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name='andalusi' timestamp='1347142000' post='1265212'

how can we understand 1+1+1=1 , impossible, i think i need to kill my all brain cells to understand it, even then i could not udnerstand it...

 

your christianity is totally illogical religion.

 

 

Illogical illogical. this is a go no where conversation. I'm illogical and you are hard hearted. So Unless this debate can prove to bear good fruit of some sort it is over. I will not waste time going over stuff we have already covered.

 

you need to have faith, do good deeds, stay away from evil deeds, follow all prophet of God, expesically Muhammed and God's book quran, and then you can hope for God's mercy to get you in the paradise

 

What pretell do you have faith in? Yes good deeds need to be performed but they will not save you and sin does need to be avoided. I will leave the part out for Muhammed as I do not see it as relevant but do respect it. And yes God's mercy is needed.

 

Now I am done with this discussion and with stick with the Roman Catholic Church. The Church Christ established. I see no further need for debait at this time as it is proving fruitless for either one of us.

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Illogical illogical. this is a go no where conversation. I'm illogical and you are hard hearted. So Unless this debate can prove to bear good fruit of some sort it is over. I will not waste time going over stuff we have already covered.

 

 

 

What pretell do you have faith in? Yes good deeds need to be performed but they will not save you and sin does need to be avoided. I will leave the part out for Muhammed as I do not see it as relevant but do respect it. And yes God's mercy is needed.

 

Now I am done with this discussion and with stick with the Roman Catholic Church. The Church Christ established. I see no further need for debait at this time as it is proving fruitless for either one of us.

 

Pretty sure Jesus said otherwise dear Paulinian:

 

John 14:21

John 14:23

John 15:10

1 John 2:3

 

And before you begin that new covenant b.s. you might want to consider:

 

Luke 16:17

 

Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Matthew 5:19

 

Perhaps a view of Luke 4:9-10 as Satan refers to the book of PSALMS as it pertains to the Messiah. The Psalms that he refers to it Psalms 91

 

In verse 16 of Psalms 91 ( premessianic age ) God offers salvation to the messiah....pretty odd if he had to be sacrificed for our sin.

 

I could keep going but I got homework to do.

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show me contradictions in Quran if you can find it....

There are so many lists of contradictions I can't even list the list here!

One of the best is as follows:

 

"Inconsistencies and Contradictions in the Quran

 

by Mohammad Zaidan

 

25/11/2005

 

Moslems claim that the Quran is a literal inspiration from God; word by word and letter by letter which means you cannot find any one mistake or contradiction since God does not commit any mistakes. But in 2:97 God says that it was Mohammad's heart that was inspired which implies inspired images not words since words are inspired to the mind. Actually nothing could be inspired to the heart since it lacks the mechanism of memory. Below you should find few of the contradictions and consistencies that do not befit the almighty God.

 

2:23. if you have doubts about our revelations to our servant ( Mohammad) call on your martyrs (Shohadaikum). It should be call on your partners ( Shorakaikum) as no one would call on the dead people to witness anything.

 

86:7 human sperms originate from between the back and the ribs, which contradicts the science of embryology which stresses that sperms originate from the testicles.

 

4: 78, 79. Verse 78 says that all actions good or evil come from God while the verse 79 says that good comes from God while evil comes from humans, an obvious contradiction.

 

37:139-145 Jona ( Younis) was ejected from the belly of the whale, while in 68:48-49 Jona was not ejected. Which is it ejected or not ejected?

 

2:6-7 God blinded the unbelievers as he closed their hearts, their vision and their hearing. Why would the loving God, who wanted everyone to believe, do that?

 

2:10 The kuffars are sick in their hearts and God increased their sickness. Is that logical that God would increase their sickness instead of healing them?

 

2: 264 God does not guide the Kuffars. Really? Isn't like the physician who would not treat the sick? Who needs guidance the believer or the unbeliever?

 

4:88 Do you want to guide those that God had misled? Is that possible that the all loving God would mislead His own creatures?

