctly. Do you understand now why this is a miracoulus book?

 

 

 

How have you moved from a detail that you cannot properly explain, to arguing that 'God must have done it'?
 
everything support that it comes from God, so my belief is based on that
 
when i see that people can create such structures in their minds without using any tools and can make future propechies in their book, then i shall stop believe that Qur'an is a miraclous book,. 

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Quran came trough prophet Muhammed wich was illitarate, could not read
nor write, and then we see all these stuff in the Qur'an, for us these
stuffs are evidence that Qur'an from God and not from humans.

 

Yes, I understand. Your position is this:

I cannot understand how the Quran contains such qualities, therefore, my God is real and the Quran is a miracle.

 

when i see that people can create such structures in their minds without
using any tools and can make future propechies in their book, then i
shall stop believe that Qur'an is a miraclous book,.

 

Okay. But before you do that. You will need to prove beyond a doubt, that Muhammed was as dumb as you say he was (and had no help in the matter).

That is the only way you can prove to me (& anyone else) that these are miracles: Find a way to logically prove the things you profess, without adopting a position out of ignorance.

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