 

6:149 If God wished He would have guided all of you. Status quo proves then that God did not wish to guide all! Obviously he did not want everyone to believe.

 

13: 33 If God misleads his creature no one can guide them. Again is it possible that the most merciful not only misleads his creatures but He does not want anyone else to guide them.

 

14:4 God misleads whoever He wants and guide whoever He wants. Aren't we here witnessing God's racism when He is being selective in guidance?

 

91:8 God inspires humans their good and evil. If God, in His unlimited capability, inspires good and evil for all beings, then we are either doomed or saved right from the beginning and we have no other alternative. Repentance means nothing when such a decision was already made.

 

18:83-86 Zu-El Qarnin found out that the sun sets in a hole of murky water. Really? The sun which is so much larger than the earth would set in a murky hole on the same earth. Those who claim that such a statement is attributed only to Zu-Al Qarnin are easily debunked by the holy hadeeth where Mohammad confirms the setting of the sun in a hole of murky water to Abu-Darr.

 

23:12-14 in Quranic embryology a stage is reached when it becomes bones then the bones are dressed with flesh ! Ignoring of course that the two flesh and bones are developed simultaneously in humans.

 

17:1 Mohammad visited Al-Masjid Al-Aqsa. The problem is that there was no Masjid Al-Aqsa nor any other masjid during the life of Mohammad since Islam entered Palestine after Omar Bin El Khattab conquered Palestine after the death of the prophet. Al-Masjid Al-Aqsa was built almost sixty years after the death of Mohammad by Marwan bin Abdelmalik.

 

23:14 blessed Allah the best of all creators. How many creators do we have?

 

88: 20 The earth has been flattened. An obvious contradiction to simple science.

 

19:25 Shake the palm tree talking to Mary. First of all Bethlehem is a mountainous city where no palm trees grow anyway. Secondly dates from a palm tree mature in the summer time not the cold winter of December. Thirdly Christ was born in a manger. Fourthly it takes a superman to be able to shake the trunk of a palm tree.

 

5: 73 He blasphemes who says that God is one of three gods. Not defending Christianity, but no Christian claims that there are three gods. Obviously Mohammad was confused about the trinity which describes God as one with three different characters. Of course this claim is debatable.

 

31:10 God created the heavens and supported them with invisible pillars. Obviously Mohammad thought that the sky is nothing but some kind of a big tent which needs pillars to support it, but invisible (since we can't see them). One should wonder about the millions of airplanes that fly everywhere without bumping into them!

 

71:15-16 God created the seven stories heavens and made the moon as a source of light in these heavens. The earth could hardly be seen by any distant star within the first level of heaven, let alone its moon. How then the same moon would light up the environment in other levels when it could hardly be seen or light our first level of heavens?

 

The poor authors of tafseer could not come up with any credible explanations to any of the above, as they naively try in vain to unveil the above contradictions."

 

[Anti-Islamic website link removed by admin. Action taken against member.]

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[at]Padre5

I regret to see you get low to the level of quoting anti-Islamic sites known for spreading lies and ignorance. It would have been OK if you posted this asking us to correct you, but you're not asking, you're stating lies in the form of facts.

I just read the first claim, couldn't read such lies any further, Its pathetic to see that level of ignorance. For example, any grade-1 child knows that the Arabic word شهداءكم "shohadaikum" has 2 meanings:

1- your witnesses

2- your martyrs

The person you quoted purposely gave a wrong translation of verse 2:23

The correct meaning is:

And if you are in doubt about what We have sent down upon Our Servant [Muhammad], then produce a surah the like thereof and call upon your witnesses other than Allah , if you should be truthful.

http://quran.com/2/23

 

Just one example of the trash of lies that the author plays with his audience with, relying on their ignorance of the ABC of the Arabic language.

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Just one example of the trash of lies that the author plays with his audience with, relying on their ignorance of the ABC of the Arabic language.

 

As-salamu 'alaikum wa rahmatu Allahi wa barakatuh

 

I quickly scanned that list but I missed that part about verse 2:23. I have to admit that part had me shuckling a little bit. Yes, it is quite elementary.

 

I will let andalusi respond to the list since I believe it was he who asked Padre for a contradiction. I will chime in, God-willing, if necessary.

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There are so many lists of contradictions I can't even list the list here!

One of the best is as follows:

 

"Inconsistencies and Contradictions in the Quran

 

by Mohammad Zaidan

 

25/11/2005

 

Moslems claim that the Quran is a literal inspiration from God; word by word and letter by letter which means you cannot find any one mistake or contradiction since God does not commit any mistakes. But in 2:97 God says that it was Mohammad's heart that was inspired which implies inspired images not words since words are inspired to the mind. Actually nothing could be inspired to the heart since it lacks the mechanism of memory. Below you should find few of the contradictions and consistencies that do not befit the almighty God.

 

2:23. if you have doubts about our revelations to our servant ( Mohammad) call on your martyrs (Shohadaikum). It should be call on your partners ( Shorakaikum) as no one would call on the dead people to witness anything.

 

86:7 human sperms originate from between the back and the ribs, which contradicts the science of embryology which stresses that sperms originate from the testicles.

 

4: 78, 79. Verse 78 says that all actions good or evil come from God while the verse 79 says that good comes from God while evil comes from humans, an obvious contradiction.

 

37:139-145 Jona ( Younis) was ejected from the belly of the whale, while in 68:48-49 Jona was not ejected. Which is it ejected or not ejected?

 

2:6-7 God blinded the unbelievers as he closed their hearts, their vision and their hearing. Why would the loving God, who wanted everyone to believe, do that?

 

2:10 The kuffars are sick in their hearts and God increased their sickness. Is that logical that God would increase their sickness instead of healing them?

 

2: 264 God does not guide the Kuffars. Really? Isn't like the physician who would not treat the sick? Who needs guidance the believer or the unbeliever?

 

4:88 Do you want to guide those that God had misled? Is that possible that the all loving God would mislead His own creatures?

 

6:149 If God wished He would have guided all of you. Status quo proves then that God did not wish to guide all! Obviously he did not want everyone to believe.

 

13: 33 If God misleads his creature no one can guide them. Again is it possible that the most merciful not only misleads his creatures but He does not want anyone else to guide them.

 

14:4 God misleads whoever He wants and guide whoever He wants. Aren't we here witnessing God's racism when He is being selective in guidance?

 

91:8 God inspires humans their good and evil. If God, in His unlimited capability, inspires good and evil for all beings, then we are either doomed or saved right from the beginning and we have no other alternative. Repentance means nothing when such a decision was already made.

 

18:83-86 Zu-El Qarnin found out that the sun sets in a hole of murky water. Really? The sun which is so much larger than the earth would set in a murky hole on the same earth. Those who claim that such a statement is attributed only to Zu-Al Qarnin are easily debunked by the holy hadeeth where Mohammad confirms the setting of the sun in a hole of murky water to Abu-Darr.

 

23:12-14 in Quranic embryology a stage is reached when it becomes bones then the bones are dressed with flesh ! Ignoring of course that the two flesh and bones are developed simultaneously in humans.

 

17:1 Mohammad visited Al-Masjid Al-Aqsa. The problem is that there was no Masjid Al-Aqsa nor any other masjid during the life of Mohammad since Islam entered Palestine after Omar Bin El Khattab conquered Palestine after the death of the prophet. Al-Masjid Al-Aqsa was built almost sixty years after the death of Mohammad by Marwan bin Abdelmalik.

 

23:14 blessed Allah the best of all creators. How many creators do we have?

 

88: 20 The earth has been flattened. An obvious contradiction to simple science.

 

19:25 Shake the palm tree talking to Mary. First of all Bethlehem is a mountainous city where no palm trees grow anyway. Secondly dates from a palm tree mature in the summer time not the cold winter of December. Thirdly Christ was born in a manger. Fourthly it takes a superman to be able to shake the trunk of a palm tree.

 

5: 73 He blasphemes who says that God is one of three gods. Not defending Christianity, but no Christian claims that there are three gods. Obviously Mohammad was confused about the trinity which describes God as one with three different characters. Of course this claim is debatable.

 

31:10 God created the heavens and supported them with invisible pillars. Obviously Mohammad thought that the sky is nothing but some kind of a big tent which needs pillars to support it, but invisible (since we can't see them). One should wonder about the millions of airplanes that fly everywhere without bumping into them!

 

71:15-16 God created the seven stories heavens and made the moon as a source of light in these heavens. The earth could hardly be seen by any distant star within the first level of heaven, let alone its moon. How then the same moon would light up the environment in other levels when it could hardly be seen or light our first level of heavens?

 

The poor authors of tafseer could not come up with any credible explanations to any of the above, as they naively try in vain to unveil the above contradictions."

 

[Anti-Islamic website link removed by admin. Action taken against member.]

 

you are really disspointment, man, i thought you were smarter than this, copying from anti-islamic sites, nothing from that is true man, why dont you find for yourself if that is true what they say, those are just lies and missunderstandings of quranic verses.

 

why dont you read quran and try to find mistakes in it instead of searching on anti-islamic sites who spread propaganda against Islam??

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23:14 blessed Allah the best of all creators. How many creators do we have?

 

just look at this stupidity, how many creators i can say millions or maybe billions of creators

 

humans and animals are creator

 

who is creator of this? God or humans?

BMW_SX_concept.jpg

humans

 

who is creator of this, God or ants?

_55488495_turrets.jpg

ants build nest-ventilating turrets

 

who is creator of this God or bees?

beehive600.jpg

 

 

who is creator of this God or birds?

birds-nest.jpg

birds

 

 

what can we say after all this, there are billions of creators, but our narrow minded atheists try to make error of it making fun of themselves as i clearly show to you all how weak atheistic arguments are against Islam....they can be beaten easy, so easy like drinking glas of water

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Well lets start with the basics. How many books does that Bible have you quoted from?

 

i use this bible site, with different translation

http://bible.cc/

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Illogical illogical. this is a go no where conversation. I'm illogical and you are hard hearted. So Unless this debate can prove to bear good fruit of some sort it is over. I will not waste time going over stuff we have already covered.

 

 

 

What pretell do you have faith in? Yes good deeds need to be performed but they will not save you and sin does need to be avoided. I will leave the part out for Muhammed as I do not see it as relevant but do respect it. And yes God's mercy is needed.

 

Now I am done with this discussion and with stick with the Roman Catholic Church. The Church Christ established. I see no further need for debait at this time as it is proving fruitless for either one of us.

 

Illogical illogical.

 

yes, when someone say to me 2+2=1 or special mystical christian mathematical formula 1+1+1=1 , then i say it is illogical.

 

 

What pretell do you have faith in? Yes good deeds need to be performed but they will not save you and sin does need to be avoided. I will leave the part out for Muhammed as I do not see it as relevant but do respect it. And yes God's mercy is needed.

 

faith in God, angels, prophets, hereafter, judgment day, hell , paradise.

 

I will leave the part out for Muhammed as I do not see it as relevant but do respect it.

 

of course it is relevant beacuse jesus clearly said that prophet will come after him, spirit of truth, wich will guide people into all truth.

that is what muhammed did, and you deny that, and you will be responsible for that on the day of judgement.

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working man here is questions for you

 

Are we born with sins? Can we go to paradise with sins?

And what happend with people before jesus came to earth, where did they go to hell or paradise?

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so i dont think so that it is different jesus, it is only different interpretation of who jesus was, christian say son of God and God, while muslims say he was prophet from God like other prophets before him.

Part of the Godhead is by no means comparable to a prophet, we are talking of 2 completely different Jesus' here, and I think you know it.

Simple example, Koran Chapter 19 describes the first miracle of your jesus, whereas the Bible describes a completely different occasion for Jesus Christ (John 2 - pay particular attention to 2:11 please). Now both cannot be correct, one of them is wrong. I am not willing to argue which is correct, however I am willing to argue that as Muslims, you beleive in a different Jesus to Christians.

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Part of the Godhead is by no means comparable to a prophet, we are talking of 2 completely different Jesus' here, and I think you know it.

Simple example, Koran Chapter 19 describes the first miracle of your jesus, whereas the Bible describes a completely different occasion for Jesus Christ (John 2 - pay particular attention to 2:11 please). Now both cannot be correct, one of them is wrong. I am not willing to argue which is correct, however I am willing to argue that as Muslims, you beleive in a different Jesus to Christians.

 

where does jesus say in bible that he is part of Godhead? if he was God, then it qwould mean that Jesus is God and his father is God also, 2 gods, then you are not monotheistic relgion anymore.

 

and by the way, Is Jesus the father?

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Padre, I will address your post regarding contradictions.

 

Well I believe dot already explained the first one regarding verse 2:23. To reiterate, the verse says call on your witnesses, not your "matyrs". It is such a simple thing that little school kids who speak Arabic would not need this explained to them or rather could explain it to you.

 

As 86:7, I think the point is quite moot. What the Qur'an says is that semen originates between the front and the back. Nothing unscientific about that. If you want a much more articulate answer to this, you can read the following: http://www.understanding-Islam.com/q-and-a/miscellaneous-issues/does-semen-emanate-from-between-the-ribs-and-the-back-al-taariq-86-6-7-4836 It has illustrations. I believe that article would suit you well.

 

" 4: 78, 79. Verse 78 says that all actions good or evil come from God while the verse 79 says that good comes from God while evil comes from humans, an obvious contradiction."

 

Obviously this verse has got a context. It is not that hard to understand. Read the following exegesis on those verses and things will become clear to you, God-willing: http://www.qtafsir.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=630&Itemid=59

 

Verses like this obviously have more a metaphysical meaning behind them and it takes a bit of wisdom, but not a lot though, to understand these.

 

" 37:139-145 Jona ( Younis) was ejected from the belly of the whale, while in 68:48-49 Jona was not ejected. Which is it ejected or not ejected?"

 

Read the actual verses. Both say that Jonah (pbuh) did not remain in the belly of the fish. Only a person with reading comprehension issues would come up with an idea that he remained in its belly.

 

A lot of the verses you quoted talked about God misguiding disbelievers. To understand the verses, you must understand the Arabic word used in it. Kaafir means somebody who rejects the Truth. Some people seem to confused regarding those verses and blame God for being astray. The fact is though that those people are misguided by God since they don't want to follow the Truth. They reject it when it comes to them and thus God sends them astray.

 

(10:99). And had your Lord willed, those on earth would have believed, all of them together. So, will you then compel mankind, until they become believers.

 

God could guide everybody against their will. However, He will not do that. He guides those who believe and accept the Truth and what it entails. As for those who don't accept the Truth and reject guidance, they get misguided.

 

"91:8 God inspires humans their good and evil. If God, in His unlimited capability, inspires good and evil for all beings, then we are either doomed or saved right from the beginning and we have no other alternative. Repentance means nothing when such a decision was already made."

 

Truly he succeeds that purifies it, And he fails that corrupts it! (91:9-10)

 

These are the verses that follow the above verse. Obviously you can do something about the affair. You have personal responsibility.

 

"18:83-86 Zu-El Qarnin found out that the sun sets in a hole of murky water. Really? The sun which is so much larger than the earth would set in a murky hole on the same earth. Those who claim that such a statement is attributed only to Zu-Al Qarnin are easily debunked by the holy hadeeth where Mohammad confirms the setting of the sun in a hole of murky water to Abu-Darr."

 

This is quite easy explained by the fact that it talks about what Dhul Qarnain saw. The verse is not general. Had the Qur'an said that the Sun sets in a muddy spring as a general statement that would be problematic. The Prophet (pbuh) did not tell Abu Dharr (ra) that the Sun sets in a murky water.

 

" 23:12-14 in Quranic embryology a stage is reached when it becomes bones then the bones are dressed with flesh ! Ignoring of course that the two flesh and bones are developed simultaneously in humans."

 

Actually this is wrong: http://www.miraclesofthequran.com/scientific_57.html

 

" 17:1 Mohammad visited Al-Masjid Al-Aqsa. The problem is that there was no Masjid Al-Aqsa nor any other masjid during the life of Mohammad since Islam entered Palestine after Omar Bin El Khattab conquered Palestine after the death of the prophet. Al-Masjid Al-Aqsa was built almost sixty years after the death of Mohammad by Marwan bin Abdelmalik."

 

http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Quran/Contrad/External/aqsa.html

 

" 88: 20 The earth has been flattened. An obvious contradiction to simple science"

 

The Arabic word "Ard" means both Earth, land and ground. The ground has been flattened for us humans to make it inhabitable. It is obvious the verse talks about the ground since the previous verse talks about mountains:

 

(19. And at the mountains, how they are rooted) (20. And at the earth, how it is outspread)

 

" 19:25 Shake the palm tree talking to Mary. First of all Bethlehem is a mountainous city where no palm trees grow anyway. Secondly dates from a palm tree mature in the summer time not the cold winter of December. Thirdly Christ was born in a manger. Fourthly it takes a superman to be able to shake the trunk of a palm tree."

 

Who says that it was at Bethlehem? Who says that the birth happened in December? Who says he was born in a manger? Muslims don't take the Bible as an authoritative source of information on Mary and Jesus (pbuh). Granted it takes a superman to shake the trunk of a palm tree. In short, it was a miracle provided to Mary (pbuh).

 

"31:10 God created the heavens and supported them with invisible pillars. Obviously Mohammad thought that the sky is nothing but some kind of a big tent which needs pillars to support it, but invisible (since we can't see them). One should wonder about the millions of airplanes that fly everywhere without bumping into them!"

 

(He has created the heavens without any pillars) Al-Hasan and Qatadah said, "It does not have any pillars, visible or invisible.'' http://www.qtafsir.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1793 These men were the Companions and the successors - who obviously did not live in an era of airplanes.

 

"71:15-16 God created the seven stories heavens and made the moon as a source of light in these heavens. The earth could hardly be seen by any distant star within the first level of heaven, let alone its moon. How then the same moon would light up the environment in other levels when it could hardly be seen or light our first level of heavens?"

 

Who says that the Moon can be seen throughout the seven Heavens? Nobody. What the verse means is that the Moon is within the seven Heavens. If I say the Moon is a part of outer space, does it mean its seen throughout the whole outer space? I don't think so.

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Padre, more could be written on those topics. The answers could be more articulate but let's keep in mind that the list of "contradictions" was a copy paste job.

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working man here is questions for you

 

Are we born with sins? Can we go to paradise with sins?

And what happend with people before jesus came to earth, where did they go to hell or paradise?

 

We are born with original sin. Here is a link to Original sin. There is alot of info http://www./cathen/11312a.htm

 

The short answer is no one can not go to heaven with sin.

 

Now question three is a little difficlult to answer. Those who had hear God's word and followed it will be in heaven Adam, Noha, Abriham, ect... and those that followed with them). Those who had never heard God's word or the message one can only speculate. My personal belief is that one who is completly ignorant of God's word but lives a just and moral life should be in heaven. But only God knows the answer to that. Those who heard God's word, prophets, and warnings yet did not heed them most likly will be in hell suffering punishment and eternal sepperation from God. Only God knows for sure and it is not my place to judge.

 

I have a feeling when we pass to the other side and stand in judgment we will be surprised at who is where.

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where does jesus say in bible that he is part of Godhead? if he was God, then it qwould mean that Jesus is God and his father is God also, 2 gods, then you are not monotheistic relgion anymore.

 

and by the way, Is Jesus the father?

 

Understandably you don't accept the concept of the Trinity because you believe in a different God, which is precisely what my point has been all along!

Islam and Christianity are not compatable, however much effort on the Islamic side is spent trying to convince Christians that they are. Please stop wasting both ours and your own time trying to fudge a religion to align with the other - it's insulting for all parties.

As for the Trinity, here's a good summary of it:-

 

The doctrine of the Trinityis this: there is one God who exists in three distinct persons: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Each person is not the same as the other person; that is, the Father is not the same person as the Son who is not the same person as the Holy Spirit. But, each is fully divine in nature. Each person is not a god which would make three gods. Instead, the totality of all three persons comprises the one God. Again, the Trinity does not teach that there are three gods. The Trinity is monotheistic since it is the doctrine that only one God exists in all space and time. Christians believe there are no partners with God because we believe there is only one God in all existence.

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wrong cheeseboy.... not only is it the same God but if you find a copy of a Gideon Bible and look at the verse in the front of John 3:16 you will see the word Allah in the arabic translation. Its a different god but Arab Christians use the term for the Christian god? Do you call your Arab brothers in Christianity fake as well?

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Allah is an Arabic word meaning God.

The God of the Bible is a different God to the god of the Koran.

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There is only one God, and that is Allah. Christians, Jews, Muslims all serve the same God. To say otherwise is foolishness at best. As for the trinity, who came up with the idea of the trinity, since you are quite knowledgeable about it according to your own words? Not all Christians even believe in the trinity, and in fact, Peter never once uttered the trinity in any of his teachings and writings.

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Peter never once uttered the trinity in any of his teachings and writings.

 

The word “theocracy” is not in the Old Testament but the implication is there. Your reasoning isn’t very practical.

Edited by CarlosTheJackal

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There is only one God, and that is Allah. Christians, Jews, Muslims all serve the same God. To say otherwise is foolishness at best. As for the trinity, who came up with the idea of the trinity, since you are quite knowledgeable about it according to your own words? Not all Christians even believe in the trinity, and in fact, Peter never once uttered the trinity in any of his teachings and writings.

 

But It's quite obvious from all the back and fourths on this forum that we don't serve the same God! As Muslims you reject the concept of the Trinity (by the way Peter makes reference to the Father, son and Holy spirit in 1st Peter 1:2) and therefore make yourselfs incompatable with Christianity. It's as plain as that. Make your choice, either the Bible is wrong or the Koran is wrong - both cannot be correct.

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We are born with original sin. Here is a link to Original sin. There is alot of info http://www.newadvent...then/11312a.htm

 

The short answer is no one can not go to heaven with sin.

 

Now question three is a little difficlult to answer. Those who had hear God's word and followed it will be in heaven Adam, Noha, Abriham, ect... and those that followed with them). Those who had never heard God's word or the message one can only speculate. My personal belief is that one who is completly ignorant of God's word but lives a just and moral life should be in heaven. But only God knows the answer to that. Those who heard God's word, prophets, and warnings yet did not heed them most likly will be in hell suffering punishment and eternal sepperation from God. Only God knows for sure and it is not my place to judge.

 

I have a feeling when we pass to the other side and stand in judgment we will be surprised at who is where.

 

 

We are born with original sin.

 

this proves why christianity is not the true relgion, why it is illogical and it is not fair.

 

why should we be born with sin beacuse Adam and eve ate the fruit? did they asked us before they ate it? NO, so how can sin be upon us? this is great, that you show to people how weak and illogical christian belief is. According to Islam, every child is born without sin.

 

 

We are born with original sin.

The short answer is no one can not go to heaven with sin.

 

this is not true according to your bible and jesus

 

proof

 

 

Read Matthew 19:14 for proof that the children are born without

sin.

 

Matthew 19:14 Jesus said, "Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these."

 

this proofs that you christian cant even interpretate your own holy book, jesus say children go to Paradise, in other words they have no sins, and there is no orginal sin like you claim. but as i said before, you like to complicate your relgion and make it illogical. you know what, that is good for us that you complicate your own relgion so much then when people see how logical Islam is, they will come to Islam instead of following book where God is a barber who shaves people's legs and rides little baby girl angels like helicopter.

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Allah is an Arabic word meaning God.

The God of the Bible is a different God to the god of the Koran.

 

not true, it is same God, but your interpretation of God is wrong

 

God of bible and quran is Allah, yahweh means "O He"

 

evidence here

 

Look what christian scholar say:

 

http://en.allexperts.com/q/Bible-Stu...08/2/Alaha.htm

 

So what if Jesus cried "Alaha" as He suffered and died? Mohammed hadn't invented Islam yet. Jesus, historically and biblically, was totally and utterly Jewish (Josephus, the Jewish historian called Him a "Rabbi" who had many disciples). And Aramaic was the language of the day. Big deal, Jesus cried "Alaha."

 

Sincerely,

 

Marilyn

 

 

even in bible God is Allah, look for yourself

 

6thBeatitude.png

 

The sixth beatitude (Matthew 5: from an East Syriac Peshitta.

Ṭûḇayhôn l'aylên daḏkên b-lebbhôn: d-hennôn neḥzôn l'alāhâ.

'Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.

 

from english bible

islam-bible-allah-scofielda.jpg

 

allahinot.jpg

 

 

Below is a page from Genesis in the Arabic Bible where the name Allah is underlined in Red:

Allah%20in%20Arabic%20Bible.png

The first line of the above passage translates as:

"In the beginning Allah created the heaven and the earth."

 

Jesus called God Allah

 

A israeli jew say that Allah is God of israel

 

A christian priest prayer to Allah in aramaic, language of jesus

 

this is how you shall provide evidence for your claims instead , i think this i think that....there is no use if you dont provide evidence for your claims

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this proves why christianity is not the true relgion, why it is illogical and it is not fair.

 

why should we be born with sin beacuse Adam and eve ate the fruit? did they asked us before they ate it? NO, so how can sin be upon us? this is great, that you show to people how weak and illogical christian belief is. According to Islam, every child is born without sin.

 

It makes perfect sense why we need a saviour and why Jesus came.

 

Actually it proves how illogical Islam is; Allah forgives you of sin without the proper atonement due for sin. Your god is not a just god although you claim him to be which is a clear contradiction...that’s illogical my friend.

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Understandably you don't accept the concept of the Trinity because you believe in a different God, which is precisely what my point has been all along!

Islam and Christianity are not compatable, however much effort on the Islamic side is spent trying to convince Christians that they are. Please stop wasting both ours and your own time trying to fudge a religion to align with the other - it's insulting for all parties.

As for the Trinity, here's a good summary of it:-

 

The doctrine of the Trinityis this: there is one God who exists in three distinct persons: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Each person is not the same as the other person; that is, the Father is not the same person as the Son who is not the same person as the Holy Spirit. But, each is fully divine in nature. Each person is not a god which would make three gods. Instead, the totality of all three persons comprises the one God. Again, the Trinity does not teach that there are three gods. The Trinity is monotheistic since it is the doctrine that only one God exists in all space and time. Christians believe there are no partners with God because we believe there is only one God in all existence.

 

if you know so much about this trinity, tell me , if father, son and holy spirit are same in this trinity ideology.

 

are father and son equal? like this father = son?

 

if not, then how does it fit into trinity if they are not same?

 

 

there is one God who exists in three distinct persons: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

 

verse about trinity is fabrication , eminent christian scholars throw it out from revised stanadard version of the bible 1952.

 

and by the way, if trinity is true, it can never been understood, 1+1+1=1, there will be allways 3 distinctive picture in your mind , when i say son , you will think of young man, with beard, long hair...jesus, when i say holy spirit, you think of a dove, and father a big old daddy above skies.

 

Ahmad Deedat explain about Trinity in Christian Religion

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